2017 Civic 2.0 NA, Timing Chain Fail @ 70K Miles

[KrisZ]

But there are a lot of these engines out there that get 8 to 10k intervals and many of them are doing short trips too. If that was the problem I would be hearing about a lot of timing chain issues and I’m not

We can only speculate since OP is quite vague about the maintenance history.

Many people mentioned defective parts, well if that was the case we would also hear about it since so many of them were produced. Somehow people have an easier time accepting this, not sure why.

It’s clearly an outlier and we will likely never know the true cause.

 

[dogememe]

Additional information I now have is that oil changes were done within 3-6 months of the oil change indicator coming on the dash, and that the dealership claims to have found some sludge in there while they have it apart.

I still think it should have lasted longer.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

It's unfortunate the timing chain path on some modern engines is complex.

The timing chain path on my 1965 Mustang 289 was simple and the chain heavy duty. No one talked about timing chain problems back then.

My shop in the 70's was full of cars at 90 to120k miles getting new chains. But I would look at Dist rotor movement and check for slack before a tune up and inform owner (usually wife). Didn't cost a fortune back then even with an added in WP and belts. The cast sprockets with molded nylon(?) teeth would die first.

My small Honda 1.5 SOHC VTEC had a ratcheted TC tensionor and was always quiet. Must be a cheap chain or that worn down 20 grade juice. I warned you guys about chains decades ago when cars were moving away from Dry timing components. Nobody listens to old Arco.

 

[IndyIan]

Additional information I now have is that oil changes were done within 3-6 months of the oil change indicator coming on the dash, and that the dealership claims to have found some sludge in there while they have it apart.

I still think it should have lasted longer.

So how many actual oil changes then? 3-4? with lowest bidder barrel of "synthetic" 0W20, maybe the timing chain might wear that much? Maybe if run hard while low on oil too... I guess there's a limit of how many abusive factors even a simple NA honda engine can take.
If its only the timing chain and sprockets, its a cheap lesson for them compared to higher strung little turbo engine.

 

[Patman]

Additional information I now have is that oil changes were done within 3-6 months of the oil change indicator coming on the dash, and that the dealership claims to have found some sludge in there while they have it apart.

I still think it should have lasted longer.

So basically this engine was severely neglected and likely used the cheapest bulk oil possible. It may not have even been running 0w-20 synthetic as it should have been. Someone who goes 6 months beyond their oil life monitor is likely cheap enough that they found a local garage doing $25 oil changes with a bulk 5w-20 conventional oil

 

[dogememe]

It was either done at the dealer or at a local mechanic with synthetic.

No idea what the dealer uses for oil.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

So is this the iVTEC K20C2 DOHC engine? No cam phasers on that one from what I just read.
Maybe just a stuck TCT? But Honda would not not be immune to filthy, gritty lubricant wearing link pins and guides I suppose.
still I am questioning the "stretch" diagnoses may be dealer a money grab - lot of that going around.

 

[paulo57509]

So is this the iVTEC K20C2 DOHC engine? No cam phasers on that one from what I just read.
Maybe just a stuck TCT? But Honda would not not be immune to filthy, gritty lubricant wearing link pins and guides I suppose.
still I am questioning the "stretch" diagnoses may be dealer a money grab - lot of that going around.

I was also thinking timing chain tensioner and/or guides. I have to ask; how is timing chain stretch vs. slack confirmed? Can this be done by looking at timing marks at the crankshaft and cam?

 

[The Critic]

It's a GDI engine - they're not kind to poor oil change habits, even if it's a NA motor.

I was wrong - I forgot that this was the earlier 2.0 that is port injected. When I think 2.0, I keep thinking about the 2.0 GDI that's in the current CR-V hybrid. My apologies.

 

[CarlB]

I have a theory.

No one will be able to determine why the chain stretched using remote forum diagnostics.

 

[Patman]

I was wrong - I forgot that this was the earlier 2.0 that is port injected. When I think 2.0, I keep thinking about the 2.0 GDI that's in the current CR-V hybrid. My apologies.

Yep, the Civic’s 2.0 only switched to direct injection as of the 2025 model year

 

[charbaby]

Yep, the Civic’s 2.0 only switched to direct injection as of the 2025 model year

Are you sure?
From HONDA
See the 5th bullet point(BOLD)

2025 Honda Civic Performance Features​

Now that you’ve compared the Honda Civic engine options, let’s explore some of the other key performance features of the Civic. Favorite standard and available feature highlights can include:

• Electronic Continuously Variable Transmission (e-CVT) with Sport Mode
• Deceleration Selectors
• Eco Assist™ System
• Hill Start Assist
• Multi-point Fuel Injection
• Continuously Variable Transmission (CVT)
• MacPherson Strut Front Suspension
• Multi-link Rear Suspension
• Power-Assisted Ventilated Front Disc/Solid Rear Disc Brakes (front/rear): 11.1 inches / 10.2 inches
• Variable Ratio Electric Power-Assisted Rack-and-Pinion Steering (EPS)
• Electric Servo Brake (Sport Hybrid, Sport Touring Hybrid)
• And more!

 

[buster]

An outlier for sure as the port injected 2.0 is as reliable of an engine as there is.

 

[buster]

Are you sure?
From HONDA
See the 5th bullet point(BOLD)

2025 Honda Civic Performance Features​

Now that you’ve compared the Honda Civic engine options, let’s explore some of the other key performance features of the Civic. Favorite standard and available feature highlights can include:

• Electronic Continuously Variable Transmission (e-CVT) with Sport Mode
• Deceleration Selectors
• Eco Assist™ System
• Hill Start Assist
• Multi-point Fuel Injection
• Continuously Variable Transmission (CVT)
• MacPherson Strut Front Suspension
• Multi-link Rear Suspension
• Power-Assisted Ventilated Front Disc/Solid Rear Disc Brakes (front/rear): 11.1 inches / 10.2 inches
• Variable Ratio Electric Power-Assisted Rack-and-Pinion Steering (EPS)
• Electric Servo Brake (Sport Hybrid, Sport Touring Hybrid)
• And more!

The switched for the 2025 model year. Prior version was port injected.

 

[Dave Hess]

Any photos of snapped chain ?

Or is thats what the shop says is the problem ?

 

[crashz]

I would hazard to guess that 5-6 oil changes were done in 8 years. I would also guess that this car was short tripped to death. Frequent cold starts and cold operation will drive a lot of water and contaminates into the oil. The oil condition was likely much worse than expected and add a pinch of neglect and you get a recipe for disaster.

As CarlB stated, that isn't a diagnosis, just a WAG.

 

[Patman]

Are you sure?
From HONDA
See the 5th bullet point(BOLD)

2025 Honda Civic Performance Features​

Now that you’ve compared the Honda Civic engine options, let’s explore some of the other key performance features of the Civic. Favorite standard and available feature highlights can include:

• Electronic Continuously Variable Transmission (e-CVT) with Sport Mode
• Deceleration Selectors
• Eco Assist™ System
• Hill Start Assist
• Multi-point Fuel Injection
• Continuously Variable Transmission (CVT)
• MacPherson Strut Front Suspension
• Multi-link Rear Suspension
• Power-Assisted Ventilated Front Disc/Solid Rear Disc Brakes (front/rear): 11.1 inches / 10.2 inches
• Variable Ratio Electric Power-Assisted Rack-and-Pinion Steering (EPS)
• Electric Servo Brake (Sport Hybrid, Sport Touring Hybrid)
• And more!

That must be leftover information from the 2024 model. In addition to the Honda Canada website it was also mentioned on the Car and Driver website for the 2025 Civic. I wish it still had port injection. Now it will likely suffer the same dilution issues that the 1.5 has

 

[Exhaustgases]

This "stretch" failure to me points towards potential cam phaser issues or something that spikes chain tension and drives chain tension to excess. In other words, true chain "stretch" instead of wear, which is what most people are actually calling stretch.

Yes !

Oil or no oil drive chains wear, they are a steel on steel bearing surface, and are not considered a hydrodynamic lubricated item.
Impact loading from the VTC rattles likely don't help, as well as just the action over the sprocket teeth. And yeah bad old oil.

 

[Hohn]

Yes !

Oil or no oil drive chains wear, they are a steel on steel bearing surface, and are not considered a hydrodynamic lubricated item.
Impact loading from the VTC rattles likely don't help, as well as just the action over the sprocket teeth. And yeah bad old oil.

Rolling element chains actually do have aspects of EHD lubrication where the roller spins on the bushing. This is why most chain manufacturers want you to soak them in oil before installation. This gets oil in that gap. A traditional "silent" chain doesn't have this effect.

 

[thastinger]

An outlier for sure as the port injected 2.0 is as reliable of an engine as there is.

Mazda's 2.3 MZR L-series says "hold my beer".