VOA Castrol EDGE HM 5W30 D1G3

[himemsys]

This is the newest iteration that is marked Dexos1 Gen3. According to their PDS:

https://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/BD0AFD9B1949F369802588F4004DD711/$File/bpxe-a4x82v.pdf

the viscosity should be 11.3. This sample weighed in at 10.5. Overall a pretty decent looking additive package, typical 6.5ish TBN and oxidation of 6. According to Lake Speed, a bump in oxidation in high mileage oils indicates presence of esters as additional seal conditioners. I don't know what the oxidation value of the non-HM version of this oil is, though.

 

[fantastic]

Nice to see 100c Viscosity at 10.5 cSt for a 5w-30. I'm probably just used to seeing that number lower after they've been used for an ODI.
Surely this isn't the 10k mile "Advanced Full Synthetic" version though?

 

[himemsys]

Nice to see 100c Viscosity at 10.5 cSt for a 5w-30. I'm probably just used to seeing that number lower after they've been used for an ODI.
Surely this isn't the 10k mile "Advanced Full Synthetic" version though?

All the EDGE oils are full synthetic 10k, including HM. I think EDGE EP is 20k, like M1 EP. But looking at the TBN of both oils, there's not much difference in the absolute value. Rate of depletion may differ, though.

 

[fantastic]

All the EDGE oils are full synthetic 10k, including HM. I think EDGE EP is 20k, like M1 EP. But looking at the TBN of both oils, there's not much difference in the absolute value. Rate of depletion may differ, though.

Thanks for those details.

If oxidation is a value we can "Loosely Check" for the quality of the synthetic base oil and we're seeing double digit numbers on the Boutique oils, the oxidation value of 6 for this oil seems kind of puny. It makes you think if we're getting caught up in the sales hype. There's no standard for Synthetic base oil requirements so this leaves me more confused.

As always getting an oil sample tells the tale after a run. I guess I just expect a higher oxidation value for a "Full Synthetic". For example when I've tested Rotella T6 it comes back 13-17 used & Lake Speed tested it at 16 oxidation unused. After being spoiled like that how can we except 6 as "Advanced FS"? Perhaps, there's more to it but I'm just not seeing it with this oil.

 

[himemsys]

If oxidation is a value we can "Loosely Check" for the quality of the synthetic base oil and we're seeing double digit numbers on the Boutique oils, the oxidation value of 6 for this oil seems kind of puny.

I'm not sure either. But the one video on Pennzoil HM vs non that's on Speediagnostix talks about this. He points at non HM oxidation of 4 vs HM oxidation of 7 as an indicator. But I don't know the scale of these values. Is 7 significant? As in almost double of 4? Or is it insignificant because the absolute value is still pretty low? Perhaps the difference between 4 and 7 is "enough" to make an actual difference in seal conditioning. I don't have enough oxidation values in my VOA database to compare other samples. But I do know that M1 EP HM is 8 and Valvoline EP HM is 7.

 

[fantastic]

I'm not sure either. But the one video on Pennzoil HM vs non that's on Speediagnostix talks about this. He points at non HM oxidation of 4 vs HM oxidation of 7 as an indicator. But I don't know the scale of these values. Is 7 significant? As in almost double of 4? Or is it insignificant because the absolute value is still pretty low? Perhaps the difference between 4 and 7 is "enough" to make an actual difference in seal conditioning. I don't have enough oxidation values in my VOA database to compare other samples. But I do know that M1 EP HM is 8 and Valvoline EP HM is 7.

Fair enough & good information. Another way I could put it would be that if Diesel oil is 16 (Rotella T6) and the fact that HM Gasoline oils don't need to be as robust perhaps a value of half of that would suffice. That would be a value of 8 but Double the value of Non HM oils of around 4. I think that's where I'm going to set my personal standard . If the oxidation value is at least 8 it's got just enough syn. base oil to pass my smell test. The M1 HM you reference would fit that criteria. I would want a cleaning aspect to HM oils so the more quality the base oil the better. Also, I suppose we can disregard 0.3% from a UOA Fuel test since that is what this oil starts out with...Interesting. I appreciate the post.

 

[Impatient]

Fair enough & good information. Another way I could put it would be that if Diesel oil is 16 (Rotella T6) and the fact that HM Gasoline oils don't need to be as robust perhaps a value of half of that would suffice. That would be a value of 8 but Double the value of Non HM oils of around 4. I think that's where I'm going to set my personal standard . If the oxidation value is at least 8 it's got just enough syn. base oil to pass my smell test. The M1 HM you reference would fit that criteria. I would want a cleaning aspect to HM oils so the more quality the base oil the better. Also, I suppose we can disregard 0.3% from a UOA Fuel test since that is what this oil starts out with...Interesting. I appreciate the post.

Hmmm, I was wondering if Oil Analysers is gaslighting us with high fuel numbers. Maybe they are always 0.3 high, though I was concerned they were reading considerably higher than 0.3. No proof, maybe just wishing, since I’m often disappointed in the fuel readings I’ve gotten from them.

 

[fantastic]

Hmmm, I was wondering if Oil Analysers is gaslighting us with high fuel numbers. Maybe they are always 0.3 high, though I was concerned they were reading considerably higher than 0.3. No proof, maybe just wishing, since I’m often disappointed in the fuel readings I’ve gotten from them.

Not sure if oil comes with a small amount of "Fuel" like vapors or margin of error on their testing equipment. Either way it's questionable. Blackstone complainers say "Inaccurate Fuel Reading" while OA is off by 0.5% average. Darn if you do darned if you don't... just take the average approach.

 

[himemsys]

The M1 EP HM 5W30 I posted at the same time as this one showed 0.5%. LOL

I think part of the issue was I did not categorize these as "Baseline Reference" which I guess is a flag to them that it is a VOA. If they know it's a VOA, they probably don't use GC to test the sample. But since they did, these 0.3 and 0.5% results are quite curious.

 

[Revving2Redline]

I was thinking the magic number that people were looking for was oxidation value rating of around 30. I seem to remember that on the speed diagnostic website when they were doing the oil analysis of Liquimoly Ceratec. it's value was little or none which is probably where they wanted it because it seems this product and esters would be counterproductive to each other inside of an engine.

 

[himemsys]

I was thinking the magic number that people were looking for was oxidation value rating of around 30. I seem to remember that on the speed diagnostic website when they were doing the oil analysis of Liquimoly Ceratec. it's value was little or none which is probably where they wanted it because it seems this product and esters would be counterproductive to each other inside of an engine.

Apparently there are different types of esters. I'm not claiming to know enough about it though, but Speediagnostix recently posted a high mileage video where he talks about this.


and


Here he shows graphs of the Pennzoil Platinum, High Mileage, and Ultra Platinum oils, including two different ester spikes. At the 6:10 mark of this video, he talks about this. He says the ester used for seal conditioning in the high mileage oil is different than the ester used in Ultra Platinum. He conjectures the ester in PUP is a Borate Ester.

 

[fantastic]

You really like your HM oils

I've watched those here a few weeks ago. I like how he pronounces sily cun (Silicon). Not making fun just had to lol. I know of a botique oil blender that, this month, went to using Shell's GTL for their base oils & the volatility will be reduced with their oils. It is some solid base oil & informative that the Oxidation value alone can be a bit deceiving. Project Farms testing showed PZ Ultra to be an excellent oil from his testing equipment.

 

[drtyler]

Project Farms testing showed PZ Ultra to be an excellent oil from his testing equipment.

What testing equipment is Project Farms using?

 

[fantastic]

What testing equipment is Project Farms using?

I find it hard to believe you don't know Project Farms equipment. He's only one of the largest DIY Testing Channels out there. Go look on YT

 

[buster]

High oxidation indicates the presence of esters.

"Generally speaking"

6-12 - oxidation of oil without esters.
35 - about 5%
60-70 - about 10%

But this is with XOM's Esterex, other esters may show different oxidation values as stated by others. So it's not exact and never will be.

Out of curiosity I checked Red Line's latest SDS (08.2022) and it shows 50-70% PAO. This is inline with 20-40% POE in their HP Line and 90-134 oxidation figures.

AN's do not show an oxidation value.

 

[himemsys]

You really like your HM oils

Honestly, it started with that Speediagnostix HM video when I realized oxidation could be an indicator of seal conditioning esters. I just had to know what all the latest HM oils looked like overall, and oxidation values, specifically. Just wait, there's a couple of more VOAs coming that will be very intriguing.

 

[fantastic]

Honestly, it started with that Speediagnostix HM video when I realized oxidation could be an indicator of seal conditioning esters. I just had to know what all the latest HM oils looked like overall, and oxidation values, specifically. Just wait, there's a couple of more VOAs coming that will be very intriguing.

It's great information & appreciate the post. I'll wait for those VOA posts .

 

[I<3oil]

I find it hard to believe you don't know Project Farms equipment. He's only one of the largest DIY Testing Channels out there. Go look on YT

lol @ PF and his "testing equipment"......here's a 20 year old coffee pot and some slanted PVC pipe!

 

[fantastic]

[QUOTE="I lol @ PF and his "testing equipment"......here's a 20 year old coffee pot and some slanted PVC pipe!
[/QUOTE]
Obviously He's not the oil companies testing lab analyst but gives us some idea of non-bias data us consumers can use. Some basic testing equipment can be revealing. I like his wear test equipment because I've seen big oil companies use a prettier version of the same basic testing tool. If they can use it for data why can't he.

 

[I<3oil]

Obviously He's not the oil companies testing lab analyst but gives us some idea of non-bias data us consumers can use. Some basic testing equipment can be revealing. I like his wear test equipment because I've seen big oil companies use a prettier version of the same basic testing tool. If they can use it for data why can't he.

We have things called standardized tests for a reason...