I have used the "conventional" and maxlife flavors, and would not have a problem using "full synthetic" however it is physically impossible that thats what it is. Think about it, lube shops don't seperate used oil according to conventional, syn blend, and syn, and neither does anybody else that recycles oil for that matter. Therefore, the base stock they make starts out with a little bit of everything in it before they re-refine it. Their "full synthetic" may be "more synthetic" than the others, but any oil that is any part re-refined is syn blend at best. You can't take a mix of all oils and come up with a "fully synthetic" base stock, its just not possible.
Valvoline Nextgen synthetic
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Originally Posted By: T4R
Their "full synthetic" may be "more synthetic" than the others, but any oil that is any part re-refined is syn blend at best. You can't take a mix of all oils and come up with a "fully synthetic" base stock, its just not possible.
Only if you don't considering Group III to be synthetic. If you don't, and that's perfectly reasonable, then there are very few real synthetic oils on the shelf.
If one can take crude and make a Group III synthetic, then they can take recycled oil of any sort and make a Group III synthetic. If you're looking at synthetic is Group IV or V only, well, you're pretty much out of luck with most "synthetics" on the market.
Their "full synthetic" may be "more synthetic" than the others, but any oil that is any part re-refined is syn blend at best. You can't take a mix of all oils and come up with a "fully synthetic" base stock, its just not possible.
Only if you don't considering Group III to be synthetic. If you don't, and that's perfectly reasonable, then there are very few real synthetic oils on the shelf.
If one can take crude and make a Group III synthetic, then they can take recycled oil of any sort and make a Group III synthetic. If you're looking at synthetic is Group IV or V only, well, you're pretty much out of luck with most "synthetics" on the market.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
That's the question I have: Is it synthetic when they get it, or does it become synthetic when they re-refine it? It doesn't seem practical to me that they could control the stream of waste motor oil to assure that all the base stock is synthetic.
It seems like you and many other posters are confused about how motor oil is made. No one ships oil, even "conventional" oil, after simply refining the crude. Refining the crude, just like re-refining used oil, is simply the first step towards obtaining the base stock. After that additional processing is done, such as some kind of hyrdo-treating. You don't obtain a synthetic oil simply from refining the crude oil, just like you won't obtain a synthetic oil simply from refining used motor oil. Perhaps a chemical engineer could answer this better. I think Garak said something along these lines.
Personally, though I don't think I will be a big fan of Valvoline NextGen Synthetic if it's merely a NextGen version of Valvoline Synthetic. It just hasn't set the world on fire yet. To paraphrase others, I'll use "Valvoline Synthetic" when NAPA's synthetic on a great sale. Otherwise, I think MaxLife is good enough.. (or even better, the competing synthetics from Mobil, Pennzoil, etc).
That's the question I have: Is it synthetic when they get it, or does it become synthetic when they re-refine it? It doesn't seem practical to me that they could control the stream of waste motor oil to assure that all the base stock is synthetic.
It seems like you and many other posters are confused about how motor oil is made. No one ships oil, even "conventional" oil, after simply refining the crude. Refining the crude, just like re-refining used oil, is simply the first step towards obtaining the base stock. After that additional processing is done, such as some kind of hyrdo-treating. You don't obtain a synthetic oil simply from refining the crude oil, just like you won't obtain a synthetic oil simply from refining used motor oil. Perhaps a chemical engineer could answer this better. I think Garak said something along these lines.
Personally, though I don't think I will be a big fan of Valvoline NextGen Synthetic if it's merely a NextGen version of Valvoline Synthetic. It just hasn't set the world on fire yet. To paraphrase others, I'll use "Valvoline Synthetic" when NAPA's synthetic on a great sale. Otherwise, I think MaxLife is good enough.. (or even better, the competing synthetics from Mobil, Pennzoil, etc).
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Hopefully that means rebate time again
Sorry to bump this thread from 1-1/2 years ago, but I am just wondering if anyone has seen this synthetic Nextgen Synpower recently? It is still listed on the Valvoline web site:
http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/nextgen/full-synthetic-motor-oil/138
Everywhere I have looked -- online and in person -- it is nowhere to be found. Maybe I haven't looked hard enough?
http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/nextgen/full-synthetic-motor-oil/138
Everywhere I have looked -- online and in person -- it is nowhere to be found. Maybe I haven't looked hard enough?
wemay
Site Donor 2023
I recently started seeing if again at a local AAP in 5w30, 10w30 and 5w20.
I don't trust valvoline anymore. Their TDS lists this 5w20 oil with a VI of 161: http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/nextgen_synthetic.pdf
PQIA tested the oil recently and it got a VI of only 146: http://www.pqiamerica.com/June 2014/vnextgen.htm
A good full synthetic will be in the 170 range.
The specs look like a regular dino oil with a slightly lower NOACK. The high CCS vis of 5832 also fits in with dino oil specs.
PQIA tested the oil recently and it got a VI of only 146: http://www.pqiamerica.com/June 2014/vnextgen.htm
A good full synthetic will be in the 170 range.
The specs look like a regular dino oil with a slightly lower NOACK. The high CCS vis of 5832 also fits in with dino oil specs.
wemay
Site Donor 2023
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
I don't trust valvoline anymore. Their TDS lists this 5w20 oil with a VI of 161: http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/nextgen_synthetic.pdf
PQIA tested the oil recently and it got a VI of only 146: http://www.pqiamerica.com/June 2014/vnextgen.htm
A good full synthetic will be in the 170 range.
The specs look like a regular dino oil with a slightly lower NOACK. The high CCS vis of 5832 also fits in with dino oil specs.
Inconsistent info/tds' can be attributed to all blenders. Look at the difference between PYB/QSGB 5w20 from pqia to thier own websites. The fact that M1 doesnt list ACEA approvals on various weights (labels [as pointed out in a recent thread]) where online, those same weights show the approval, just to name a few. I think its an industry wide affliction.
I don't trust valvoline anymore. Their TDS lists this 5w20 oil with a VI of 161: http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/nextgen_synthetic.pdf
PQIA tested the oil recently and it got a VI of only 146: http://www.pqiamerica.com/June 2014/vnextgen.htm
A good full synthetic will be in the 170 range.
The specs look like a regular dino oil with a slightly lower NOACK. The high CCS vis of 5832 also fits in with dino oil specs.
Inconsistent info/tds' can be attributed to all blenders. Look at the difference between PYB/QSGB 5w20 from pqia to thier own websites. The fact that M1 doesnt list ACEA approvals on various weights (labels [as pointed out in a recent thread]) where online, those same weights show the approval, just to name a few. I think its an industry wide affliction.
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How is the PYB different from tested other than having a LOWER NOACK than listed in the TDS?
Fact remains that the Nextgen "Synthetic" has a VI lower than any other synthetic & also a CCS vis thicker than other synthetics as well. All evidence points to a synthetic blend at best, and most likely a pure dino basestock.
Let's not forget that the regular Nextgen dino oil also got in trouble for having NOACK higher than the allowed 15%. http://www.pqiamerica.com/Nov2013/Valvolinenextgen.htm
That's 2 strikes against Valvoline already for selling inferior products.
Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
I don't trust valvoline anymore. Their TDS lists this 5w20 oil with a VI of 161: http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/nextgen_synthetic.pdf
PQIA tested the oil recently and it got a VI of only 146: http://www.pqiamerica.com/June 2014/vnextgen.htm
A good full synthetic will be in the 170 range.
The specs look like a regular dino oil with a slightly lower NOACK. The high CCS vis of 5832 also fits in with dino oil specs.
Inconsistent info/tds' can be attributed to all blenders. Look at the difference between PYB/QSGB 5w20 from pqia to thier own websites. The fact that M1 doesnt list ACEA approvals on various weights (labels [as pointed out in a recent thread]) where online, those same weights show the approval, just to name a few. I think its an industry wide affliction.
Fact remains that the Nextgen "Synthetic" has a VI lower than any other synthetic & also a CCS vis thicker than other synthetics as well. All evidence points to a synthetic blend at best, and most likely a pure dino basestock.
Let's not forget that the regular Nextgen dino oil also got in trouble for having NOACK higher than the allowed 15%. http://www.pqiamerica.com/Nov2013/Valvolinenextgen.htm
That's 2 strikes against Valvoline already for selling inferior products.
Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
I don't trust valvoline anymore. Their TDS lists this 5w20 oil with a VI of 161: http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/nextgen_synthetic.pdf
PQIA tested the oil recently and it got a VI of only 146: http://www.pqiamerica.com/June 2014/vnextgen.htm
A good full synthetic will be in the 170 range.
The specs look like a regular dino oil with a slightly lower NOACK. The high CCS vis of 5832 also fits in with dino oil specs.
Inconsistent info/tds' can be attributed to all blenders. Look at the difference between PYB/QSGB 5w20 from pqia to thier own websites. The fact that M1 doesnt list ACEA approvals on various weights (labels [as pointed out in a recent thread]) where online, those same weights show the approval, just to name a few. I think its an industry wide affliction.
Originally Posted By: Pajamarama
Sorry to bump this thread from 1-1/2 years ago, but I am just wondering if anyone has seen this synthetic Nextgen Synpower recently? It is still listed on the Valvoline web site:
http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/nextgen/full-synthetic-motor-oil/138
Everywhere I have looked -- online and in person -- it is nowhere to be found. Maybe I haven't looked hard enough?
I saw it on clearance at my local Advance Auto about 3 months ago for $3.75/qt. I was tempted to buy it, but had just stocked up on PU from Walmart. I haven't seen NG syn since then. But I haven't been looking for it, either.
Sorry to bump this thread from 1-1/2 years ago, but I am just wondering if anyone has seen this synthetic Nextgen Synpower recently? It is still listed on the Valvoline web site:
http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/nextgen/full-synthetic-motor-oil/138
Everywhere I have looked -- online and in person -- it is nowhere to be found. Maybe I haven't looked hard enough?
I saw it on clearance at my local Advance Auto about 3 months ago for $3.75/qt. I was tempted to buy it, but had just stocked up on PU from Walmart. I haven't seen NG syn since then. But I haven't been looking for it, either.
wemay
Site Donor 2023
My point wasnt specific to tds, more so towards inconsistent information industry wide. But i do see where your coming from.
Local Pep Boys were closing it out for $1.90/quart, cleaned them out!
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
Its called re-refining
What comes out of the ground has to be cleaned up too
At first I was against paying the same as reg white bottle because I thought that was bad marketing and I guess that is what happened
I got a bunch on clearance for 50 cents a qt and have been using it in my truck and have had no issues at all
It is NG Maxlife and it has stopped a small main seal leak down to just a drop when before it was 3-4 drops overnight
What comes out of the ground has to be cleaned up too
At first I was against paying the same as reg white bottle because I thought that was bad marketing and I guess that is what happened
I got a bunch on clearance for 50 cents a qt and have been using it in my truck and have had no issues at all
It is NG Maxlife and it has stopped a small main seal leak down to just a drop when before it was 3-4 drops overnight
If Valvoline is willing to release such an inferior product into the public then it carries over to their other products as well. Remember, Ashland (who owns the Valvoline brand) doesn't produce any crude themselves. They buy the base stocks, maybe further refine it a bit more then blend it with additives purchased from other companies. All those middlemen means slimmer margins than the big oil companies that produce everything from scratch. Look @ Ashland's financials from 2012:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashland_Inc.
Revenue $ 8.206 billion (FY 2012)
Operating income $ 302 million (FY 2012)
Net income $ 26 million (FY 2012)
$26 million out of $8.2 BILLION of sales looks like paper thin margins to me.
Originally Posted By: tony1679
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashland_Inc.
Revenue $ 8.206 billion (FY 2012)
Operating income $ 302 million (FY 2012)
Net income $ 26 million (FY 2012)
$26 million out of $8.2 BILLION of sales looks like paper thin margins to me.
Originally Posted By: tony1679
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
Originally Posted By: tony1679
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
Have you ever seen crude from the ground?
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
Have you ever seen crude from the ground?
wemay
Site Donor 2023
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
If Valvoline is willing to release such an inferior product into the public then it carries over to their other products as well. Remember, Ashland (who owns the Valvoline brand) doesn't produce any crude themselves. They buy the base stocks, maybe further refine it a bit more then blend it with additives purchased from other companies. All those middlemen means slimmer margins than the big oil companies that produce everything from scratch. Look @ Ashland's financials from 2012:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashland_Inc.
Revenue $ 8.206 billion (FY 2012)
Operating income $ 302 million (FY 2012)
Net income $ 26 million (FY 2012)
$26 million out of $8.2 BILLION of sales looks like paper thin margins to me.
Originally Posted By: tony1679
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
Granted NXTGNs's issues, but although Sodium is the additive of choice; Synpower, Maxlife and VWB are all comparable with the competition. VOA, UOA and testing wise.
If Valvoline is willing to release such an inferior product into the public then it carries over to their other products as well. Remember, Ashland (who owns the Valvoline brand) doesn't produce any crude themselves. They buy the base stocks, maybe further refine it a bit more then blend it with additives purchased from other companies. All those middlemen means slimmer margins than the big oil companies that produce everything from scratch. Look @ Ashland's financials from 2012:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashland_Inc.
Revenue $ 8.206 billion (FY 2012)
Operating income $ 302 million (FY 2012)
Net income $ 26 million (FY 2012)
$26 million out of $8.2 BILLION of sales looks like paper thin margins to me.
Originally Posted By: tony1679
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
That's 2 strikes against Nextgen already.
Fixed.
Nothing wrong with regular Valvoline products. But Nextgen..... I know I won't be using it. In any flavor.
When people dump sludgy oil, trans fluid, p/s fluid, brake fluid, gear oil, and who knows what else into used oil receptacles, how can you truly be sure of what you're getting in the final product?
Granted NXTGNs's issues, but although Sodium is the additive of choice; Synpower, Maxlife and VWB are all comparable with the competition. VOA, UOA and testing wise.
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