Which HPL Oil For My Next Ram OCI

[spasm3]

When you get the UOA results, I'll bet you lunch that this oil is almost like new. If it is good for continued service, will you continue to run it?

I'm going to change it, and do a uoa. I'm sure you are correct, I'm thinking i could go 3 years easily at this mileage, but uoa will confirm.

I'm going to change, as with only 6500 miles on it, and the oil went in at 2200 , there could have been some break- in happening between 2200 miles and now. So i feel good changing it out. The next run I'm sure can be extended.

 

[twX]

As someone running a 180 tstat, do you have any more info you can share on this? Curious where you got the data that says "only enrichment below 140" as that has been a concern for me as well.

I tune my Subaru engine with engine management software, so I have access to the stock enrichment tables.

Most of the enrichment is from post-start enrichment, which tapers off after the engine is started and is only active for up to ~40 seconds. There's a smaller amount of warm-up enrichment based on coolant temperature and engine load, but it's only significant at low coolant temperatures.

By 40°C, there's only a very small amount of warm-up enrichment, and only at higher engine loads. By 60°C, there's no enrichment at all. Full coolant temp is 90°C. It may differ a bit by vehicle, but I can't imagine any other manufacturers are using any enrichment at 80°C given the importance of fuel economy tests.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

So no Turbo and no GDI.....
You could drop down to a PCEO 0w40 it's highlights include advanced VI Improver that has a superior shear stability index.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

The PCMO Premium Plus line seems to be geared toward really good low temperature performance, which you really don't need. They'll have more VII and will shear-thin more.

@High Performance Lubricants has shared several times that they use a nearly shear-resistant Star VII. There won’t be any significant mechanical shearing in their oils like there is with commodity products.

 

[hemioiler]

@High Performance Lubricants has shared several times that they use a nearly shear-resistant Star VII. There won’t be any significant mechanical shearing in their oils like there is with commodity products.

I did a VOA of PP 0w-30 and it came back with a cSt of 10.71. After +/- 8000 miles, the same batch of now used oil came back with a cSt of 10.21. It probably had about 9 hours of towing my RV, and the rest was all autumn through spring daily driving.

I don't know the significance of that, but that's all according to blackstone, doesn't seem like much sheer to me.

TBN was at 5.6.

 

[RDY4WAR]

Either the Super Car 0W/5W-40 or No VII 5W-30.

I did a VOA of PP 0w-30 and it came back with a cSt of 10.71. After +/- 8000 miles, the same batch of now used oil came back with a cSt of 10.21. It probably had about 9 hours of towing my RV, and the rest was all autumn through spring daily driving.

I don't know the significance of that, but that's all according to blackstone, doesn't seem like much sheer to me.

TBN was at 5.6.

That 10.21 cSt KV100 is after the oil has undergone oxidative thickening. It's likely the oil sheared down to a 9.0-9.5 cSt range before thickening back to 10.21 cSt. HPL's oils will frequently have a higher viscosity in used samples than in virgin samples since their oils hardly shear, thus all you get is the oxidative thickening.

 

[Thermo1223]

How many HEMIs have you worked on/owned?

1 but my point is common knowledge that anyone who works on FI vehicles would know.

 

[Thermo1223]

A 180 thermo and different housing was one of the parts in the procharger kit along with maf and spark plugs

Well going forced induction is way different than stock and you already have altered tuning for colder plugs and a different MAF.

With mine the oil temp rarely rises above water boiling which is important

With forced induction oil temp is more important.

 

[D1sc]

Well going forced induction is way different than stock and you already have altered tuning for colder plugs and a different MAF.



With forced induction oil temp is more important.

Sorry but IATs are way more important which is why I have a system that sprays co2 or nitrous on my intercooler.Putting a b&m oil oil cooler is a good idea until it springs a leak and destroys your engine. Been there.

 

[Thermo1223]

Sorry but IATs are way more important which is why I have a system that sprays co2 or nitrous on my intercooler.Putting a b&m oil oil cooler is a good idea until it springs a leak and destroys your engine. Been there.

Yes IAT are important but so is oil & coolant. It's all mutually exclusive just like proper fueling. Using proper AN fittings it should be fine. Anything can leak but that is not a reason to not use it.

 

[goingplacesanddoingstuff]

The PCMO Premium Plus line seems to be geared toward really good low temperature performance, which you really don't need. They'll have more VII and will shear-thin more.

What is the basis for this claim? My understanding is that they use a high end star polymer that resists shearing.

 

[Vitamin Yoda]

1 but my point is common knowledge that anyone who works on FI vehicles would know.

The RAM 2500 most likely has a more capable cooling system, and it may run cooler, so the OP might not need to touch the thermostat.

However, my 2016 RAM 1500 couldn't tow 3000 lbs. without coolant and oil temps going up to 245F~250F. That's not healthy for the engine. Not long term. Replacing the thermostat was not enough. I also had to remove 8 out of 12 grille shutters for the engine to have any chance of a long life. Once I did these small mods, I never had an issue with it again. I hear that RAM fixed most of the overheating issues in the DT models. However, running a 180F thermostat will have no negative impact on a HEMI. Now, running a 160F, that could be a problem. Though our 2016 wouldn't care if it was a 160F either.

The reason why it wouldn't care is due to the limitations of the cooling system. Even without a thermostat, and pure distilled water in the system, it still reaches 185F going down the highway, without towing anything.

RAM knows all this, and their fix for the RAM 1500 was to recommend customers to run 89 octane fuel. Once it starts heating up, the engine will pull back timing. That's why you need higher octane fuel. Mine runs just fine on regular cheap fuel.

 

[D1sc]

My ram has been on my builders mustang dyno twice and definitely has a great cooling system but outside air temps will affect the tune the most even cancel it.Todays oils can handle any temp the cooling system can.

 

[Astro14]

The PCMO Premium Plus line seems to be geared toward really good low temperature performance, which you really don't need. They'll have more VII and will shear-thin more.

I'd consider the PCMO 10W-40. The HTHS is 4.06 cP (vs the 3.5 cP your engine specs) and the VII content is low. It's pretty much a thin 15W though, so not great for starts much below 0°F.

Really? The HPL in Wayne’s Doge didn’t shear after 34,000 miles.

I’ll say that again, because it bears repeating. 34,000 miles. No shear.

Where is the basis for your claim? Rooted in how ordinary oils perform?

 

[twX]

What is the basis for this claim? My understanding is that they use a high end star polymer that resists shearing.

Really? The HPL in Wayne’s Doge didn’t shear after 34,000 miles.

I’ll say that again, because it bears repeating. 34,000 miles. No shear.

Where is the basis for your claim? Rooted in how ordinary oils perform?

I should have expanded on that a little more. I was also referring to normal (temporary) shear-thinning, not just permanent shear-thinning. The higher-VII 5W-40 will be thinner at high shear rates than the 10W-40.

 

[Vitamin Yoda]

Really? The HPL in Wayne’s Doge didn’t shear after 34,000 miles.

I’ll say that again, because it bears repeating. 34,000 miles. No shear.

Where is the basis for your claim? Rooted in how ordinary oils perform?

HPL motor oils don't shear, period, even the lowest tier PCMO doesn't. That's due to excellent VII, base oil selection, and the use of POE and AN.

The main difference between the product lines is this:
1) PCMO - Group III, no PPDs to deteriorate the oil, POE+AN, high quality olefin polymer VII.
2) PCMO Premium - PAO, POE+AN, high quality olefin polymer VII.
3) PCMO Premium Plus - PAO, POE+AN, star polymer VII (indestructible).
4) PCMO NO-VII - PAO, POE+AN, mPAO technology instead of VII. This is applied differently than VII, in larger quantities, and enhances lubricity and film strength.

You can't buy motor oil formulated like this from any other blender today, period.

 

[hemioiler]

HPL motor oils don't shear, period, even the lowest tier PCMO doesn't. That's due to excellent VII, base oil selection, and the use of POE and AN.

The main difference between the product lines is this:
1) PCMO - Group III, no PPDs to deteriorate the oil, POE+AN, high quality olefin polymer VII.
2) PCMO Premium - PAO, POE+AN, high quality olefin polymer VII.
3) PCMO Premium Plus - PAO, POE+AN, star polymer VII (indestructible).
4) PCMO NO-VII - PAO, POE+AN, mPAO technology instead of VII. This is applied differently than VII, in larger quantities, and enhances lubricity and film strength.

You can't buy motor oil formulated like this from any other blender today, period.

Nice summary. What about their Euro and Super Car formulas?

 

[Vitamin Yoda]

Nice summary. What about their Euro and Super Car formulas?

The PCMO uses a Dexos 1 Gen3 additive package. The Euro oils use a VW508 (0W-20), or VW504 additive package, except for 5W-40, that one uses a VW502 add pack.

The Supercar series is PAO+POE+AN+Star Polymer+VW502 add pack. I'd say that the Supercar series goes head to head with the NO-VII Euro oils. Basically, of you need the cold flow properties, go with the Supercar series, otherwise go with the NO-VII Euro series. The VW502 add pack is beefier when it comes to anti wear additives, and unless you have an oil burner, definitively pick an Euro oil. That's not to say that the Dexos 1 Gen 3 oils are inferior. They're just different in the sense that they were engineered for resource conserving lubes. The bottom line is that you can't go wrong with any of HPL's offerings.

 

[hemioiler]

The PCMO uses a Dexos 1 Gen3 additive package. The Euro oils use a VW508 (0W-20), or VW504 additive package, except for 5W-40, that one uses a VW502 add pack.

The Supercar series is PAO+POE+AN+Star Polymer+VW502 add pack. I'd say that the Supercar series goes head to head with the NO-VII Euro oils. Basically, of you need the cold flow properties, go with the Supercar series, otherwise go with the NO-VII Euro series. The VW502 add pack is beefier when it comes to anti wear additives, and unless you have an oil burner, definitively pick an Euro oil. That's not to say that the Dexos 1 Gen 3 oils are inferior. They're just different in the sense that they were engineered for resource conserving lubes. The bottom line is that you can't go wrong with any of HPL's offerings.

When it comes to beefier anti wear; is it simply a quantity thing, in that the Euro has more of them so the oil can be run longer without an oil change, or, is it a quality thing in that the Euro oil offers more protection every day for your engine while the oil is in use?

In other words, if one changes their oil every 5 to 7k, does the beefier anti wear matter? Or does it only start to matter when you are running very long oil changes past 15k miles for example?

 

[Vitamin Yoda]

When it comes to beefier anti wear; is it simply a quantity thing, in that the Euro has more of them so the oil can be run longer without an oil change, or, is it a quality thing in that the Euro oil offers more protection every day for your engine while the oil is in use?

In other words, if one changes their oil every 5 to 7k, does the beefier anti wear matter? Or does it only start to matter when you are running very long oil changes past 15k miles for example?

That's why I said that you can't go wrong with any one of their oils you pick. For example, I have a Hyundai that I run NO-VII Euro 5W-30 in. It's got some seals inside the CVVTs that need the Euro add pack, otherwise the oil leaks out of them when the engine is off. So the differences are subtle.

Think about this for a moment: HPL's BAS racing oil is based on the Dexos 1 Gen 3 add pack.