Great technical article that I found about the new ZF 9-speed automatic used in the new Jeeps and soon to be in others. It's above my head but still a great read.
The Truth About Cars
The Truth About Cars
ZF 9-speed disection
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Thanks for posting that. A very interesting read.
I like the injenuity, I dont like the complexity.
Just imagine fluid protection requirements when this sucker starts spinning over 10k rpm in 9th gear. It will need quite a computer/sensor aray to work all those dog brakes and friction disks in the right order.
Just imagine fluid protection requirements when this sucker starts spinning over 10k rpm in 9th gear. It will need quite a computer/sensor aray to work all those dog brakes and friction disks in the right order.
^^^Yeah, people said the same thing about their ubiquitous 8 speed that is in BMW's, Bentley's, Jags, and many more.
Some extremely high torque AWD platforms use the 8 speed and have had no issue.
Expect durability...
Some extremely high torque AWD platforms use the 8 speed and have had no issue.
Expect durability...
I drive a car with a very complex transmission by Getrag, and the first time someone developed a way to rebuild them, it cost $4000. Very few companies can even do the job. Prices are just starting to drop. Before that, the only other option was to pay $9000 for a whole transmission.
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Great question. I guess with a fist full of cash you can get someone to rebuild one. How good will the rebuild be? That's a whole new story.
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Great question. I guess with a fist full of cash you can get someone to rebuild one. How good will the rebuild be? That's a whole new story.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Great question. I guess with a fist full of cash you can get someone to rebuild one. How good will the rebuild be? That's a whole new story.
Sometimes a rebuild can be better than new, if replacement parts are re-engineered and made from better material.
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Great question. I guess with a fist full of cash you can get someone to rebuild one. How good will the rebuild be? That's a whole new story.
Sometimes a rebuild can be better than new, if replacement parts are re-engineered and made from better material.
Originally Posted By: artificialist
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Great question. I guess with a fist full of cash you can get someone to rebuild one. How good will the rebuild be? That's a whole new story.
Sometimes a rebuild can be better than new, if replacement parts are re-engineered and made from better material.
True but 'if' is a big word. I think finding someone able to rebuild one of these would be a daunting task. Maybe in a few years it will be another story.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How much are the newer ZF transmissions going to cost to rebuild, and who will be able to rebuild them?
Great question. I guess with a fist full of cash you can get someone to rebuild one. How good will the rebuild be? That's a whole new story.
Sometimes a rebuild can be better than new, if replacement parts are re-engineered and made from better material.
True but 'if' is a big word. I think finding someone able to rebuild one of these would be a daunting task. Maybe in a few years it will be another story.
Originally Posted By: PhillipM
If it went together, it'll come apart...
Exactly.
The HUGE number of car models using ZF-sourced transmissions means there will be a market for repairs. Thus there will be training and parts.
This is EXACTLY what we discussed decades ago when overdrive 4 speed slushboxes first arrived on the scene...
If it went together, it'll come apart...
Exactly.
The HUGE number of car models using ZF-sourced transmissions means there will be a market for repairs. Thus there will be training and parts.
This is EXACTLY what we discussed decades ago when overdrive 4 speed slushboxes first arrived on the scene...
Originally Posted By: PhillipM
If it went together, it'll come apart...
True, there will be a learning curve though just like with anything else. Early adapters getting a rebuild job will probably be the testers just like with anything else early on in the automotive world.
I remember the ZF slush box in my son's BMW, sealed for life [IIRC] and the reverse drum issues he had with it. That could be tainting my initial opinions a bit.
Then again this could be the best slush box ever, I haven't owned on to base an actual long term opinion on. The good news is I will keep an open mind.
If it went together, it'll come apart...
True, there will be a learning curve though just like with anything else. Early adapters getting a rebuild job will probably be the testers just like with anything else early on in the automotive world.
I remember the ZF slush box in my son's BMW, sealed for life [IIRC] and the reverse drum issues he had with it. That could be tainting my initial opinions a bit.
i have read that the car sourced zf 9 speeds will not have the dog clutches in gears 6-9. the dog clutches are a jeep thing only.
Here is an interesting tech article on the 9 speed auto from Mercedes Benz:
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2014/03/20140306-9gtronic.html
"In practice this translates into being able to drive at 120 km/h (75 mph) in 9th gear with an engine speed of around only 1350 rpm, for example. [with V6 diesel]"
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2014/03/20140306-9gtronic.html
"In practice this translates into being able to drive at 120 km/h (75 mph) in 9th gear with an engine speed of around only 1350 rpm, for example. [with V6 diesel]"
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If your too lazy to shift yourself then a 2sp Poweglide should be good enough.
POWERGLIDE
It still has the same parts we have been relying on for decades, just a more clever utilisation. Thanks for the post.
Modded C4 or C10 is the go these days. I remember when you couldn't give 'em away......
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