Valvetrain noise on startup

[Gotrek]

Chrysler 360ci.

On startup I'm getting a loud rattle/vavletrain noise. Will a thicker oil help with this?

It goes away within seconds but I'm worried of the damage caused in that 1-2 seconds.

I'm using Tech 2000 synthetic from walmart.

I'm not sure but I either have 0w30 (my winter oil) or 5w30

 

[G-MAN]

A thicker oil will just make it worse.

This is probably an oil filter problem. The ADBV is not holding which is allowing the lifters to leak down.

 

[Gotrek]

Ok I'll replace it I'm using a Wix premium filter (napa gold) I'm doing an oil change anyways.

I was planning on going to 10w40 though as this is my regular summer oil. The car is getting a new camshaft so the valvetrain will be looked into soon as well.

 

[Dave H]

Does the noise only happen after the car has sat for several hours? Or is it everytime you start the car, even within short periods of time?
One thing I did for the same type start-up noise in my car was use a different oil filter. A better ADBV will prevent all the oil from draining back in your pan when it sits.
If the Tech 2000 synthetic is a light 30 weight, you could try a thicker 30 weight (like GC). Or, if Chrysler recommends it, you could go to a 40 weight. Using GC in my Maxima cured some odd noises a certain light 30 weight oil either caused or made more apparent.

Dave

 

[Triple_Se7en]

My Chrysler does the same thing. I doubt it's oil or filter related. I've tried a million of both. Not sure what that that sound is. It lasts a couple of seconds after sitting for hours. My bad ADBVs (Baldwins) -- well that ticking sound lasts for a minute or two. You cannot get a better silicone ADBV that what WIX/Napa Gold has.

If your engine is not dirty & you are using 10w30 or thinner, your problem may be the same as mine..... undiagnosed & UNKNOWN!

 

[Thermo1223]

Accent does the whole lifter clack for a few secs and on decel. Not the oil filter as I always use the quality brands reccomended here. Might be due to the angle at which it mounts. like a 45* angle, kinda wierd. Goes away completely once up to temp.

 

[memo]

quote:

---

Originally posted by hominid7:
If it's more of a rattle and not ticking from lifters or from being oil deprived, i'm wondering if it could be something like a timing belt or drive belt tentioner getting slightly weak?

The other thing that comes to mind is friction gear noise, but that typically happens when the engine is hot and goes away dependant on RPM's, not within a few seconds, so i would rule that out.

I'd try an OEM filter, and some OEM oil (5w30 conventional, superflo or castrol) and go from there.

Good luck!

---

How many miles are on your car and is this a new problem, or something that has always been around.

It's amazing and scary some of the noises that newer cars can make. Newer cars have different fuel systems then cars from a few years ago. Direct fuel injection (sorta like a diesel) only newer cars do it so get better fuel economy. Instead of the injectors spraying in the intake manifold right before the valves, our new car acually has fuel injectors that spray direcly into the combustion chamber. I've heard a lot of complaints on new cars and start up problems. Mainly warm start up problems. The newer cars don't use fuel return lines, they use evap return lines (gas vapors) and all of this new stuff combined I think just makes cars sound different then the older cars. If you have any type of variable valve timming in your car, It could sound different.

It would keep a eye out for any change. If it gets worse, I would really look in to it, but I wouldn't loose any sleep over it. It sounds like normal new car crap startup to me.

If you do have a timming belt and it was loose, you would have slipped teath and you would know it. I think just about all domestics (unless it has a import engine in it) use timming chains anyway.

 

[m2200b]

Try some oil with moly- Havoline , Chevron or add some vsot to whatever you want to use but stay in recommended grade while you try to get the noise cured. Covering it up is not the way to go with a new car/ motor.

 

[ITSMR2U]

If you have chain driven camshafts, the tensioner for the chain likely is actuated by oil pressure. In this case, a heavier grade oil will actually make the situation worse, since it will take longer to pump up the tensioner.
Chain drives of this type do rattle on startup, but it is harmless.

 

[Gotrek]

It's an old car 1980 chrysler but only about 60 000miles on it.

It's always made a bit of a lifter rattle on startup but I just find it louder now. and mostly coming from the driver side rear of the engine.

It's a timing chain which will be replaced with the cam. So will the lifters I'm just wondering what I could try in the meantime.

 

[speedygonzalez]

Yes filters make a difference; I found fram was pretty bad; stopped using those. Super Tech Filter does it now and then, but not too often, usually it does not.

Pouring half a can of seafoam in the old oil at OC time, then start it, let idle 5 minutes, and drain. Cleans any contaminents out of the lifters. The lifters in DSM Cars get clogged easily as the oil passage is very small. There is a new lifter design that has a bigger passage.

 

[Gotrek]

Yes it last for 1 second maybe 2 at most and usually only after the car has sat for 1 hour or more.

It did not do it before but it's an old engine (1980) It's had the same diet of napa gold filters it's hole life and only recently has it gotten a bit noisy on startup. COuld very well be a bad filter. I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[memo]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Triple_Se7en:
My Chrysler does the same thing. I doubt it's oil or filter related. I've tried a million of both. Not sure what that that sound is. It lasts a couple of seconds after sitting for hours. My bad ADBVs (Baldwins) -- well that ticking sound lasts for a minute or two. You cannot get a better silicone ADBV that what WIX/Napa Gold has.

If your engine is not dirty & you are using 10w30 or thinner, your problem may be the same as mine..... undiagnosed & UNKNOWN!

---

Sounds like it's just the way the engine is. You probably can't do anything about it. I have a 05 Corolla and the valvetrain seemed really loud for a new car that I had gently broken in. Well, after reading up on Corolla forums, sadly, it's just the way the car is. Nothing is broken or out of spec, it's just the way the engine is.

As long as your car sounds normal after a few seconds, I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[hominid7]

If it's more of a rattle and not ticking from lifters or from being oil deprived, i'm wondering if it could be something like a timing belt or drive belt tentioner getting slightly weak?

The other thing that comes to mind is friction gear noise, but that typically happens when the engine is hot and goes away dependant on RPM's, not within a few seconds, so i would rule that out.

I'd try an OEM filter, and some OEM oil (5w30 conventional, superflo or castrol) and go from there.

Good luck!

 

[memo]

quote:

---

Originally posted by speedygonzalez:
Yes filters make a difference; I found fram was pretty bad; stopped using those. Super Tech Filter does it now and then, but not too often, usually it does not.

Pouring half a can of seafoam in the old oil at OC time, then start it, let idle 5 minutes, and drain. Cleans any contaminents out of the lifters. The lifters in DSM Cars get clogged easily as the oil passage is very small. There is a new lifter design that has a bigger passage.

---

That's really funny you would mention DSMs and lifter tick and seafoam all in one post unrelated to this thread. Anyway, the local DSMers where using it and swaring buy it, but I am very weary of crank case additives and turbo's. Seafoams web site offered no information about the product being safe for turbo's or not being safe for turbo's. So, I emailed them.

This was the response.

===============================================
Sea Foam used in your crankcase system is safe. Use 1 1/2 ounces of Sea Foam for each quart of engine oil capacity in your crankcase, as a pre cleaner for LOF service by a minimum run time of 30 minutes, or use as an after service additive at the same rate.

The fact you have a turbo means engine lubricating oil is pressurized through the turbo bearings to keep them cool and lubricated. Sea Foam is an extremely high temperature oil product that would help clean those bearings without fear of lubrication problems from your crankcase oil.

Thank You

Customer Service
==================================================

I used it in the crank case for 1/2 an hour to try and cure a little lifter tick *with updated lifters*

and it didn't get rid of it 100% (I'll try again before my next oil change, but I sucked 1/3 of the bottle in to my intake manifold and 1/3 of the bottle in my crank case and the rest of the bottle went to my sister in laws *** Corolla. I changed it's oil for probably the first time in who knows how long. The oil looked a little brown comming out

, I installed a new air filter, and decited to use the rest of the seafoam on the old Corolla intake. We found a vacume and sucked the stuff in. I drove it afterwards and for a car that gets very little TLC and minimal oil changes, it acually drove pretty smooth.

As far as what did seafoam do for me? It improved throttle response and my car idles smoother as well. I'm at 111K miles and it's the first time I've used such a product on this car. I'm happy with the results and while I still have a little bit of lifter tick, it doesn't trip the knock sensor, so it's not like the original lifters and I don't have a loud tapping sound, it just seems like I have a little bit of a loud valvetrain noise. I only kept it in for a little bit, I went for a gental drive staying out of boost before I drained the oil. As far as the crankcase use, I can't really tell that it did anything, but maybe I can do a compression test. My 1Super Tech cylinder was lower then the rest. I'll check it again and see if carbon build up was removed and if the product can really do what it claims it can do.