2016 WRX, Been at Dealer 3 Months
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A friend of mine had a WRX with problems no one could figure out also. He eventually traded it in on another non turbo Subaru which gave him some issues but not nearly as many.
Originally Posted By: Silverado12
A friend of mine had a WRX with problems no one could figure out also. He eventually traded it in on another non turbo Subaru which gave him some issues but not nearly as many.
Aaaargh. I've done that at the GM dealer. If the organization would just promptly fix the car all would be fine...
A friend of mine had a WRX with problems no one could figure out also. He eventually traded it in on another non turbo Subaru which gave him some issues but not nearly as many.
Aaaargh. I've done that at the GM dealer. If the organization would just promptly fix the car all would be fine...
Originally Posted By: john_pifer
Originally Posted By: Gasbuggy
so whats up with that hot email?
Great question! I haven't received a response via email, but I was contacted this week by a rep over the phone (same woman I've been talking to).
I did email the CEO of Subaru on the OP's behalf but never heard anything back either. I forwarded a copy of the email to John. It was worth a try since this is the first time I haven't received a reply back after contacting an executive of a company.
Originally Posted By: Gasbuggy
so whats up with that hot email?
Great question! I haven't received a response via email, but I was contacted this week by a rep over the phone (same woman I've been talking to).
I did email the CEO of Subaru on the OP's behalf but never heard anything back either. I forwarded a copy of the email to John. It was worth a try since this is the first time I haven't received a reply back after contacting an executive of a company.
Why do we buy new cars?
We buy them because we expect 6-8 years and 100K+ with nothing more involved than routine maintenance, a set of brakes and tires and maybe a battery.
This has been our experience with cars we've bought new including our '09 NA Forester.
You also get a factory warranty to take care of any defects in parts or assembly, which typically manifest themselves early in the car's life, as was your experience.
Too bad that SOA didn't feel like they should make their dealerships take care of anything in your case.
With something new, you should be confident of setting out for Florida or California tomorrow morning with the expectation that all you'll have to do is put fuel in the tank and maybe check the dipstick a time or two.
With your car, I'd be reluctant to do that. Were I in your shoes, my confidence in the car would be seriously challenged and it would take many trouble free miles for that confidence to be restored.
This is yet another example of a manufacturer allowing dealership personnel who were either lazy or incompetent to leave a customer hanging while lying to him the whole time in the hope that he'd just go away.
This is why lemon laws came to exist.
I'll add that if the servicing dealer had been the selling dealer, your experience would probably have been a lot better. Warranty work isn't a moneymaker for either a service department or the techs doing it since the hourly rate reimbursed along with the time allowed tend to be on the low end. Consequently, the better techs who have the option of going elsewhere will often refuse these jobs or expect to be heavily compensated with customer paid gravy work like brakes.
We buy them because we expect 6-8 years and 100K+ with nothing more involved than routine maintenance, a set of brakes and tires and maybe a battery.
This has been our experience with cars we've bought new including our '09 NA Forester.
You also get a factory warranty to take care of any defects in parts or assembly, which typically manifest themselves early in the car's life, as was your experience.
Too bad that SOA didn't feel like they should make their dealerships take care of anything in your case.
With something new, you should be confident of setting out for Florida or California tomorrow morning with the expectation that all you'll have to do is put fuel in the tank and maybe check the dipstick a time or two.
With your car, I'd be reluctant to do that. Were I in your shoes, my confidence in the car would be seriously challenged and it would take many trouble free miles for that confidence to be restored.
This is yet another example of a manufacturer allowing dealership personnel who were either lazy or incompetent to leave a customer hanging while lying to him the whole time in the hope that he'd just go away.
This is why lemon laws came to exist.
I'll add that if the servicing dealer had been the selling dealer, your experience would probably have been a lot better. Warranty work isn't a moneymaker for either a service department or the techs doing it since the hourly rate reimbursed along with the time allowed tend to be on the low end. Consequently, the better techs who have the option of going elsewhere will often refuse these jobs or expect to be heavily compensated with customer paid gravy work like brakes.
The OP is in a lose - lose situation as long as he is paying insurance and car loan gor something he is not able to drive.
I would get car back and take to dealership it was purchased from.
I would get car back and take to dealership it was purchased from.
Which would accomplish what?
This is a really convoluted story involving a cheap dealer in another state from whom the OP bought the car, the local dealer who didn't make a dime on the car whom the OP expected to fix it and the largely unseen and probably undocumented hand of SOA.
Both dealers have attorneys of their own as does SOA.
It is clear that SOA could have done more to facilitate repair of the car to the OP's satisfaction and would have earned considerable goodwill in the process.
The only question is whether they violated the terms of the limited warranty, which is an obligation of SOA, not any dealer.
Any legal action would be a losing proposition for the OP IMHO although I'm sure that he can find a lawyer willing to take his money.
This is a really convoluted story involving a cheap dealer in another state from whom the OP bought the car, the local dealer who didn't make a dime on the car whom the OP expected to fix it and the largely unseen and probably undocumented hand of SOA.
Both dealers have attorneys of their own as does SOA.
It is clear that SOA could have done more to facilitate repair of the car to the OP's satisfaction and would have earned considerable goodwill in the process.
The only question is whether they violated the terms of the limited warranty, which is an obligation of SOA, not any dealer.
Any legal action would be a losing proposition for the OP IMHO although I'm sure that he can find a lawyer willing to take his money.
Okay, so who would this lawyer go after and under the laws of what state?
Dealer in state of purchase, who never saw the car again after the OP drove it off their lot?
Dealer in state of residence who had nothing in the transaction and yet OP showed up with his car expecting them to fix it?
Given that this was an interstate transaction, state lemon laws may be neither applicable nor enforceable under the interstate commerce clause of our constitution.
Also, if the car is now fixed, what lemon law case would there be even without any other complicating factors?
Another problem is that the OP was given a comparable car to drive for free while his was undergoing repair.
This would be a very difficult row for any lawyer to hoe, although the OP can still find one happy to take his money.
The OP's experience might best serve as a cautionary tale to those who search out the cheapest on purchase and then expect good warranty service from their more costly local dealers.
Maybe the more expensive dealers are so because they have more adequate service departments that they are disinclined to open to carpetbaggers?
Dealer in state of purchase, who never saw the car again after the OP drove it off their lot?
Dealer in state of residence who had nothing in the transaction and yet OP showed up with his car expecting them to fix it?
Given that this was an interstate transaction, state lemon laws may be neither applicable nor enforceable under the interstate commerce clause of our constitution.
Also, if the car is now fixed, what lemon law case would there be even without any other complicating factors?
Another problem is that the OP was given a comparable car to drive for free while his was undergoing repair.
This would be a very difficult row for any lawyer to hoe, although the OP can still find one happy to take his money.
The OP's experience might best serve as a cautionary tale to those who search out the cheapest on purchase and then expect good warranty service from their more costly local dealers.
Maybe the more expensive dealers are so because they have more adequate service departments that they are disinclined to open to carpetbaggers?
Sad to say, this is another example of how an incompetent dealer can totally ruin the experience of owning a new car. Even though it narrows down my choices to some degree, I am extremely reluctant to consider a brand not sold by the dealer groups that contain the Mazda and BMW dealers I have been so pleased with. One of the reasons the Mustang GT lost out to the 2er was the almost lack of competent Ford dealers in my area not to mention Ford's HPDE-averse policy on warranty coverage.
Originally Posted By: gman2304
The question begging to be asked is 'Why are their so many posts here about Subaru owners having so many problems'?
Would I be correct in saying the North American Subarus are made in America? Whereas Subarus in the Rest or the World are made in Japan?
Subaruas are well know for being extremely robust in the UK and indeed in Australia/NZ where many are grey imports from Japan.
Could it be a quality control issue? Or specification differences for the NA market?
The only reason I mention that is when the ML Merc first came to the UK they were made in the US and there were lots of build quality problems. And the early ML still has a poor reputation for reliability.
The question begging to be asked is 'Why are their so many posts here about Subaru owners having so many problems'?
Would I be correct in saying the North American Subarus are made in America? Whereas Subarus in the Rest or the World are made in Japan?
Subaruas are well know for being extremely robust in the UK and indeed in Australia/NZ where many are grey imports from Japan.
Could it be a quality control issue? Or specification differences for the NA market?
The only reason I mention that is when the ML Merc first came to the UK they were made in the US and there were lots of build quality problems. And the early ML still has a poor reputation for reliability.
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Originally Posted By: bigjl
Originally Posted By: gman2304
The question begging to be asked is 'Why are their so many posts here about Subaru owners having so many problems'?
Would I be correct in saying the North American Subarus are made in America? Whereas Subarus in the Rest or the World are made in Japan?
Subaruas are well know for being extremely robust in the UK and indeed in Australia/NZ where many are grey imports from Japan.
Could it be a quality control issue? Or specification differences for the NA market?
The only reason I mention that is when the ML Merc first came to the UK they were made in the US and there were lots of build quality problems. And the early ML still has a poor reputation for reliability.
Pretty sure they are made in Japan. Our '06 Forester XT, which was also a nightmare, was made in Japan.
Originally Posted By: gman2304
The question begging to be asked is 'Why are their so many posts here about Subaru owners having so many problems'?
Would I be correct in saying the North American Subarus are made in America? Whereas Subarus in the Rest or the World are made in Japan?
Subaruas are well know for being extremely robust in the UK and indeed in Australia/NZ where many are grey imports from Japan.
Could it be a quality control issue? Or specification differences for the NA market?
The only reason I mention that is when the ML Merc first came to the UK they were made in the US and there were lots of build quality problems. And the early ML still has a poor reputation for reliability.
Pretty sure they are made in Japan. Our '06 Forester XT, which was also a nightmare, was made in Japan.
JHZR2
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Haven't read the whole thread, but it seems like further follow up with corporate to get a warranty extension would be the right move.
It depends upon the Subaru.
Imprezas, of which the Forester and Rex are examples, are still built entirely in Japan AFAIK.
The various Legacy models, including the Outback, have been built for years in what was once a joint venture Izusu/Subaru plant in Indiana that was later taken over entirely by Subaru. The smaller Outback Sport was an Impreza and was built in Japan. Many Toyota Camrys have been assembled in the Indiana plant as well, although I believe this has recently ended.
AFAIK, the split continues with the Legacy platform models built in Indiana and the Impreza platform models built in Japan.
Your '06 Subaru was built in Japan as was our '09, while the beater '99 Legacy we have was built in Indiana.
We've had two beater Subies, the '99 and an earlier '96 Impreza and have found them to be pretty tough cars mechanically. In particular, the automatic and the AWD seem to be unbreakable in the hands of young male drivers and there's nothing wrong with either the 2.2 or the late 2.5 EJ engine. Consider that there are many years of Toyota Camrys to avoid due to either sludge-prone engines or failing head bolts and there is at least one generation of Accord that belongs on the ignore list in automatic form and this helps to put the problems that are ascribed to Subaru cars into perspective. Consider also that your turbo Forester may have been ridden hard and put away wet before it came into your hands.
The OP appears to have gotten a car with an assembly error that it took a dealer an absurd amount of time to find.
Of course, had he bought the car from that dealer, they might have assigned a sharper and better paid tech to the car and the problem might have been found and resolved far more quickly.
Imprezas, of which the Forester and Rex are examples, are still built entirely in Japan AFAIK.
The various Legacy models, including the Outback, have been built for years in what was once a joint venture Izusu/Subaru plant in Indiana that was later taken over entirely by Subaru. The smaller Outback Sport was an Impreza and was built in Japan. Many Toyota Camrys have been assembled in the Indiana plant as well, although I believe this has recently ended.
AFAIK, the split continues with the Legacy platform models built in Indiana and the Impreza platform models built in Japan.
Your '06 Subaru was built in Japan as was our '09, while the beater '99 Legacy we have was built in Indiana.
We've had two beater Subies, the '99 and an earlier '96 Impreza and have found them to be pretty tough cars mechanically. In particular, the automatic and the AWD seem to be unbreakable in the hands of young male drivers and there's nothing wrong with either the 2.2 or the late 2.5 EJ engine. Consider that there are many years of Toyota Camrys to avoid due to either sludge-prone engines or failing head bolts and there is at least one generation of Accord that belongs on the ignore list in automatic form and this helps to put the problems that are ascribed to Subaru cars into perspective. Consider also that your turbo Forester may have been ridden hard and put away wet before it came into your hands.
The OP appears to have gotten a car with an assembly error that it took a dealer an absurd amount of time to find.
Of course, had he bought the car from that dealer, they might have assigned a sharper and better paid tech to the car and the problem might have been found and resolved far more quickly.
Originally Posted By: MCompact
Sad to say, this is another example of how an incompetent dealer can totally ruin the experience of owning a new car. Even though it narrows down my choices to some degree, I am extremely reluctant to consider a brand not sold by the dealer groups that contain the Mazda and BMW dealers I have been so pleased with. One of the reasons the Mustang GT lost out to the 2er was the almost lack of competent Ford dealers in my area not to mention Ford's HPDE-averse policy on warranty coverage.
Mustang is boring compared to your BMW.
Sad to say, this is another example of how an incompetent dealer can totally ruin the experience of owning a new car. Even though it narrows down my choices to some degree, I am extremely reluctant to consider a brand not sold by the dealer groups that contain the Mazda and BMW dealers I have been so pleased with. One of the reasons the Mustang GT lost out to the 2er was the almost lack of competent Ford dealers in my area not to mention Ford's HPDE-averse policy on warranty coverage.
Mustang is boring compared to your BMW.
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Originally Posted By: MCompact
Sad to say, this is another example of how an incompetent dealer can totally ruin the experience of owning a new car. Even though it narrows down my choices to some degree, I am extremely reluctant to consider a brand not sold by the dealer groups that contain the Mazda and BMW dealers I have been so pleased with. One of the reasons the Mustang GT lost out to the 2er was the almost lack of competent Ford dealers in my area not to mention Ford's HPDE-averse policy on warranty coverage.
Mustang is boring compared to your BMW.
Not really; you just have to get one with the Performance Package and a manual transmission to kick up the excitement level.
Originally Posted By: MCompact
Sad to say, this is another example of how an incompetent dealer can totally ruin the experience of owning a new car. Even though it narrows down my choices to some degree, I am extremely reluctant to consider a brand not sold by the dealer groups that contain the Mazda and BMW dealers I have been so pleased with. One of the reasons the Mustang GT lost out to the 2er was the almost lack of competent Ford dealers in my area not to mention Ford's HPDE-averse policy on warranty coverage.
Mustang is boring compared to your BMW.
Not really; you just have to get one with the Performance Package and a manual transmission to kick up the excitement level.
Mustang still bland and boring.
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Any other WRX owners have this problem on a Subaru forum ?
No, the complete opposite. There are guys that modify their cars with a reflash, blow the engine, convert it back to stock, and get a new short block under warranty all within a few weeks. Warranty coverage largely depends on what the dealer tells SoA.
On top of a Subaru Gold warranty, I would ask to have a meeting with the District Service Operations Manager. Don't request this through the dealer but through SoA. The DSOM might even agree to throw in a couple of years of free maintenance as well (not that I would even go back to that dealer but it sounds like you don't have much choice).
Any other WRX owners have this problem on a Subaru forum ?
No, the complete opposite. There are guys that modify their cars with a reflash, blow the engine, convert it back to stock, and get a new short block under warranty all within a few weeks. Warranty coverage largely depends on what the dealer tells SoA.
On top of a Subaru Gold warranty, I would ask to have a meeting with the District Service Operations Manager. Don't request this through the dealer but through SoA. The DSOM might even agree to throw in a couple of years of free maintenance as well (not that I would even go back to that dealer but it sounds like you don't have much choice).
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