5w-20 and engine longevity

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? all the reports i've read oil has thickened with use. if they get thinner please give me an example. so if they get thicker and the motor calls for 5w30 and i start with a 5w20 over say 10-15K miles wouldnt it be right there at the start specs. and be good for another 10K miles.
is their any negatives to running the 20wt ?

the reports i've read i.e. 10W40 tested to be 15w50 personally never seen one go thinner.
 
You guys worry too much 20wts are awesome oils, the rest of the viscosities should be as good. I recently changed jobs and had occasion to drive a beat up power stroke diesel with 130,000 miles on the clock. Immagine my surprise when I looked at the oil change sticker from the local oil change place and read "cas5w20" I can't help but wonder how in heaven that engine did not grenade. It had almost 5,000 miles of off road use and heavy towing since the sticker had been put on. I'm not saying its safe to use 5w20 in a power stroke, but its a testimonial to the stoutness of the oil that the engine is still running well...at least I'm amazed...like I said, you all worry too much about that 5w20. Man, I'd love to pull a sample for testing from that truck.
 
I have an '03 f-150, v-6 with 73,000 miles. OCI's have averaged about 5000-6000 miles with Motorcraft 5w-20 and FL-400 filter each time. Admittedly have gone over that a couple of times. I pull a horse trailer with 2 horses approx. 110 miles almost every Sunday, and that is over the tow rating of the truck. Also use the truck to haul farm supplies and drive 60 miles round trip to work each day in the city. I have never had to add a quart of oil to this truck.

Let's see.... improved fuel efficiency, reduced emmissions, fantastic UOA's, cheap oil, hmmmmm. Sounds like 5w-20 was a good idea all the way around!
 
The 5w-20's have been putting up outstanding numbers. I wish we had a spreasheet that calculated all wear among all oils on a ppm basis. I'd be willing to bet the 20wts come out on top!
 
quote:
Originally posted by z917990:
Thank you for your responses. Although all of the theoretical information and your opinions are appreciated, I still wonder if there are any people who have engines with over 100,000 miles using 5w-20, either dino or synthetic. To me, the best proof of the viability (or lack thereof)of this oil is the actual longevity of the engine i.e "real world" experience, not tests done in a lab. I'm not an engineer or a chemist, so much of the technical information is lost on me. Bottom line: does this stuff work or not? Thanks.
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A buddy of mine has an '02 Ford E-350 1 ton service van w/ the big v8 ( 5.4l?) that has logged over 120k miles using only Motorcraft 5w/20 and Motorcraft oil filters changed every 5k since new. No problems, still runs great, and he beats the crap out of that truck.
 
quote:
Originally posted by 1999nick:

quote:
Originally posted by Steve S:

quote:
Originally posted by 1999nick:


Who wants a car to last 400,000 miles, anyway? That is 20 years at 20,000 miles a year. What would the rest of the car look like, inside and out?
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I do ,my 92 toyota p/u has about 113,500 miles ,in 30 more years maybe the odometer will hit 400,000
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In 30 more years, I will be 99 years old.
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I'll only be 82 years old.
 
quote:
Originally posted by darkdan:
We have the modular motor one. Right click and save as:

http://www.dantheoilman.com/modular.xls

Some UOAs were excluded. Auto-rx phases, home brews of 5w20s/5w30s, ones with really whack wear, motors that were clearly still breaking-in.
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The first time I downloaded this, I misinterpreted it. I didn't really pay attention to the numbers. Now I see that it's miles per PPM of wear, backwards of how I personally think about stuff like this. I would have set it up as PPM wear per mile. Whatever.

It shows pretty clearly less wear with heavier oils for the given sample. It also agrees with my latest uoa. 5w30 showed less wear on my v10 than 5w20 or 0w20.

I averaged wear for iron for each oil viscosity listed. Miles per PPM of wear, larger number is better:

0w20 --- 217.81
5w20 --- 528.99
0w30 --- 614.24
5w30 --- 828.61
10w30 --- 1967.45
5w40 --- 271.17
10w40 --- 3554.60

and here are the averages for aluminum (more important to me, bearings...)

0w20 --- 891.02
5w20 --- 2257.84
0w30 --- 2762.26
5w30 --- 2818.12
10w30 --- 4243.14
5w40 --- 1350.04
10w40 --- 8886.50

5w40 only had 2 samples, and 10w4 only had one, so they could be thrown out.

I guess the question is, does it make a difference in the life of the motor over my lifetime? I'm young, and with gas prices the way they are, the engine should last me till I die with either one. I think I'll be running 10w30 next time to see what I get.

In 30 years it'll cost a grand to fill up the tank. I'll be 60.

Eric

[ September 07, 2005, 04:44 AM: Message edited by: Etcetera ]
 
You can only compare numbers for cars that were driven in similar climates. Most of the 0w30's and 0w20's were probably taken during winter, when wear is always higher no matter what oil you use.
 
Why would it be that most of those were taken in winter? According to Ford 5w20 is good year round.
I've run 0w20 and 0w30 not during the winter, although my truck has only seen below freezing a couple times.

Even if you throw them out because they MIGHT be winter use, 10w30 still beats 5w20.

Lot's of guys run the same oil all the time.

Eric
 
Keep in mind....my spreadsheet isn't a study. It wasn't an experiment.

It's REAL results that REAL people got. On AVERAGE REAL people got better results with 5w30 regardless of brand, oil design, climate, etc.

"What ifs" don't change the REAL results.

So on AVERAGE the AVERAGE person with the AVERAGE 4.6L/5.4L/6.8L engines will AVERAGE better wear with something thicker then 5w30.

Hey, people win in Vegas...so sometimes you can beat the odds and get stellar results with 5w20. If you do...stick with it.
 
My patrol car is a 2001 Crown Vic with 168K on the odometer. It has received Motorcraft 5w20 and a Wix filter every 3500 to 3000 miles. The first couple of years the Motorcraft oil was the non semi syn in the black bottles. It uses absolutely no oil in between change intervals and it still runs strong. The transmission is another story since it has been replaced once. Each deputy gets a new car every six years and it will be 2007 before I get another one.
 
IF you read several of the articles posted on this forum, you'd see that all of the auto makers calling for a 5w-20 have rigorously tested the oils in these engines before making their selection. Dodge tested the Hemi on 20wt, 30wt, 40wt and 50wt oils and chose a 5w-20. Ford did the same. Unless your smarter or know something they don't, I wouldn't worry to much about it.

*Buzzsaw, are their any known engine failures due to 5w-20's that you know of?
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Maybe, but my own tests on the last few changes are in line with the averages listed. 0w20 was the worst, 5w30 was the best, by a large margin. I haven't run 10w30 yet. The weather here is relatively constant, at least compared to canada. Most samples that I've tested were in use for close to a year anyways.

Why do you use 10w30 in the summer? My guess is because you feel it protects better. I could definetely see 5w20 or 0w20 or 30 protecting better in extreme cold. Lots of my relatives in Minnesota run 5w30 year round. Never tested any of them, but they fall apart from the rust long before an engine wears out.

Eric
 
quote:
Originally posted by cyclic:
DO you think the Manafacturer's just sat around and said "lets use 5w20" without testing it for hundreds of thousand miles?

The oil will hold up fine.
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Actually, it was more like, "CAFE says that we need to get more MPG across the board to offset our (Expedition, Yukon, RumbleBee- you can fill in the blank). What can we do? Mr. Beancounter says, well we can't do a major redesign of the fuel system, it would be too much money! Mr. Engineer says, well we could reprogram the ECU again, but it would effect overall drivability, and we may take a hit from Car and Driver, or Motor Trend, and it could impact the bottom line. At this point the janitor says "lets use 5w20", and the rest as they say is history. The same engines in other countries do not recommend 5w20, and if you tow, overheat, or neglect the oil, a 5w20 may NOT be your best choice. My .02...
 
quote:
Originally posted by beanoil:

quote:
Originally posted by cyclic:
DO you think the Manafacturer's just sat around and said "lets use 5w20" without testing it for hundreds of thousand miles?

The oil will hold up fine.
Click to expand...
Actually, it was more like, "CAFE says that we need to get more MPG across the board to offset our (Expedition, Yukon, RumbleBee- you can fill in the blank). What can we do? Mr. Beancounter says, well we can't do a major redesign of the fuel system, it would be too much money! Mr. Engineer says, well we could reprogram the ECU again, but it would effect overall drivability, and we may take a hit from Car and Driver, or Motor Trend, and it could impact the bottom line. At this point the janitor says "lets use 5w20", and the rest as they say is history. The same engines in other countries do not recommend 5w20, and if you tow, overheat, or neglect the oil, a 5w20 may NOT be your best choice. My .02...
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Flags go up with me whenever I see "Use Only Where Applicable" ... or something worded very similar on the back of some 5W-20 jugs.

Yes... the stuff works fine "where applicable". But no warranty will cover engine damage with it for hot-rodding. I trust some hot-rodding with 5-30/10-30... even 0W-30.... but not 5-20.... especially dino.

If you are a heavy pedal driver/left lane in the highway-type..... you need to beef it up with a quart or two of something thicker. It's very difficult to "read" your engine properly with 5-20 on-board where it doesn't apply. Your engine life may drop from 300K to 200K with 5-20 and you won't never know it/have a clue what's going on while driving it the first 100K.

That's why dealers will recommend it so easily. A majority of folks sell their vehicles before 100K.

These are my opinions.... take it with a grain of salt.
 
My company vehicle is a 2003 Ford Winstar 3.8 engine with 85800 miles of hard use.The oil and filter are changed every 5k miles using Castrol GTX 5w20. I have noticed no oil consumption or oil related problems.

Use a good quality oil and filter with 5k oci's and enjoy the vehicle.
 
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