No harm will come from your customers using 5w20. It's their responsibility to maintain their warranty, doesn't surprise me though. Most people would rather spend $500 on the latest iphone than spend one extra dollar on their vehicles. You've tried, that's about all that you can do.
0w20 vs 5w20
- Thread starter Stang40
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This is a great post. I do a lot of reading about oils and am seeing a lot of car makers using 0W20 as their spec'd oil.
My engine (4.2 V6) was built from 1996-2008 and was originally spec'd 5W30. The internal clearances had never changed in all of those years. It's now spec'd 5W20 but I do use 5W30 in it every now and then.
I wonder if my engine would tolerate an 0W20 oil. Interesting.
My engine (4.2 V6) was built from 1996-2008 and was originally spec'd 5W30. The internal clearances had never changed in all of those years. It's now spec'd 5W20 but I do use 5W30 in it every now and then.
I wonder if my engine would tolerate an 0W20 oil. Interesting.
Originally Posted By: Stang40
I've read that the 2014 Silverado specs 0w20...which is still using the 5.3 that has spec'd 5w30 for 15 years..... has there been that big of a redesign? Or is it all about gas mileage?
The 2014 V8s now hold 8 qts. of oil.
http://media.gm.com/content/media/us/en/...powertrain.html
I've read that the 2014 Silverado specs 0w20...which is still using the 5.3 that has spec'd 5w30 for 15 years..... has there been that big of a redesign? Or is it all about gas mileage?
The 2014 V8s now hold 8 qts. of oil.
http://media.gm.com/content/media/us/en/...powertrain.html
MrQuackers
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Question. What is the shop's cost for the 5w-20 vs 0w-20 and what is the price difference between the two options for the customer? This is why I change the oil myself.
One thing to consider, esp in Honda vehicles, is that the MM system is calibrated for 0w...mostly because you can only get synthetic. I'd advise the Cx to disregard the system and change their oil at least every 5k instead of 8-10k if using dino.
Originally Posted By: MrQuackers
Question. What is the shop's cost for the 5w-20 vs 0w-20 and what is the price difference between the two options for the customer? This is why I change the oil myself.
Every place I've seen charges an arm and a leg to use any "synthetic" while there may be specials for "conventional" for less than $20. Pep Boys has packages at $29.99 (conventional), $39.99 (Castrol GTX), $49.99 (Castrol GTX HM), $59.99 (Castrol Edge), and $69.99 (Mobil 1).
This probably has little to do with their costs, and they don't specify the type of oil filter. I'm guessing it's probably one of those quickie lube specials like Champ or Fleet Guard - regardless of the oil that goes in. I can't really imagine that 5 quarts of Mobil 1 is really worth $40 more than their basic oil change.
Question. What is the shop's cost for the 5w-20 vs 0w-20 and what is the price difference between the two options for the customer? This is why I change the oil myself.
Every place I've seen charges an arm and a leg to use any "synthetic" while there may be specials for "conventional" for less than $20. Pep Boys has packages at $29.99 (conventional), $39.99 (Castrol GTX), $49.99 (Castrol GTX HM), $59.99 (Castrol Edge), and $69.99 (Mobil 1).
This probably has little to do with their costs, and they don't specify the type of oil filter. I'm guessing it's probably one of those quickie lube specials like Champ or Fleet Guard - regardless of the oil that goes in. I can't really imagine that 5 quarts of Mobil 1 is really worth $40 more than their basic oil change.
As far as what you should do, unless you are managing the shop it's beyond your pay grade.
What does your management want you to respond with should a customer want to do something not strictly recommended by their manufacturer or whatever computer system says.
Do you tell them sorry, or do you still accept the work.
This is beyond oil changes, but say also they come in with non-factory tires/rims or suspension changes, or also whatever under the hood engine mods.
Do you say sorry? or do you still accept the work.
What does your management want you to respond with should a customer want to do something not strictly recommended by their manufacturer or whatever computer system says.
Do you tell them sorry, or do you still accept the work.
This is beyond oil changes, but say also they come in with non-factory tires/rims or suspension changes, or also whatever under the hood engine mods.
Do you say sorry? or do you still accept the work.
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
That's pure speculation. I doubt there's any chance those engines will be ruined at all. Honda's and Toy's have been doing 10K intervals on conventional for years. Some of these engines are very easy on oil and it's well documented here.
I checked the maintenance interval recommendations for a 2013 Toyota Camry. They still don't have an OLM, but it's a specified 10K miles/1 year (normal schedule) for 0W-20. They spec 5K miles/6 months for severe service or if a 5W-20 is used. Of course they do it with a scheduled checklist and not simply a "do it every X miles". They state the first change is at 10K miles, and I'd assume the factory fill is 0W-20. At every 15K/25K/35K/etc miles they add this disclaimer:
Quote:
http://www.toyota.com/t3Portal/document/omms/T-MMS-13Camry/pdf/2013_Toyota_Camry_WMG.pdf
Note: If 0W-20 oil WAS NOT used at the last oil change, replace engine oil and oil filter.1
1 Reset the oil replacement reminder light (“MAINT REQD”) or the message “OIL MAINTENANCE REQUIRED” on the multi-information display after maintenance at every 5,000 miles.
That's pure speculation. I doubt there's any chance those engines will be ruined at all. Honda's and Toy's have been doing 10K intervals on conventional for years. Some of these engines are very easy on oil and it's well documented here.
I checked the maintenance interval recommendations for a 2013 Toyota Camry. They still don't have an OLM, but it's a specified 10K miles/1 year (normal schedule) for 0W-20. They spec 5K miles/6 months for severe service or if a 5W-20 is used. Of course they do it with a scheduled checklist and not simply a "do it every X miles". They state the first change is at 10K miles, and I'd assume the factory fill is 0W-20. At every 15K/25K/35K/etc miles they add this disclaimer:
Quote:
http://www.toyota.com/t3Portal/document/omms/T-MMS-13Camry/pdf/2013_Toyota_Camry_WMG.pdf
Note: If 0W-20 oil WAS NOT used at the last oil change, replace engine oil and oil filter.1
1 Reset the oil replacement reminder light (“MAINT REQD”) or the message “OIL MAINTENANCE REQUIRED” on the multi-information display after maintenance at every 5,000 miles.
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
There's a high chance that those engines will be ruined after 100k, not because of the viscosity but because of the oil change light calibration.
Cars that come factory filled with 0w20 have oil change lights calibrated for 7k+ OCI because 0w20 can only be made using full synth or at least a blend, no dino oil can reach that grade. If you put in 5w20 dino oil, then those cars are easily running 2-3k past the oil's life before the maintenance light turns on.
I agree mostly. However, OP puts PYB 5w-20 which is a quality oil, so it should be fine if the MM trips below 10k miles. Remember, Honda used to spec 10k for normal service. On the other had, I’m not too sure about those Fit which can trip between 10-15k....
There's a high chance that those engines will be ruined after 100k, not because of the viscosity but because of the oil change light calibration.
Cars that come factory filled with 0w20 have oil change lights calibrated for 7k+ OCI because 0w20 can only be made using full synth or at least a blend, no dino oil can reach that grade. If you put in 5w20 dino oil, then those cars are easily running 2-3k past the oil's life before the maintenance light turns on.
I agree mostly. However, OP puts PYB 5w-20 which is a quality oil, so it should be fine if the MM trips below 10k miles. Remember, Honda used to spec 10k for normal service. On the other had, I’m not too sure about those Fit which can trip between 10-15k....
My shop/mechanic charges $25 for 5-qt conventional and $50 for Mobil 1. $5 for very extra conventional quart above 5 and $10 for Mobil 1.
His cost of conventional oil is less than $3/qt, but his distributor charges him too much for M1, that why whenever Costco had $9-10 off coupon on M1 (once every 3-4 months) he and his wife bought 40-50 or more cases during that time.
When he ran out of M1 from Costco he bought 5-qt jugs from WM. But he prefers M1 in quart bottle because less chance to spill.
When I was lazy to change oil myself, I brought M1 and filter to his place, he charged $10 for labor. My cost of M1 and filter was about $30 so I saved $10, that is his profit for synthetic oil change, his profit for conventional oil change is about $5-7. These slim profits barely cover his overhead cost, his real profit is extensive repair jobs such as replace head gasket ...
His cost of conventional oil is less than $3/qt, but his distributor charges him too much for M1, that why whenever Costco had $9-10 off coupon on M1 (once every 3-4 months) he and his wife bought 40-50 or more cases during that time.
When he ran out of M1 from Costco he bought 5-qt jugs from WM. But he prefers M1 in quart bottle because less chance to spill.
When I was lazy to change oil myself, I brought M1 and filter to his place, he charged $10 for labor. My cost of M1 and filter was about $30 so I saved $10, that is his profit for synthetic oil change, his profit for conventional oil change is about $5-7. These slim profits barely cover his overhead cost, his real profit is extensive repair jobs such as replace head gasket ...
FS is $36, PYB is $40, the CP blend (which is who makes HGMO) is $56, and PP is $70...with a purolator classic clone. This is always why I change my own oil...but I get the best of both worlds, cuz I can do it myself in the shop after hours and don't have to deal with disposal or half of the mess.
Interesting to note that if your CX5 is bought outside the US & Can, that the recomended oil is 5w30. CAFE is the reason.
I don't think it will cause a dime's worth of difference out to 200k miles.
The same car/engine is spec'd differently the world over. My Prius C can use ANY weight oil, just depends on where you live.
But the difference between 0w/5w-20? Pfffft.
The same car/engine is spec'd differently the world over. My Prius C can use ANY weight oil, just depends on where you live.
But the difference between 0w/5w-20? Pfffft.
Originally Posted By: Mr_Incredible
I don't think it will cause a dime's worth of difference out to 200k miles.
The same car/engine is spec'd differently the world over. My Prius C can use ANY weight oil, just depends on where you live.
But the difference between 0w/5w-20? Pfffft.
^^ this
I don't think it will cause a dime's worth of difference out to 200k miles.
The same car/engine is spec'd differently the world over. My Prius C can use ANY weight oil, just depends on where you live.
But the difference between 0w/5w-20? Pfffft.
^^ this
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
This is a great post. I do a lot of reading about oils and am seeing a lot of car makers using 0W20 as their spec'd oil.
My engine (4.2 V6) was built from 1996-2008 and was originally spec'd 5W30. The internal clearances had never changed in all of those years. It's now spec'd 5W20 but I do use 5W30 in it every now and then.
I wonder if my engine would tolerate an 0W20 oil. Interesting.
I made this post to lay out the background of my engine, hoping someone would comment on the very last statement in my post.
Someone stated that there was really no difference between a 0WXX and a 5WXX. Being I live in Louisiana, would I gain anything from using a 0W20 oil?
This is a great post. I do a lot of reading about oils and am seeing a lot of car makers using 0W20 as their spec'd oil.
My engine (4.2 V6) was built from 1996-2008 and was originally spec'd 5W30. The internal clearances had never changed in all of those years. It's now spec'd 5W20 but I do use 5W30 in it every now and then.
I wonder if my engine would tolerate an 0W20 oil. Interesting.
I made this post to lay out the background of my engine, hoping someone would comment on the very last statement in my post.
Someone stated that there was really no difference between a 0WXX and a 5WXX. Being I live in Louisiana, would I gain anything from using a 0W20 oil?
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
[I made this post to lay out the background of my engine, hoping someone would comment on the very last statement in my post.
Someone stated that there was really no difference between a 0WXX and a 5WXX. Being I live in Louisiana, would I gain anything from using a 0W20 oil?
You can use a 0W20 in place of a 5W20, sure. The higher VI would probably offer a mileage increase, although it may not be perceptible in your application.
[I made this post to lay out the background of my engine, hoping someone would comment on the very last statement in my post.
Someone stated that there was really no difference between a 0WXX and a 5WXX. Being I live in Louisiana, would I gain anything from using a 0W20 oil?
You can use a 0W20 in place of a 5W20, sure. The higher VI would probably offer a mileage increase, although it may not be perceptible in your application.
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
[I made this post to lay out the background of my engine, hoping someone would comment on the very last statement in my post.
Someone stated that there was really no difference between a 0WXX and a 5WXX. Being I live in Louisiana, would I gain anything from using a 0W20 oil?
You can use a 0W20 in place of a 5W20, sure. The higher VI would probably offer a mileage increase, although it may not be perceptible in your application.
The mileage thing is no big deal to me. I am looking at the benefits of the 0WXX at startup as opposed to the 5WXX at startup. I understand most engine wear is at startup. That's where I would like to benefit my engine.
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
[I made this post to lay out the background of my engine, hoping someone would comment on the very last statement in my post.
Someone stated that there was really no difference between a 0WXX and a 5WXX. Being I live in Louisiana, would I gain anything from using a 0W20 oil?
You can use a 0W20 in place of a 5W20, sure. The higher VI would probably offer a mileage increase, although it may not be perceptible in your application.
The mileage thing is no big deal to me. I am looking at the benefits of the 0WXX at startup as opposed to the 5WXX at startup. I understand most engine wear is at startup. That's where I would like to benefit my engine.
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