2025 ES 350 F-Sport brakes

[Titan]

This is my "retirement car", bought to run long distances visiting family, exploring, etc. For a front-wheel drive sedan, it's very good. The only thing I don't like is the brake system. I had larger rear rotors on my JCW Mini Countryman than what is on the front of this ES 350. No way was this car meant to replace the much higher-performance Mini, but, dang...the ES brakes are not inspiring at all. I would think one high-speed stop would be enough to heat them up to the point they'd fade. I've looked for larger caliper/rotor upgrades, and haven't found any. I guess owners of this car aren't those likely to ask for this kind of upgrade...but I'm just getting older, not necessarily slowing down so much. Any recommendations on what to try? Different pads? I would think pads that have more bite will also create more dust? That would be fine with me, I can wash the dust off...I'd just like the somewhat sporty-looking car to perform a bit more sporty, if possible.

 

[Jetronic]

pads with more bite don't reduce the heat build-up. pads rated for more heat could help, but you could end up with poor brakes when cold (as in first stop in a while).

 

[JoelB]

I'm guessing you'll have a hard time making more than a small difference in brake feel. It's not a sports car and the brakes are designed to be super smooth and quite.

 

[AKhan87]

PowerStop Z23s is what I run in my ES350s for this exact reason, both front and rear but I use OEM rotors as they are the best I have found, and no I am not interested in drilled or slotted rotors.

just get your OEM rotors resurfaced each time you do a brake job (I have found places that do it for $10-15 per rotor), OEM rotors on these can easily be resurfaced 3-4 times from my experience.

 

[dnewton3]

I don't believe the model generation (2019-current) of F Sport brakes on an ES are any different than a "normal" ES. IOW, they suck. That is one of the disappointments I had with my 2023 Ultra Lux model. The F Sport models do get a slightly sportier suspension system with active dampers, etc. But the brakes are just the common variety and they leave a lot to be desired.

My wife's 2013 ES350 has options for "severe service" brakes via several of the aftermarket places like AZ, AAP, Napa, etc. I presume that's because that generation of ES (2013-18) was based on the Camry/Avalon, which were seen in Taxi service. So the aftermarket stepped up and made some "better" brake rotors and pads. When her car is due, I'm going to upgrade to the severe service parts. I did this a while back with my 2018 Taurus and it made a world of difference. Not so much in stopping power, but in resistance to heat fade and warping rotors.

 

[edyvw]

I'm guessing you'll have a hard time making more than a small difference in brake feel. It's not a sports car and the brakes are designed to be super smooth and quite.

And yet it comes with 300hp.
ES on a straight line can go very fast, however, it is a classic Toyota thing where they put absolutely junk brakes.

 

[edyvw]

This is my "retirement car", bought to run long distances visiting family, exploring, etc. For a front-wheel drive sedan, it's very good. The only thing I don't like is the brake system. I had larger rear rotors on my JCW Mini Countryman than what is on the front of this ES 350. No way was this car meant to replace the much higher-performance Mini, but, dang...the ES brakes are not inspiring at all. I would think one high-speed stop would be enough to heat them up to the point they'd fade. I've looked for larger caliper/rotor upgrades, and haven't found any. I guess owners of this car aren't those likely to ask for this kind of upgrade...but I'm just getting older, not necessarily slowing down so much. Any recommendations on what to try? Different pads? I would think pads that have more bite will also create more dust? That would be fine with me, I can wash the dust off...I'd just like the somewhat sporty-looking car to perform a bit more sporty, if possible.

If Pagid has regular pads (not SIlver) it will provide better feel.
I would go EBC rotors and their EBC Red Stuff if no Pagid. Does 2025 has different brakes from previous models?
I just checked, front rotor is 305mm. That is absolutely insane on such vehicle! I know Toyota and good brakes don't go in the same sentence, but this is really pushing it.

 

[97prizm]

This is my "retirement car", bought to run long distances visiting family, exploring, etc. For a front-wheel drive sedan, it's very good. The only thing I don't like is the brake system. I had larger rear rotors on my JCW Mini Countryman than what is on the front of this ES 350. No way was this car meant to replace the much higher-performance Mini, but, dang...the ES brakes are not inspiring at all. I would think one high-speed stop would be enough to heat them up to the point they'd fade. I've looked for larger caliper/rotor upgrades, and haven't found any. I guess owners of this car aren't those likely to ask for this kind of upgrade...but I'm just getting older, not necessarily slowing down so much. Any recommendations on what to try? Different pads? I would think pads that have more bite will also create more dust? That would be fine with me, I can wash the dust off...I'd just like the somewhat sporty-looking car to perform a bit more sporty, if possible.

When I worked for a Lexus Dealership years ago I was disappointed when I found out that the F Sport models didn't get any HP and torque increases which was a huge mistake by Lexus. I think it shares the same platform as the Camry. They make a TRD version, are the brake rotors any larger on those? I'd also look to see if the rc350 rotors might fit, but it's twd/awd not fwd.

 

[edyvw]

When I worked for a Lexus Dealership years ago I was disappointed when I found out that the F Sport models didn't get any HP and torque increases which was a huge mistake by Lexus. I think it shares the same platform as the Camry. They make a TRD version, are the brake rotors any larger on those? I'd also look to see if the rc350 rotors might fit, but it's twd/awd not fwd.

That would require different knuckles and calipers. No way that can be done. Front rotor on RC350 is 334mm, this one is 305mm.
Best bet is EBC rotors+Red STuff pads.

 

[Titan]

I just checked, front rotor is 305mm. That is absolutely insane on such vehicle! I know Toyota and good brakes don't go in the same sentence, but this is really pushing it.

Yeah, like I said, the JCW Countryman Mini in my picture has 330 rotors on the REAR! 305s on the front of the ES 350 is at least inadequate, to be nice.