If I were designing a transmission filtration and pan system, I'd make it a lot more serviceable, taking ques from engine maintenance. Make the pan drain thru a filter that is a lot easier to replace. Why are transmission made so difficult to service? Is it because they need to be served so infrequently, say 50-100k miles?
Why aren't transmissions more easily servicable?
- Thread starter MrLemonade
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the light-duty stuff is set up to run the warranty duration. The heavy duty equipment features readily accessible pans & filters.
I'm sure it makes sense to the bean counters, every threaded boss & bolt costs something........... the world we choose to live in.
I'm sure it makes sense to the bean counters, every threaded boss & bolt costs something........... the world we choose to live in.
That's sorta my conclusion. But even so, perhaps more frequent or easier servicing (also less expensive) might very well extend the life of a transmission.
Now, that gets into a conflict of interest for auto makers who don't necessary WANT a 400k miles transmission b/c that means less new car buying. The timeless debate on planned obsolescence. Designing what is BEST for the product and consumer, against what is BEST for the company to make a good-enough product but not a great product.
People overfill and damage the transmissions, people pour oil down trans fill tube. Even with sealed transmissions you hear about stories where quick lube places drain the trans fluid instead of oil and overfill the engine with twice the capacity.
Hyundai (in my instance) covers the transmission for 100,000 miles. The Dealer (I called them) recommends a 60,000 mile service. Which, BTW-I agree with. I have a coupon for $30.00 off that service, that I need to use by the end of June. It will probably be close to 50,000 miles-at that time. So the service will probably run about $160.00. And I will be sure to get SPlV fluid. That's an OK deal-IMHO.
Hyundai-via the owners manual basically states it's a "lifetime fluid".
The car will be replaced shortly before 100,000 miles.
Only Ford/GM/Chrysler are stupid enough to not include a drain plug on their transmissions. Basically everyone else does. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Subaru, etc, all have drain plugs in their transmissions. The Saturn S-series has a drain plug because they were actually trying to compete, and overseas GM cars such as the Catera and Spark have one, and the transmissions they make for others (the 4L30 that BMW used, for example). Transmissions shared between Ford and Mazda have a drain plug on a Mazda but not on a Ford 
Transmission filters don't do much and don't need to be replaced. Even cars with spin-on transmission filters (some Subarus, Saturn S-series, etc) only require a filter replacement if it gets damaged. There is no combustion in the transmission.
Even before so-called "lifetime fluid" nobody ever changed the ATF anyway
Maybe you might like the ZF 8-speed? It has the filter integrated into a replaceable/disposable oil pan.
Also, Honda makes it very easy to change the fluid on their CVT
Transmission filters don't do much and don't need to be replaced. Even cars with spin-on transmission filters (some Subarus, Saturn S-series, etc) only require a filter replacement if it gets damaged. There is no combustion in the transmission.
Even before so-called "lifetime fluid" nobody ever changed the ATF anyway
Maybe you might like the ZF 8-speed? It has the filter integrated into a replaceable/disposable oil pan.
Also, Honda makes it very easy to change the fluid on their CVT
This. They may be lifetime, but still serviceable for those of us who choose to do so. The vast majority of people never will, so they design for the 99%, 100k milers. it is just a business decision. New transmissions on average are lower maintenance/higher reliability than any in history. Of course I don't have data to back that up but I would be surprised if anyone had data to the contrary.Only Ford/GM/Chrysler are stupid enough to not include a drain plug on their transmissions. Basically everyone else does. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Subaru, etc, all have drain plugs in their transmissions. The Saturn S-series has a drain plug because they were actually trying to compete, and overseas GM cars such as the Catera and Spark have one, and the transmissions they make for others (the 4L30 that BMW used, for example). Transmissions shared between Ford and Mazda have a drain plug on a Mazda but not on a Ford
Transmission filters don't do much and don't need to be replaced. Even cars with spin-on transmission filters (some Subarus, Saturn S-series, etc) only require a filter replacement if it gets damaged. There is no combustion in the transmission.
Even before so-called "lifetime fluid" nobody ever changed the ATF anyway
Maybe you might like the ZF 8-speed? It has the filter integrated into a replaceable/disposable oil pan.
Also, Honda makes it very easy to change the fluid on their CVT
Very true, and believe me the folks running the OEM vehicle assembly lines fought like crazy to have the transmission come as a filled sealed unit with plug in fittings for the external cooler. The process of filling / setting the fluid on the main line was always messy and prone to mistakes.
According to my old Chevy dealer, if you want it to have a longer lifetime, change the fluid.
Replacing a filter on a correctly operating transmission is a "BITOG Money Flush". Almost all GM dealers replace the transmission fluid via a "fluid exchange" machine, as a standard service. Noticed I said exchange-it's not a "flush".Only Ford/GM/Chrysler are stupid enough to not include a drain plug on their transmissions. Basically everyone else does. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Subaru, etc, all have drain plugs in their transmissions. The Saturn S-series has a drain plug because they were actually trying to compete, and overseas GM cars such as the Catera and Spark have one, and the transmissions they make for others (the 4L30 that BMW used, for example). Transmissions shared between Ford and Mazda have a drain plug on a Mazda but not on a Ford
Transmission filters don't do much and don't need to be replaced. Even cars with spin-on transmission filters (some Subarus, Saturn S-series, etc) only require a filter replacement if it gets damaged. There is no combustion in the transmission.
Even before so-called "lifetime fluid" nobody ever changed the ATF anyway
Maybe you might like the ZF 8-speed? It has the filter integrated into a replaceable/disposable oil pan.
Also, Honda makes it very easy to change the fluid on their CVT
For most trucks it's more messy than difficult (zip off pan bolts, unpress fit and zip a bolt or two off for the filter). Also a good portion of what needs to be serviced (mainly cleaning the pan and pan magnet which are always dirty) have no short cut, pan has to be dropped. My Nissan has a pan drain but this makes it easy to be lazy and half booty it.
Some manufacturers though like Toyota make the procedure particularly annoying.
Some manufacturers though like Toyota make the procedure particularly annoying.
Because a guy like me who has been a bitog member for over 10 years but he’s never actually gone under a car and changed the oil can buy siphon pump 6.3 L and throw that thing in his dipstick for the engine and for the transmission fluid and is constantly throwing different synthetic fluids in his transmission maybe not always measuring the best. The siphon pump leveled the field for non-mechanical folks like me to change fluids at random.
Now on the flip side of this argument... I have a 2000 Lexus LS400...bought used with 134000 for about 4000 dollars and now has close to 250000... I’ve had transmission fluid done professionally but when I’m in the mood I’ll safe and 2 quarts out and throw 2 quarts of red line D4 in sometimes I mix with with a high temperature Redline...I’ll get a heavy duty synthetic filter like a Purolator boss and midway through I will symphon the engine oil out and put fresh oil in there.... and it’s also enable me to change the power steering fluid slowly siphoning about 8 ounces out doing the steering wheel turn thing and doing that every week or so to get fresh fluid in there......I use expensive boutique oils like Redline... also have Neo 75w90rhd in differential... my philosophy when have older vehicle paid off can splurge and maintain with high end synthetic oils... so am happy have access to all that... although feel like imposter for not actually mechanically doing the work like majority of good-mechanically-inclined folks on here do.
Where do you get your info? Lots of newer Toyotas (and other mfrs as well) have the silly standpipe thing in the trans pan requiring you to pump fluid UP and into the pan - which is not fun or convenient.Only Ford/GM/Chrysler are stupid enough to not include a drain plug on their transmissions. Basically everyone else does. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Subaru, etc, all have drain plugs in their transmissions. The Saturn S-series has a drain plug because they were actually trying to compete, and overseas GM cars such as the Catera and Spark have one, and the transmissions they make for others (the 4L30 that BMW used, for example). Transmissions shared between Ford and Mazda have a drain plug on a Mazda but not on a Ford
Transmission filters don't do much and don't need to be replaced. Even cars with spin-on transmission filters (some Subarus, Saturn S-series, etc) only require a filter replacement if it gets damaged. There is no combustion in the transmission.
Even before so-called "lifetime fluid" nobody ever changed the ATF anyway
Maybe you might like the ZF 8-speed? It has the filter integrated into a replaceable/disposable oil pan.
Also, Honda makes it very easy to change the fluid on their CVT
American vehicles that I've owned or leased that had an ATF drain plug and fill tube:
'02 Ford Escape, '09 Ford Fusion, '15 Cadillac SRX and '18 GMC Terrain.
Editing that particular statement out for an *.
In particular, to the newest transmission, I have to service, the 10R80. Its filter is a pretty complex little thing that I think I'm going to replace early (30-60K) as it is such a complicated transmission with a crazy amount of fluid circuity and solenoids that I think people are going to want to err on the side of caution with it. Ford puts their first 'non-severe change at around 150k. Time will tell, but I think these things are going to be too sensitive to go that far. I may well be wrong, but I don't want to find out the hard way. It's also an actual pleated filter as opposed to the usual 'rock catcher' type.
And no drain plug.
And a stupid procedure for checking the level where you are guaranteed 2nd or 3rd-degree burns.
But I do love my 2 Honda cars. Dain, fill, done. (Although the Accord does have an easily replaceable filter)
I was thinking about this recently and I came away with the conclusion that, (in my own experience-statistically), I seem to have as many tranny issues when properly maintaining an automatic transmission as if I were to just leave it alone for the duration that I drive the vehicle. And I have drive/owned my vehicles no less than 11-12 years(since the 1980s) and changed the fluid or fluid & screen(OR NOT) on regular basis. Keeps me wondering!
Although I am trying to cut down on the duration that I own/drive a vehicle due to having other issues including(mainly) RUST when I keep the vehicle into its teens. I've always wanted to keep a daily driver for 20 years however, (18 years has been my record) and it's just too hard to keep'em even past 12 years. And I ain't gettin' any younger.
Although I am trying to cut down on the duration that I own/drive a vehicle due to having other issues including(mainly) RUST when I keep the vehicle into its teens. I've always wanted to keep a daily driver for 20 years however, (18 years has been my record) and it's just too hard to keep'em even past 12 years. And I ain't gettin' any younger.
I think so many people get rid of vehicles before 100K miles that most manufacturers don't really care. My goal for ownership is 100k miles and it will take me 10 years to drive 100K miles and my wife 12-13 years to drive 100k miles. Both vehicles are paid off after 4 years and so we can drive them 6-9 years with no payments, sell the vehicle and get something new. The chances of anything transmission fluid-related happening are slim.
I think 10-13 years of ownership is on the high end even of my mileage is not. Most people seem to get a new vehicle every 5-7 years.
I think 10-13 years of ownership is on the high end even of my mileage is not. Most people seem to get a new vehicle every 5-7 years.
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