Which Synthetics use group IV base stock?

[RDY4WAR]

What are real synthetics?

He's still living in the 90s and thinks PAO is the only real synthetic. Group III has better solvency, additive response, and P-V coefficient than PAO in the conditions seen by a daily driver while being far cheaper. Unless you're at -40°F or >300°F, there's no advantage to using PAO over Group III within the typical use of a daily commuter.

 

[4WD]

Base-stocks make base oil.
So if Warren “synthetic“ was 80% Grp3 + 20% Grp2 (in the base oil) would you know?

P66 does not even move from hydro processing to cracking at Grp3

 

[tolian21]

Or perhaps marketing did a good job convincing general population that Group3 is cheaper and better than Group4.

 

[4WD]

Or perhaps marketing did a good job convincing general population that Group3 is cheaper and better than Group4.

I think the integrated oil companies and filter makers were giving us long lasting products
But, IMO, engine designers need to get a grip on fuel dilution and cheap induction parts to support more and more vehicles making 10k the new 5k like we made 5k the new 3k …

I have no issue doing 10k in our NA 2.0L Fusion … but Ford says we can go 9k in that stressed out 2.3L TDI?
Dunno about that …

 

[RDY4WAR]

Or perhaps marketing did a good job convincing general population that Group3 is cheaper and better than Group4.

Not marketing but rather data from hundreds of trials comparing the two. NASCAR engines, which operate at 280*F sump temp and 350*F bearing temps, use a 0w-20 oil that's majority group III. Let that sink in for a minute.

 

[kstanf150]

Not marketing but rather data from hundreds of trials comparing the two. NASCAR engines, which operate at 280*F sump temp and 350*F bearing temps, use a 0w-20 oil that's majority group III. Let that sink in for a minute.

I’ve always want to know what’s actually in the sump of those engines. Do see many oil related issues anymore

 

[tolian21]

I’m on

Not marketing but rather data from hundreds of trials comparing the two. NASCAR engines, which operate at 280*F sump temp and 350*F bearing temps, use a 0w-20 oil that's majority group III. Let that sink in for a minute.

NASCAR engines running 0w-20? Hmn....
So they have data that group3 base oil can perform good with right additives, does not make it superior

 

[RDY4WAR]

I’m on

NASCAR engines running 0w-20? Hmn....
So they have data that group3 base oil can perform good with right additives, does not make it superior

It's a light 0w-20 to a heavy 0w-16 (KV100 = ~7.8 cSt). It actually does perform superior to PAO with less valvetrain and cylinder wear attributed to better additive response with the group III base oil. We're talking about the highest budget racing programs in the US if not the world. These guys spending hundreds of thousands researching ways to gain a 0.5 hp advantage. If there was an advantage to using a majority PAO base oil, they'd be using it.

Here's an article in Machinery Lubrication detailing how group III base oils are rivaling PAO in many areas and superior in some areas.

"A modern Group III oil can actually outperform a PAO in several areas important to lubricants, such as additive solubility, lubricity and antiwear performance. Group III base oils can now rival PAO stocks in pour point, viscosity index and oxidation stability performance."

Performance of Base Oils and Future Trends - The Evolution of Base Oil Technology - Part 3

This is the third of a three-part series on base oil technologies and applications. Lubrication technology evolved slowly from ancient times until the 1950s. Solvent-refining technology then...

www.machinerylubrication.com

 

[2EHA]

we are witnessing the rise of the Group II+/GIII blend. some of y’all will be dragged kicking and screaming into this new era of affordable high performance motor oils

 

[tolian21]

we are witnessing the rise of the Group II+/GIII blend. some of y’all will be dragged kicking and screaming into this new era of affordable high performance motor oils

Nice, cheaper and better.