20 micron battle: Bosch 3430 vs Fram FE3980
- Thread starter Robvette
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Base plate hole number and hole size doesn't make an oil filter "flow more oil volume" because the engine is being force fed with a positive displacement oil pump. All it can do is change the delta-p across the whole filter by +/- maybe 1 PSI.
Fram says the Endurance is 99%+ at 20u, so it's most like a hair more efficient than the Bosch. Plus Bosch bases their filter efficiency on one giant sized oil filter, whereas Fram bases it on the average of 3 different sized filters - that's more representative of the line of filters.
Fram says the Endurance media is a "Fully synthetic blend media" ... whatever that really means. Is it a blend of different kinds of synthetic media since they use the word "fully".
The Endurance wins IMO.
Fram says the Endurance is 99%+ at 20u, so it's most like a hair more efficient than the Bosch. Plus Bosch bases their filter efficiency on one giant sized oil filter, whereas Fram bases it on the average of 3 different sized filters - that's more representative of the line of filters.
Fram says the Endurance media is a "Fully synthetic blend media" ... whatever that really means. Is it a blend of different kinds of synthetic media since they use the word "fully".
The Endurance wins IMO.
Why? Isn´t the entire point of a filter supposed to be to filter the oil? I´d give the win to the most efficient. Fram by a hair.
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poor spring seal, much much less filter media, lower flow base plate. both at 99% at 20micron.
here's more info, much more:
Gimmick marketing - again, the flow is defined by the PD oil pump, not by the filter. Use a Titanium and an air intake "Tornado" device at the same time and your engine will rip itself loose from the motor mounts, lol.
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More filter media area doesn't mean much when you're comparing totally different media type/design. You're falling into the typical oil filter misconceptions trap. The OG Fram Ultra had even less media area than these two, and look how it performed in Ascent's testing. If Ascent did an ISO 4548-12 test on those two filters, the Endurance would out perform the Bosch.
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fwiw - 99% at 20um is equal to 99% at 20um. both companies are using the same ISO 4548-12 test. the ultra also has a bypass when it shouldn't in this application. the Titanium is the clear Fram winner
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also - you keep repeating "filter has no bearing on flow" which is inaccurate and irresponsible. the reason Wix makes a 60um racing filter is to optimize flow for relatively disposable racing engines. and, in some racing applications they don't use oil filters at all.
it would be accurate to say that filter flow capability isn't relevant in most street / normal driving applications - because, for example, all the filters i cut open flow adequately for a Chevy S-10.
It's what happens below 20u too that counts if you're into filter efficiency. Go read the big thread where Ascent tested a bunch if same sized filters.
Plus, the Endurance is 99+ %, based on 3 sized filters, not one giant filter like Bosch/Purolator does to boost their efficiency claim for the whole model line. Been discussed in many threads.
Doesn't matter much if it has a bypass valve when it "shouldn't". The bypass in the block is probably set lower than the filter anyway.
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fwiw - after cutting all of these open, I'm using the Titanium. sealed spring plate, much more filter media, metal screen backed media, and powerflow baseplate. if selecting a Fram, in the 3980 the Titanium is the clear winner.
What I've said isn't "innacurate and irresponsible", lol. You don't seem to fully grasp how a PD oil pump works and how the delta-p across an oil filter occurs and why.
The only time an oil filter would reduce oil flow from the PD pump is if the pump hits pressure relief, which is actually pretty hard to do when the oil is hot. You would need to rev the engine to near redline, and the pump would have to put out some crazy GPM of flow. Do you think a filter that has 1-2 PSI more delta-p is reducing oil flow when you're just crusing down the road at 4000 RPM or less with hot oil? The engine oiling system is typically 15 times more flow restrictive than the filter.
Yes, it would literally take a built race car to get some high pump flow (unless it's a Subaru, lol). How do you know they "flow adequately" by looking at them? Technically, you would have to see a "flow vs delta-p" performance curve to know for sure. But yeah, a Chevy S10 oil pump doesn't flow much volume.
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Did you verify it had the wire backed media? - photos? Some don't any more, and are the same as the non wire backed media in the Ultra - maybe that's why it has "much more media". "Power Flow" base plate.
BTW, your engine has the filter bypass valve built into the engine block, so there is a chance that oil will still bypass the filter. And those built-in bypass valves are set to around 10-12 PSI IIRC. There is no bypass valve in the Endurance either.
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You keep using this phrase, but what are you refering to?
According to Fram, the XG3980 does not have a bypass valve.
https://www.fram.com/fram-ultra-synthetic-oil-filter-spin-on-xg3980
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i don't want a bypass.
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watch this video from here:
the only Fram with an actual seal at the bottom of the filter (vs metal to metal) is the Titanium.
You have one, even if the filter doesn't, because the filter bypass is built into the engine - It's a "GM thing". And those filters don't have a bypass valve.
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the Tough Guard TG3980 and Ultra XG3980 do have filter bypass valves. the endurance and titanium do not.
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