What did I break on my Fiero?

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My car broke today on the drive home from work. Now, mind you, I'm supposed to be a mechanic so by rights I ought to know what's wrong with it. The way it died doesn't really match up with what I think is wrong with it, so I'm a little confused.

Now, things being what they are I don't have access to my tools (except for a few basic hand tools) until Monday and I would like to know what's wrong with it at the beginning of the day so that I can order any needed parts and have them delivered by evening when I can use the garage. I suspect my fuel pump [censored] out on me or perhaps the wiring to it corroded through, but it just doesn't feel like the way an electric in-tank fuel pump should die. It was a slow, gradual death with no suddenness about it at all.

My car is older and pretty simple with no modifications:
Engine: 2.8L Chevy 60° V6 with iron heads
Ignition: distributor type, HEI, module under cap
Fuel: MPFI type port fuel injection using 2 circuits and speed density logic
Trans: 3T40 automatic

Here's what happened: Today was the warmest day we've had here since the start of winter. It was warm enough not to need a jacket. About 2/3 of the way into my drive home, so maybe 16 or 17 miles in, it started bogging out as though it had a restricted fuel filter. Too much throttle or too much RPM and it would hit a wall and bog down hard.

Being closer to home than work I continued on by journey and things got worse. The threshold before bogging got lower and lower until I found myself feathering the throttle to keep it going above idle speed. It got worse and got to sputtering as well as bogging. With the fuel gauge reading just over 1/4 and the car being so old I decided to add fuel to the tank without stopping the engine but this did not help at all.

About 3/4 mile from home the car decided to stall and not restart. I found that I could let it sit for a few minutes and then get it to start, but it would run for less than a minute. I repeated this three times, then gave up and pushed. That only worked for about a half mile (I'm getting older and not aging well) before the legs ran out of steam, so that left my walking.

Now, I really don't want to leave a car on the side of the road overnight and pray that it won't get smashed up in a hit-and run as tends to happen so I had to get it home. I called AAA to confirm that I have an active membership, but I plan to use their towing to get to work on Monday. I dug up a half-full gallon can of xylene paint thinner and enough scraps of vacuum hose to plumb it to the vacuum port for the fuel pressure regulator. This worked well enough to drive home. This tells me that I have spark.

Other observations: With the engine stopped and the key on the SES light illuminates. With the engine running the SES light stays off. I do not hear the fuel pump running, but can't be sure I've ever heard it running in this car. I can hear the fuel pump relay and the oil pressure gauge does climb while cranking.

I want to call it a dead fuel pump but think that it's more likely a corroded connection at the top of the tank unit or on the wires from the tank unit to the pump itself. What says BITOG?
 
Well about 8 years ago a buddy of mine and myself were coming home from the race track in his Mustang. Car had about an 8 month old Walboro 255lph fuel pump in it, but the stock tank.

About 1/2 way home the car started to lose massive amounts of power and started bucking then stalled out.

We waited a few minutes and it fired right back up, but the symptoms quickly reappeared.

We nursed it home doing this (driving it until it stalled.... wait a few minutes, fire it back up).

It ended up being his gas tank was full of crud that was plugging the filter on the pump up. When the car died and you turned the key off, the sediment fell off the sock and it would run until it plugged again.

Not sure if that'll help at all but it is similar enough that I figured it was worth mentioning.
 
I would start with the filter. The fuel pump is a good thought on a car this old. Fuel pressure should be checked. I had this engine in a ciera and if i remember correctly it is sensitive to fuel pressure. There may be a Scrader valve on the fuel rail for checking.

I would make sure you have fire though, the coil could be getting hot and failing. Single coil if i remember.
 
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i would change the in line fuel filter and see if that helps any. if not i would probably drop the tank and see if the strainer on the pump is full of [censored]. my truck has junk in the tank and i have to ckean the filter occasionally but it is carbureted.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL

Not sure if that'll help at all but it is similar enough that I figured it was worth mentioning.


It's similar enough that it might be the same problem. When I get the tank down I'll have to take a good look for any sediment.
 
Just a guess but melted/clogged catalyst.

My Mother in law's Hyundai did that when it had a clogged catalytic converter.
 
Fuel filter is where I would start, but don't rule out a clogged exhaust system (perhaps catalytic converter clogged).

A good way to check if exhaust system is clogged, see how it runs tomorrow when everything is clear and cool.
 
If the vehicle is driven regularly and filled at a normal gas station then I kind of doubt its the sock on the fuel pump or the fuel filter. I took off the tank my 1993 Suburban (twice) to replace a fuel pump and the only thing that was not pristine were my hands.

Could someone have messed with your vehicle? Anyone name Vito looking for you? Paid all your gambling debts?
 
spasm3: It ran with a rigged up fuel supply so I'm sure I have spark. Checking fuel pressure, unfortunately, isn't an option because the only gauge I have at home tops out at 7 psi.

outdoorsman310: Yes, regardless of what else I do it will get a new inline fuel filter. If the tank comes down, it will get a new strainer.

Spazdog: Good thought, but I've driven with clogged cats before and this definitely isn't one.
 
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Originally Posted By: Donald
If the vehicle is driven regularly and filled at a normal gas station then I kind of doubt its the sock on the fuel pump or the fuel filter. I took off the tank my 1993 Suburban (twice) to replace a fuel pump and the only thing that was not pristine were my hands.
It gets driven at least 6 days a week for the past...well...almost a year but the previous owner had it in storage a lot as he spent a lot of time overseas. Perhaps some crud could have developed during that time?
Originally Posted By: Donald

Could someone have messed with your vehicle? Anyone name Vito looking for you? Paid all your gambling debts?
There is one person who has it in for me, yes, but I don't think she could think of a way to sabotage a car.
 
Clogged vent to the fuel system? TRy starting without the gas cap. Let us know what you find.

Oldtommy
 
Cap off: Engine started and idled for a few seconds, maybe 3 or 4, then died and wouldn't restart.
 
Originally Posted By: CurtisB
Originally Posted By: 2oldtommy
Clogged vent to the fuel system? TRy starting without the gas cap. Let us know what you find.

Oldtommy


^^^^ Sound advice here.


Whoops, I typed that in a bit late.
eek.gif
 
A wild guess! You mention a not so cold day right? now a very long shot but what if you had more water in the tank that the ethanol could absorb and it was frozen in the tank, today it melted and has soaked the fuel filter plugging it?
 
At the risk of sounding mechanically challenged, I'll tell you what a gm tech told me when my new then 1985gt wouldn't idle but would run fine as long as I was on the gas. If I remember correctly he said it was a pick-up for the distributor.
 
Originally Posted By: Donald
If the vehicle is driven regularly and filled at a normal gas station then I kind of doubt its the sock on the fuel pump or the fuel filter. I took off the tank my 1993 Suburban (twice) to replace a fuel pump and the only thing that was not pristine were my hands.

Could someone have messed with your vehicle? Anyone name Vito looking for you? Paid all your gambling debts?


I have exactly the same experience on exactly the same vehicle (well, truck and not a Suburban, but either way).

With that said, we also plugged up the fuel filter on our 2002 so bad the fuel pump died. So when it happens, it might happen all at once.
 
Originally Posted By: gulian
At the risk of sounding mechanically challenged, I'll tell you what a gm tech told me when my new then 1985gt wouldn't idle but would run fine as long as I was on the gas. If I remember correctly he said it was a pick-up for the distributor.


That's different behavior but something for me to keep in mind. My distributor pickup looks like it's 200 years old and I would have replaced the whole distributor by now as PM, but am putting off PM for a while. I could be spending some time "away" and would likely lose all of my possessions including this car.

All of that aside, a problem with the pickup should be sensitive to RPM, but not load. During the time the engine ran poorly it was sensitive to both RPM and load. Also, it doesn't explain how I can run the engine by dipping a vaccuum hose into a can of paint thinner.
 
Originally Posted By: mene
A wild guess! You mention a not so cold day right? now a very long shot but what if you had more water in the tank that the ethanol could absorb and it was frozen in the tank, today it melted and has soaked the fuel filter plugging it?
^This. Gas dryer might help.
 
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Originally Posted By: cjcride
Originally Posted By: mene
A wild guess! You mention a not so cold day right? now a very long shot but what if you had more water in the tank that the ethanol could absorb and it was frozen in the tank, today it melted and has soaked the fuel filter plugging it?
^This. Gas dryer might help.


I hadn't thought of that. Really, my gut is telling me that the $20 of gas I just put in should mean this isn't the problem (10% ethanol pump gas in NJ) it's worth a shot. I haven't got any isopropyl alcohol, but what's it going to hurt to throw one bottle of methyl alcohol in there? I'll do that now.
 
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