2008 bmw x5 - kendall synblend10w30

[BISCUT]

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?


because oil is oil. seriously, we may not keep the car. I just spent $4,100 replacing the valley pan, valley pan pipe, gasket, and a sh!tload of seals, etc. b/c of various leaks. since I got 3 cases of Napa Syn 5w30, 3 cases of Kendall syn blend 10w30, and 2 cases of Castrol syn blend 10w30, just curious. . . . I know I can any of those in my truck easily. I also have about 40 qts of M1 so this is more a guess to see what I can get away with


Karma buddy! I hope you someday buy a vehicle treated as you are looking to treat yours. And if "oil is oil" as you say, just do it and don't bother asking people who you know are going to advise against it.

 

[kschachn]

There's no reason to use BMW branded fluids, just ones that meet the maker's specifications - just as you would in a GM vehicle.

And when it comes to oil that's as easy as it gets. Just stop by Walmart and buy M1 0W-40.

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
didn't buy it b/c of how it was "engineered" - wife wanted to try the brand after years of having to have a GM b/c of my prior job. moreover, seeing as how some BMW's use GM tranny's and other parts from other OEM's, I am having a hard time imagining that it will go into a death spiral if heaven forbid, something other than BMW-labelled fluid goes into it. I am asking the question to see what the parameters of people's experiences are not to be cheap. fortunately, I make more than enough that I can afford the vehicle and then some. However, seeing as it is also a global vehicle and used around the world, I just wonder what makes it tick and how it works vs other brands. but thanks for the input

 

[DirkDiggler]

Originally Posted By: BISCUT
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?


because oil is oil. seriously, we may not keep the car. I just spent $4,100 replacing the valley pan, valley pan pipe, gasket, and a sh!tload of seals, etc. b/c of various leaks. since I got 3 cases of Napa Syn 5w30, 3 cases of Kendall syn blend 10w30, and 2 cases of Castrol syn blend 10w30, just curious. . . . I know I can any of those in my truck easily. I also have about 40 qts of M1 so this is more a guess to see what I can get away with


Karma buddy! I hope you someday buy a vehicle treated as you are looking to treat yours. And if "oil is oil" as you say, just do it and don't bother asking people who you know are going to advise against it.


while I truly appreciate the New York holiday cheer, no one has said anything about mistreating this vehicle. In fact, if anything, I have been overly generous as I usually cut the OEM recommendations in half and am very aggressive about changing fluids, filters, etc. for instance, this vehicle only once went past 8,500 for an oil change when OLM said it was another 10,000 to go, and that was only to get a blackstone test for M1 0w40. Normally, the vehicle goes 6,500 max on full synthetic. Moreover, my questions were more towards understanding the limits of the vehicle vs the manufacturer having people believe the car will blow up if the fluids are not derived 100% from the BMW God's own "baby batter".

Hoping the best for you and yours in the New Year.

 

[wemay]

OP, continue using what's in your signature and you'll be fine, as will be the next owner.

Seasons Greetings...

 

[kschachn]

OK, well clearly you wish to believe what you want, rather than listen to advice or explanations given to you. No one is telling you to use fluids derived from BMW's "baby batter" as you put it, only use the fluids specified by the manufacturer. Just as GM, Ford, Chrysler, Fiat, Mercedes-Benz, Honda, Toyota, Subaru, and everyone else do. It's not a complicated concept.

You also seem to have a negative bias against this and possibly any BMW, likely due to the recent repairs you experienced. Your beloved GMC has motor oil requirements too, are you embittered against those as well?

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
while I truly appreciate the New York holiday cheer, no one has said anything about mistreating this vehicle. In fact, if anything, I have been overly generous as I usually cut the OEM recommendations in half and am very aggressive about changing fluids, filters, etc. for instance, this vehicle only once went past 8,500 for an oil change when OLM said it was another 10,000 to go, and that was only to get a blackstone test for M1 0w40. Normally, the vehicle goes 6,500 max on full synthetic. Moreover, my questions were more towards understanding the limits of the vehicle vs the manufacturer having people believe the car will blow up if the fluids are not derived 100% from the BMW God's own "baby batter".

 

[camrydriver111]

If you're interested in specific lubrication requirements...

To meet BMW LL-01 spec you need a HTHS viscosity of at least 3.5. Regular 5W30 is too thin and that's why it doesn't meet the BMW LL-01 spec. The BMW-branded 5W30 you buy at the dealer is actually a heavy 5W30.

Most LL-01 spec oils will be heavier than 5W30, they will be 0W30, 0W40, or 5W40.

Although lots of people run non LL-01 5W30 in their cars because they are not even aware of LL-01. I'm not aware of any instances of people ruining their engines because of it.

I would not use dino or syn blend since BMWs have really small oil passages like VANOS and CCV.

 

[Clevy]

Oem's make specifications because through their various testing methods and they certify oils that meet the standards they expect to keep their specific products in what they feel is proper shape.
So will an uncertified oil work?
ABSOLUTELY.
Is it what the oem considers best for their products keeping them in a condition that the oem expects over many hundreds of thousands of miles?
Nope.
M1 0w-40 is under 30 a jug in America. So that alone baffles me as to why anyone would would even question the spec. It's inexpensive,it's certified and arguably one of the best commercially available lubricants on earth.
No brainer. Why anyone would even consider using a cheaper product that isn't certified is beyond me.
Lests buy an expensive imported car and use the cheapest junk lubricant I can find.
Real sensible.
Hope it's a lease.

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?



I've been running MaxLife (it's a syn blend) in my M52 powered cars now for 60k+ miles. No CCV issues, clean as a whistle when the valve covers were popped for valve cover gaskets on both. Don't fear the mantra of 'LL-01 ONLY, unless you're under warranty. And absolutely, under no circumstances go the full 15k or more mileage interval unless you're running a top-teir synthetic. Part of the reason for a full syn recommendation is the extreme change intervals. I'm running 6-7k intervals with 0 consumption.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler

didn't buy it b/c of how it was "engineered" - wife wanted to try the brand after years of having to have a GM b/c of my prior job. moreover, seeing as how some BMW's use GM tranny's and other parts from other OEM's, I am having a hard time imagining that it will go into a death spiral if heaven forbid, something other than BMW-labelled fluid goes into it. I am asking the question to see what the parameters of people's experiences are not to be cheap. fortunately, I make more than enough that I can afford the vehicle and then some. However, seeing as it is also a global vehicle and used around the world, I just wonder what makes it tick and how it works vs other brands. but thanks for the input


Then if you can afford it, maintain it like it should be. Problem solved. And yes, it is a global vehicle, which is why it calls for LL-01 (globally) so that the proper lubricant can be used wherever it was sold. And yes, some of their transmissions are GM-sourced, but none of their engines are. And their engines as well as the OLM are designed to be used with an approved lubricant, which, if we are talking about LL-01, has an HTHS >=3.5cP.

The same goes for VW and Mercedes BTW. They call for a particular oil spec depending on application, globally. It is what they test and design for and the lubricant meets the requirements that they've set for wear, deposit control, viscosity retention, OCI length capability....etc.

It is, IMHO, a much better approach than just spec'ing a grade, which, depending on where the vehicle is sold, can vary wildly in quality. Some of the horror stories on the middle east oils that our one member has spoken of.... Some of the horrible oils we see on the PQIA list. They have the grade on the bottle. On the other hand, spec'ing an approval, with no grade attached to it is spec'ing a quality; a minimum level of performance that must be met. In this way the manufacturer doesn't have to worry about availability of a particular grade or brand. They approve oils from manufacturers all over the world in a range of grades as long as they meet the requirements of the spec and are tested to meet all of the necessary criteria. This is why approval lists like the Mercedes ones are so long with lists of oils we've never heard of on them.

GM is trying to go this way now with Dexos, and Ford of course has their WSS spec's. The still put a grade on the oil cap though, and IMHO, that still encourages people to shop by what they see on the front of the bottle, not by the spec listed in their manual.

 

[DirkDiggler]

nope. paid cash for it as a CPO. and OEM's also cut deals with certain oil companies, which is why "Castol recommended" or something like that is on the oil cap. Recommended does not equate to required.

 

[DirkDiggler]

Originally Posted By: KenO
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?



I've been running MaxLife (it's a syn blend) in my M52 powered cars now for 60k+ miles. No CCV issues, clean as a whistle when the valve covers were popped for valve cover gaskets on both. Don't fear the mantra of 'LL-01 ONLY, unless you're under warranty. And absolutely, under no circumstances go the full 15k or more mileage interval unless you're running a top-teir synthetic. Part of the reason for a full syn recommendation is the extreme change intervals. I'm running 6-7k intervals with 0 consumption.


thank you for the calm and rationale response.

I have repeatedly indicated the car NEVER gets more than 6,500 on it between changes. Too many horror stories about BMW's and the need to de-scope maintenance. Moreover, I got my hands on the various literature for it, and lo and behold, it specs M1 5w30 as a recommended lubricant, which does NOT meet the LL-01 threshold. hence, the curiosity as to the disparity between what they published to their dealer network and now what is held as Gospel.

 

[DirkDiggler]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Your beloved GMC has motor oil requirements too, are you embittered against those as well?


well, I have the Chilton for it along w the owners' manual. the requirements don't "recommend" any particular oil other than to suggest 5w30 or 10w30 if temps above 0 deg. It uses Dex-Cool, but there are a ton of those out there so I don't use the AC Delco brand for that or transfer case, or transmission fluid, or differentials. I just run synthetics and run them for less than the manufacturer suggests. I use to also work at GM and litigated claims about vehicle issues. non-oem spec'd fluid wasn't high on the list. . . . not changing the oil for 30k and claiming the engine failed on its own was.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
Originally Posted By: KenO
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?



I've been running MaxLife (it's a syn blend) in my M52 powered cars now for 60k+ miles. No CCV issues, clean as a whistle when the valve covers were popped for valve cover gaskets on both. Don't fear the mantra of 'LL-01 ONLY, unless you're under warranty. And absolutely, under no circumstances go the full 15k or more mileage interval unless you're running a top-teir synthetic. Part of the reason for a full syn recommendation is the extreme change intervals. I'm running 6-7k intervals with 0 consumption.


thank you for the calm and rationale response.

I have repeatedly indicated the car NEVER gets more than 6,500 on it between changes. Too many horror stories about BMW's and the need to de-scope maintenance. Moreover, I got my hands on the various literature for it, and lo and behold, it specs M1 5w30 as a recommended lubricant, which does NOT meet the LL-01 threshold. hence, the curiosity as to the disparity between what they published to their dealer network and now what is held as Gospel.


I have never seen anything from BMW that doesn't recommend/require anything other than BMW 5w-30 (made by Castrol) or an LL-01 oil. Can you provide a copy of this literature? Also, BMW has no relationship with ExxonMobil, so the specification of a Mobil-branded lubricant doesn't sound official IMHO.

 

[DirkDiggler]

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3345099/1

you were part of this discussion before. . . . google BMW operating fluids

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3345099/1

you were part of this discussion before. . . . google BMW operating fluids


Oh Lord, that thread. I tried to help you as best as I could. You are misinterpreting at least that one document and I very clearly explained why in that thread.

As per the M1 5w-30 recommendation, as I stated there, I highly doubt it is the North American 5w-30, probably some Euro 5w-30 version equivalent to the BMW 5w-30. The currently approved Mobil product for this application is their 0w-40 and if you were to ask Mobil, they would tell you the same thing.

On a side note, why are you having such a hard time with just running the approved fluid? Do you do this with everything you own or is this just automotive fluid specific? I mean we've now had numerous threads on this subject and you appear to have not accepted the general consensus on the issue, instead, we appear to keep revisiting it over and over again

I guess my point is why ask if you are bent on just doing your own thing anyway? It isn't like the board's opinion/input has changed since that previous thread.

Merry Christmas. I hope you make up your mind. I just run M1 0w-40 in my M5. It is an approved fluid for the application and I don't need to have a plethora of threads on it because of that

 

[d00df00d]

Early on in the thread, OP specifically said he was trying to see what he could get away with in this car. That was the wording. This "just asking questions" and "trying to figure out what the requirements are all about" stuff only came up after he was called on it.

Did you notice that the only response he accepted as "calm and rationale" [sic] was the one that agreed with him? Your initial assessment seems to have been spot-on: he's already convinced and just looking to feel better about it. Nothing to be gained by treating this thread any differently, IMO.

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
Originally Posted By: KenO
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?



I've been running MaxLife (it's a syn blend) in my M52 powered cars now for 60k+ miles. No CCV issues, clean as a whistle when the valve covers were popped for valve cover gaskets on both. Don't fear the mantra of 'LL-01 ONLY, unless you're under warranty. And absolutely, under no circumstances go the full 15k or more mileage interval unless you're running a top-teir synthetic. Part of the reason for a full syn recommendation is the extreme change intervals. I'm running 6-7k intervals with 0 consumption.


thank you for the calm and rationale response.

I have repeatedly indicated the car NEVER gets more than 6,500 on it between changes. Too many horror stories about BMW's and the need to de-scope maintenance. Moreover, I got my hands on the various literature for it, and lo and behold, it specs M1 5w30 as a recommended lubricant, which does NOT meet the LL-01 threshold. hence, the curiosity as to the disparity between what they published to their dealer network and now what is held as Gospel.



In the US, on a ~6500 mile OCI - really you're going to be fine with nearly anything. I'd stick to at minimum a syn blend though, and avoid the High mileage oils until you're actually at a higher mileage. The additive packs are fantastic, but they do still have seal swellers that you don't really want to be hitting fairly new-ish seals. Both my engines are well past 100k (and 200k on my 528i), so the MaxLife works great for my application. Normally I say avoid the 5W-30's, especially the BMW one, but if you're changing at a good interval like you are, you could get away with the BMW 5W-30 as well. Most any of the 0W-40's, 5W-40's, or a 10W-40 would work fine. German Castrol 0W-30 would also be fine. I'm not sure if there are many decent 10W-30's that would work well. you want a high zinc oil due to the 'flat tappet' cam follower design. Hence why I go towards the HM oils.

What is your driving like? Mostly stop & go, highway, or fairly mixed? And there are only 'horror stories' about BMW maintenance when they aren't maintained. Yes, they do require a bit more maintenance than a Chevy, but you bought a high performance vehicle, and thats just the way it is. Do the maintenance, you should have a LOT of trouble free miles. Oh, and google around for the 'old' BMW maintenance schedule. THAT is what you'll want to use if you plan to keep the vehicle forever.

 

[Nickdfresh]

Originally Posted By: DirkDigjavascript:%20void(0)gler
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car?

Why would you?


because oil is oil. seriously, we may not keep the car. I just spent $4,100 replacing the valley pan, valley pan pipe, gasket, and a sh!tload of seals, etc. b/c of various leaks. since I got 3 cases of Napa Syn 5w30, 3 cases of Kendall syn blend 10w30, and 2 cases of Castrol syn blend 10w30, just curious. . . . I know I can any of those in my truck easily. I also have about 40 qts of M1 so this is more a guess to see what I can get away with


And you're going to make that up by saving maybe $10 on oil? No, this isn't a troll post or anything..

 

[DirkDiggler]

I've been running MaxLife (it's a syn blend) in my M52 powered cars now for 60k+ miles. No CCV issues, clean as a whistle when the valve covers were popped for valve cover gaskets on both. Don't fear the mantra of 'LL-01 ONLY, unless you're under warranty. And absolutely, under no circumstances go the full 15k or more mileage interval unless you're running a top-teir synthetic. Part of the reason for a full syn recommendation is the extreme change intervals. I'm running 6-7k intervals with 0 consumption. [/quote]

thank you for the calm and rationale response.

I have repeatedly indicated the car NEVER gets more than 6,500 on it between changes. Too many horror stories about BMW's and the need to de-scope maintenance. Moreover, I got my hands on the various literature for it, and lo and behold, it specs M1 5w30 as a recommended lubricant, which does NOT meet the LL-01 threshold. hence, the curiosity as to the disparity between what they published to their dealer network and now what is held as Gospel. [/quote]


In the US, on a ~6500 mile OCI - really you're going to be fine with nearly anything. I'd stick to at minimum a syn blend though, and avoid the High mileage oils until you're actually at a higher mileage. The additive packs are fantastic, but they do still have seal swellers that you don't really want to be hitting fairly new-ish seals. Both my engines are well past 100k (and 200k on my 528i), so the MaxLife works great for my application. Normally I say avoid the 5W-30's, especially the BMW one, but if you're changing at a good interval like you are, you could get away with the BMW 5W-30 as well. Most any of the 0W-40's, 5W-40's, or a 10W-40 would work fine. German Castrol 0W-30 would also be fine. I'm not sure if there are many decent 10W-30's that would work well. you want a high zinc oil due to the 'flat tappet' cam follower design. Hence why I go towards the HM oils.

What is your driving like? Mostly stop & go, highway, or fairly mixed? And there are only 'horror stories' about BMW maintenance when they aren't maintained. Yes, they do require a bit more maintenance than a Chevy, but you bought a high performance vehicle, and thats just the way it is. Do the maintenance, you should have a LOT of trouble free miles. Oh, and google around for the 'old' BMW maintenance schedule. THAT is what you'll want to use if you plan to keep the vehicle forever. [/quote]

I got Mike Miller's old school. .. . as I recall, he referenced running dino as a possibilty as well. The car is driven by the wife who is essentially the shuttle bus between school and piano practice and church. she doesn't track the car or try to push its limits.

 

[deven]

Originally Posted By: DirkDiggler
just wondering thoughts on this. . . think I could use it in wife's car? She is not an aggressive drive, more like a soccer mom driving around town.


This is what you asked. They gave you their opinion. If you cant handle the criticism then don't ask for opinions. People here are passionate about oil and their answers/opinion are going to be passionate as well. Why ask a question when it seemed that you already had made up your mind?