What Keith at Dan Wesson said about 1911 rail lube.

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Morning folks..

Just got a new black 9mm TCP and doing some research about lubes and found this..

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Keith DW said:
Grease is great is theory. In reality, guns get dirty when shot. Has anyone noticed what happens to grease around dirt? It grabs it like a magnet. So what happens when you mix dirt and grease? It becomes a gritty paste, which is just like lapping compound. Would you lubricate with lapping compound?

Oil will also attract dirt but the dirt still has the ability to move around, rather than to be trapped.

Grease isn't bad. I have some looser autos that I have used it for. This gives the dirt more room to move and makes the slide feel tighter. However, for a tight 1911 I only recommend DW rail lube, FP-10 or Militec 1. There may be other good choices out there but these have been proven here.

Oils such as Rem oil, Hoppe's and the like, I only recommend for the surface and small moving parts.

Also, Beware of gun cleaners such as CLP that is not polymer safe. Though our Duty finish is not Polymer these "gun scrubbers" will damage the look of our Duty finish. Using oil as a cleaner is all you need. A little oil, nylon brush and elbow grease does wonders. Kroil, btw, is a great oil cleaner. It will even remove copper fouling from your barrel. Bench rest shooters have been using it for years.

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I used Mobile 1 for the first cleaning because I had it, but wondering if I should buy DW rail lube, FP-10 or Militec 1 to add to the million different oils I already have laying around. I also have some amsoil 75w-90 GL-4 gear lube, synthetic ATF etc etc.

Probably over thinking this, but glad I now know about grease on the rails and which oils can dull the DW black finish or Duty Treatment (DT) (ferritic nitrocarburizing), because that would piss me off.
 
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Overthinking. Watch this video from Rob (Alchemy Custom Arms). Rob is a hard charging no BS kind of guy. Skip grease on a tight 1911 as the grease gets pushed out. Oil film remains when grease fails in this application. I was a grease guy until I bought my first Alchemy. I've been using oil in a needle dropper for my Sigs, 1911's, HK's since. For those times when a grease is appropriate, I use Enos Slide Glide.

Speaks of grease as an error at about 3:30 mark in the video.

Wanted to add: Don't take my statement as truth without testing or asking DW but IIRC I read on 1911 forum that Breakfree CLP is safe for this DW finish. I shoot a lot and clean a lot. I've used Breakfree for over 20 years. Buy it by the gallon on Amazon.

 
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Mikek13

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Overthinking. Watch this video from Rob (Alchemy Custom Arms). Rob is a hard charging no BS kind of guy. Skip grease on a tight 1911 as the grease gets pushed out. Oil film remains when grease fails in this application. I was a grease guy until I bought my first Alchemy. I've been using oil in a needle dropper for my Sigs, 1911's, HK's since.


Maybe, but Rob didn't mention that the CLP he recommends is not polymer safe and will damage the look of DW Duty finish.
 
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Just use a MIL-PRF-63460F CLP on your handgun and call it a day. There is nothing in this formulation that would harm any metal or plastic components. Alternatively, a very light grease such as TW25B rubbed onto the metal where it's no longer white works well.
 
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Maybe, but Rob didn't mention that the CLP he recommends is not polymer safe and will damage the look of DW Duty finish.

I don't blame him; DW is not anything for him to speak off. I had read it on a 1911 forum in a DW sub-forum. Something to look into maybe.
 
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Keith doesn't qualify his statement regarding how dirty guns get when shot. For a competition gun, yep that grease and firing residue can be substantial. For a CCW gun, grease on the rails won't hurt it nor would I worry much about a gun that is taken to the rangea couple times a year, fired 50 times and then thoroughly cleaned and re-lubed.

The materials that the gun is made from matter as well. FP10 is good stuff on all stainless guns. So is RIG stainless grease. When used sparingly that is. On tightly fitted match guns, you can't go wrong with good old Break Free CLP with maybe a dab of grease on the disconnector rail.

His advice was too generalized.
 

Mikek13

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I don't blame him; DW is not anything for him to speak off. I had read it on a 1911 forum in a DW sub-forum. Something to look into maybe.

I see now Keith says "Beware of gun cleaners such as CLP that are not polymer safe." which I think means beware of dino or symthetic blend CLP's. And that MIL-PRF-63460F CLP is safe since it's 100% synthetic, but my hoppe's #9 is a blend even though Keith says "I only recommend for the surface"? .. And folks on the 1911 forum say they have used #9 on DW black Duty Treatment without problems?.🤪

Heck idk, lets just say I once again fell down the rabbit hole, but learned always use synthetic oils on my TCP.
 
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A quality 1911 is a very tough gun, I use what ever oil on my 1911s. Though I use Gear oil on the slide for the first few hundred rounds on a 1911 when new.
 
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There are many instances of two issues with DW:

1) Locking up during break in using light oil like Remoil

2) Finish damage from cleaners/ CLP.

DW “Duty Treat” is some form of nitrocarburizing but seems somewhat delicate where chemicals are concerned.

Just do what they say…

Use whatever is terrible advice where these are concerned…

They even give you the lube now…
 

Mikek13

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There are many instances of two issues with DW:

1) Locking up during break in using light oil like Remoil

2) Finish damage from cleaners/ CLP.

DW “Duty Treat” is some form of nitrocarburizing but seems somewhat delicate where chemicals are concerned.

Just do what they say…

Use whatever is terrible advice where these are concerned…

They even give you the lube now…
No lube or take down tool with my TCP.. In fact, the rails and firing pin and bore were filthy, but it had been at the store for a year.
 
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Like many here, I prefer OEM parts and fluids. That is why I only use Sperm Whale oil on my 1911s, just as God and John Moses Browning intended... even 100 years ago the designers knew grease was unnecessary... all these newfangled lubricants are totally unnecessary and just serve to separate you from your hard earned money...

Now if you will excuse me I need to catch the 4:30 auto-gyro to Siam!


1662396820945.jpg
 

Mikek13

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A quality 1911 is a very tough gun, I use what ever oil on my 1911s. Though I use Gear oil on the slide for the first few hundred rounds on a 1911 when new.

This is my first pistol.. When you mentioned that you use gear oil for break-in, I got apprehensive about the mobile 1 I had on the rails and filled a different applicator with amsoil 75w-90 GL-4 manual trans gear oil to reapply. After wiping down the rails I looked closer at the frame rails and took a picture. Is this a galled rail on my brand new TCP?

IMG_1672.JPG
 
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That rail is fine.

Go back to the Mobil 1. Or grab some Militec 1 from Wally World.

Keep it wet the first 500 rounds, like flinging oil all over you wet…
 
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Oh and if you’re run across that treat over there suggesting you slurry a new gun, disregard that one in it’s entirety except for any thing by Severn’s or Keith.
 

Mikek13

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That rail is fine.

Go back to the Mobil 1. Or grab some Militec 1 from Wally World.

Keep it wet the first 500 rounds, like flinging oil all over you wet…
Phew... Id better grab some Militec-1 because Ive read DW has had a few issues with rails galling.. And why they don't supply rail oil anymore is beyond me.
 

Astro14

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Use a good gun oil. Call it a day.

Light oil like RemOil might not be enough on a stainless frame/slide combination.

I had some issues with a Dan Wesson 10mm 1911. Talked about it here:

 
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Phew... Id better grab some Militec-1 because Ive read DW has had a few issues with rails galling.. And why they don't supply rail oil anymore is beyond me.

They are usually pretty easy to deal with, but I’d probably run one of their choices for break in simply so if there is an issue there is no way for them to blame you.

I only say Militec 1 because it’s usually the easiest to get.

If it runs good the first 500, treat it like anything else (obviously still steer clear of stuff that will damage the finish)
 
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I remember the white lithium like grease on all my 1911s. I guess it's like the breaking in copper stuff Glock uses. Was told to just lightly lube and not remove that stuff as it was factory breakin. Used Arch oil 4400 on what I could and cleaned barrel after every shot for 20 shots and went on. I can remember looking back on people using remoil, wd40,etc. Dang how the time changes. I was told to always keep some on the slide rail,barrel and keep barrel clean and clear of obstruction and if I didn't know how to do more it would get me by til I could get it serviced. Revolvers are usually easier but they do demand a minimum amount of care too. Stay safe and enjoy the shooting sport.
 
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