What is the best VW 504/507 oil?

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bulwnkl said:
That occurred to me. However, it's impossible for a buyer or owner to tell from VW's list whether that is the case or not.

...and don't get me started on SOPUS' nonsense. Their bottles don't even say they're licensed or certified. They just say they're 'formulated to meet or exceed...'
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Its pretty normal for them
 
kschachn said:
Which then makes Castrol Edge 5W-30 LL the best because it is $24.04 on Walmart.com. $4.91/quart every day, and NAPA hasn't had a sale on the Mobil 1 product for months.
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Thats a good price, the Castrol edge 5w-30 LL(4L) in Finland cost 39,90€. And Mobil 1 5w-30 esp(4L) is 31,90€
 
bulwnkl said:
Yes, they generally do better these days.

It's also curious that the approved Castrol LL product is half the price of the XOM and SOPUS approved products, don't you think? Is WM clearing out a load of pre-VW504-2020 Edge LL?
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I don't think so, it's been priced that way for quite a while, like over a year maybe more IIRC.
 
Thanks. Haven't had occasion to look for any VW approvals until now, so didn't know that.

I still think it's quite curious that there's such a large price discrepancy among brands that generally try _hard_ to be in the same price range. If 504 / 507 is more than lipstick, it seems that a couple of the common brands out there are way over-priced.
 
Mannol Legend 0w-30 or Mannol Longlife 5w-30 for me.

Both PAO/Ester oils which are rare for these types of oils and every engine we've put it in starts better with less vvt rattle.
 
Nothing Mannol is majority PAO/Ester. It's just group 2/3 with a tiny drop of group 4
and 5 at best. There are spectral analyses available revealing Mannol Legend is fake.

Wasn't this topic about "the best VW 504/507 oil"?
 
Last edited:
Your citation is incorrect. Since it's my own typo, you may not alter it.

Advertising isn't proof. Mannol is cheap because it's made cheaply. Get
what you're most happy with, but stop repeating false marketing claims.
 
It says “Ester components together with the bi-synthetic base” which means esters are added to a bi-synthetic base, not that the ester is one of the “bi” components. This description could be used for any Group III/Group IV base stock that has at least some ester such as many ExxonMobil products.
 
kschachn said:
It says “Ester components together with the bi-synthetic base” which means esters are added to a bi-synthetic base, not that the ester is one of the “bi” components. This description could be used for any Group III/Group IV base stock that has at least some ester such as many ExxonMobil products.
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It says...

"Innovative universal premium bi-synthetic engine oil (PAO + esters)"

as well.

Who knows. I've emailed the company to clarify it.

​

 
kschachn said:
Hmm so is there even any Group IV base stock at all?
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930.engineering said:
Your citation is incorrect. Since it's my own typo, you may not alter it.

Advertising isn't proof. Mannol is cheap because it's made cheaply. Get
what you're most happy with, but stop repeating false marketing claims.
Click to expand...
Hmm, that MSDS is alarming but could possibly be for an older formulation? There's 10% ester but I can't see pao/polydecene anywhere. There are false advertising laws, why would they bother taking the risk?
 
Perhaps this discussion deserves a separate thread. Despite that, two examples:


Mannol Energy Combi LL 7907, advertised as "bisynthetic PAO + Ester":

https://www.mannol.de/products/moto...porters/synthetic-engine-oils/energy-combi-ll

https://sct-online.sct-germany.de/SCTApprovalControl/module/msdsImport/msds_upload_tmp/MN7907_EN.pdf

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/4334-mannol-energy-combi-ll-5w-30/

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/1375-mannol-energy-combi-ll-5w-30/

>> group 2 & 3 with a tiny drop of POE

MSDS says "phenol, dodecyl - 0.02–0.17%" and "2,6-di-tert-butylphenol - 0.1–0.3%",
nothing you'd get excited about......


Mannol O.E.M. 7707 5W-30, says "fully synthetic" or "premium synthese" on the bottle:

https://www.mannol.de/products/motor-oils-for-cars-and-transporters/o-e-m-line1/mannol-o-e-m1

https://sct-online.sct-germany.de/SCTApprovalControl/module/msdsImport/msds_upload_tmp/MN7707_EN.pdf

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/5663-mannol-o-e-m-7707-5w-30/

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/1390-mannol-7707-o-e-m-5w-30/&pageNo=1

Pourpoint -42°C; Noack of 12.8 % doesn't even meet many/most current approvals,
again likely group 2 & 3 with the tiniest of a drop of POE. MSDS doesn't help much,
but at least says: "p-dodecilphenol - 0.06–0.13%". Not surprising at all.

I know these aren't 'Legend 0W-30' and 'Longlife 5W-30', but they're advertized the
same or very similarly at least and I'd have a hard time believing Mannol's claim to
be more true on LL and Legend.
Feel free to do your own google search. I'd suggest looking into the Russion oil club
forum. There's plenty of virgin oil analysises and they aren't even that hard to read.
.
 
930.engineering said:
Perhaps this discussion deserves a separate thread. Despite that, two examples:


Mannol Energy Combi LL 7907, advertised as "bisynthetic PAO + Ester":

https://www.mannol.de/products/moto...porters/synthetic-engine-oils/energy-combi-ll

https://sct-online.sct-germany.de/SCTApprovalControl/module/msdsImport/msds_upload_tmp/MN7907_EN.pdf

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/4334-mannol-energy-combi-ll-5w-30/

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/1375-mannol-energy-combi-ll-5w-30/

>> group 2 & 3 with a tiny drop of POE

MSDS says "phenol, dodecyl - 0.02–0.17%" and "2,6-di-tert-butylphenol - 0.1–0.3%",
nothing you'd get excited about......


Mannol O.E.M. 7707 5W-30, says "fully synthetic" or "premium synthese" on the bottle:

https://www.mannol.de/products/motor-oils-for-cars-and-transporters/o-e-m-line1/mannol-o-e-m1

https://sct-online.sct-germany.de/SCTApprovalControl/module/msdsImport/msds_upload_tmp/MN7707_EN.pdf

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/5663-mannol-o-e-m-7707-5w-30/

https://oil-club.de/index.php?thread/1390-mannol-7707-o-e-m-5w-30/&pageNo=1

Pourpoint -42°C; Noack of 12.8 % doesn't even meet many/most current approvals,
again likely group 2 & 3 with the tiniest of a drop of POE. MSDS doesn't help much,
but at least says: "p-dodecilphenol - 0.06–0.13%". Not surprising at all.

I know these aren't 'Legend 0W-30' and 'Longlife 5W-30', but they're advertized the
same or very similarly at least and I'd have a hard time believing Mannol's claim to
be more true on LL and Legend.
Feel free to do your own google search. I'd suggest looking into the Russion oil club
forum. There's plenty of virgin oil analysises and they aren't even that hard to read.
.
Click to expand...
Mannol is not available on Russian oil club.
Mannol is cheap oil. It was always cheap oil. When I worked on these things it was an afterthought of an oil. From those days in Germany, Aral had a pretty good reputation.
Everything I have seen on Mannol website indicates a lot of chest pumping and nothing to back up. They do not post any performance numbers.
Also, pour point -42? Yeah, Group III all the way. Maybe some POE addition to bump some performance numbers, but that is it. But that is a problem, not something to brag. That means that Mannol cannot achieve the results they want without POE. They are trying to make cheap oil, they would gladly use Group III like Castrol, but they cannot achieve what they want without POE. Which begs the question about overall performance of oil. Noack of 12.8% indicates that.
 
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