The bachelor's degree has become diluted in its value, unless it's from a well-respected school and the student has a high GPA in a desirable major. In that case the degree will easily pay for itself.
The education industry is huge. I wonder how many people are employed at all colleges and vocational schools in the US. It has to be over a million.
The industry also depends on government subsidies (student loans) to fund it. Can you imagine the price of tuition if there were no more Sallie-Mae loans or if they limited them to $3000 per year? While there are worse things we can waste taxpayer dollars on, it's nonetheless wasteful to bankroll someone's education in anthropology or culinary arts
Value of a college degree
- Thread starter JHZR2
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IF you get an Engineering degree, get one that puts you on a path so you don't have to work for "the man" - I say that somewhat facetiously - but my brother figured that out at 19 or so. I didn't. My bro got his Bee Ess in Geotechnical Engineering. His company is now rather large and successful.
No matter the path, most of us have some point in our lives where we just won't like working (and bending over) and being laid off by the man.
I'm just saying - degree or no degree, you gotta have that built-in drive. That burning in the gut to do better, to be successful if you are starting a beauty salon, pooch washing outlet or widget manufacturing co. This is gonna suck, but I think it's somewhat genetic.
Read this excellent story from NY Times. A guy turns down a $40,000 entry level Claims Adjuster position because he feels that his degree should land him a corporate type position
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/07/busine...eral&src=me
Who the heck does this guy think he is ????? 
This is exactly what I am talking about when I mention a fool running a lemonade stand on Miami Beach.
The problem with this guy is that he has a CEO ego and thinks he is worth a ton of money...... but he is still living with mommy and daddy or else he would living under an I-95 overpass with some homeless bums. Whats so bad about accepting an entry level job and working your way up? Too many kids today with overinflated egos and zero work experience. He feels that he is entitled to a well paying job because of that piece of paper with his name on it..... how sad. 
Quote:
Rather than waste early years in dead-end work, he reasoned, he would hold out for a corporate position that would draw on his college training and put him, as he sees it, on the bottom rungs of a career ladder
This is exactly what I am talking about when I mention a fool running a lemonade stand on Miami Beach.
The problem with this guy is that he has a CEO ego and thinks he is worth a ton of money...... but he is still living with mommy and daddy or else he would living under an I-95 overpass with some homeless bums. Whats so bad about accepting an entry level job and working your way up? Too many kids today with overinflated egos and zero work experience. He feels that he is entitled to a well paying job because of that piece of paper with his name on it..... how sad. My wife insisted that I get a college degree before I attempt to start a car lot and get a dealer's license and all that expense. I figured on the cheap end, if I can get this piece of semi-abandoned property when it comes up for auction at or below appraisal value, I can have it up and running in a month, all permits, licenses, insurance, inventory, and all, for about $17,000.
So I attended for the last 2.5 years at Tarrant County College and I am still one course away, the phys ed course, which MUST be taken 5 days a week on campus (I live 75 miles one way from campus) and I don't see us being able to afford the fuel for 40 days of commuting in and out of Arlington. I don't think my car could survive 6000 miles in 8 weeks commuting in and out of D/FW anyway.
Can't I just go up there and show them I'm fat and squishy and not about to change and leave it at that?
Anyway, the degree won't help me personally or professionally. I think it was just a way for my wife to see if I would see through something as a prerequisite. And if we could afford to let me drive 750 miles a week for two months, we'd do it already. But we both know that isn't going to happen, and she's ok with me not finishing until we can find another way.
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Read this excellent story from NY Times. A guy turns down a $40,000 entry level Claims Adjuster position because he feels that his degree should land him a corporate type position
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/07/busine...eral&src=me
Who the heck does this guy think he is ?????
This is exactly what I am talking about when I mention a fool running a lemonade stand on Miami Beach.
The problem with this guy is that he has a CEO ego and thinks he is worth a ton of money...... but he is still living with mommy and daddy or else he would living under an I-95 overpass with some homeless bums. Whats so bad about accepting an entry level job and working your way up? Too many kids today with overinflated egos and zero work experience. He feels that he is entitled to a well paying job because of that piece of paper with his name on it..... how sad.
Quote:
Rather than waste early years in dead-end work, he reasoned, he would hold out for a corporate position that would draw on his college training and put him, as he sees it, on the bottom rungs of a career ladder
This is exactly what I am talking about when I mention a fool running a lemonade stand on Miami Beach.
The problem with this guy is that he has a CEO ego and thinks he is worth a ton of money...... but he is still living with mommy and daddy or else he would living under an I-95 overpass with some homeless bums. Whats so bad about accepting an entry level job and working your way up? Too many kids today with overinflated egos and zero work experience. He feels that he is entitled to a well paying job because of that piece of paper with his name on it..... how sad. Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Read this excellent story from NY Times. A guy turns down a $40,000 entry level Claims Adjuster position because he feels that his degree should land him a corporate type position
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/07/busine...eral&src=me
Who the heck does this guy think he is ?????
This is exactly what I am talking about when I mention a fool running a lemonade stand on Miami Beach.
The problem with this guy is that he has a CEO ego and thinks he is worth a ton of money...... but he is still living with mommy and daddy or else he would living under an I-95 overpass with some homeless bums. Whats so bad about accepting an entry level job and working your way up? Too many kids today with overinflated egos and zero work experience. He feels that he is entitled to a well paying job because of that piece of paper with his name on it..... how sad.
Quote:
Rather than waste early years in dead-end work, he reasoned, he would hold out for a corporate position that would draw on his college training and put him, as he sees it, on the bottom rungs of a career ladder
This is exactly what I am talking about when I mention a fool running a lemonade stand on Miami Beach.
The problem with this guy is that he has a CEO ego and thinks he is worth a ton of money...... but he is still living with mommy and daddy or else he would living under an I-95 overpass with some homeless bums. Whats so bad about accepting an entry level job and working your way up? Too many kids today with overinflated egos and zero work experience. He feels that he is entitled to a well paying job because of that piece of paper with his name on it..... how sad. 
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Originally Posted By: occupant
My wife insisted that I get a college degree before I attempt to start a car lot and get a dealer's license and all that expense. I figured on the cheap end, if I can get this piece of semi-abandoned property when it comes up for auction at or below appraisal value, I can have it up and running in a month, all permits, licenses, insurance, inventory, and all, for about $17,000.
So I attended for the last 2.5 years at Tarrant County College and I am still one course away, the phys ed course, which MUST be taken 5 days a week on campus (I live 75 miles one way from campus) and I don't see us being able to afford the fuel for 40 days of commuting in and out of Arlington. I don't think my car could survive 6000 miles in 8 weeks commuting in and out of D/FW anyway.
Can't I just go up there and show them I'm fat and squishy and not about to change and leave it at that?
Anyway, the degree won't help me personally or professionally. I think it was just a way for my wife to see if I would see through something as a prerequisite. And if we could afford to let me drive 750 miles a week for two months, we'd do it already. But we both know that isn't going to happen, and she's ok with me not finishing until we can find another way.
This is a very interesting thread. After reading all the posts, the thing that stands out to me is the lack of competence in spelling, grammar and syntax, especially by those who boast of advanced degrees. Don't all the science majors have to take freshman English?
Originally Posted By: tonycarguy
While there are worse things we can waste taxpayer dollars on, it's nonetheless wasteful to bankroll someone's education in anthropology or culinary arts
My son earned an associates degree in culinary arts with additional classes in accounting. He is now a successful restaurant manager/chef and is making decent money. He works very hard, with long hours. But, he's young and still on the low ladder rung. It's not an easy occupation and in school he was told that they have a high divorce and suicide rate.
I think it is akin to a skilled trades job. and can be as much as one wants to make it, growth wise.
Other random thoughts and opinions:
- Some people are cut out for self employment, others are not. Witness the huge number of small business failures annually....for many reasons, including personal ability.
- Very few make it to easy street alone (no outside help) without LOTS of hard work. Whether it be college, trade school, or the school of hard knock. For most, you get out life what you put into it.
- I'm cut from a different cloth. Climbing the ladder and accumulating wealth are not priorities for me. I strive to be average.....and that's a tough thing for me.....peer pressure, OCD, etc..
- College costs...in MI, about 15 years ago the state paid 75% of the tuition. Now they only pay around 30%.
To the OP, look deep into your soul in figuring out what you want to do your whole life. Maybe take some of those tests at your college that show what your tendencies/abilities are.
Good luck.
JHZR2
Staff member
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
There is this crop of dolts out there that got liberal arts degrees in things like history and political science, that think that will prepare them for a high level corporate job. Why not get that degree in accounting if you truly want that corporate job, because the base level technical business math will at least be there.
Originally Posted By: occupant
So I attended for the last 2.5 years at Tarrant County College and I am still one course away, the phys ed course, which MUST be taken 5 days a week on campus (I live 75 miles one way from campus) and I don't see us being able to afford the fuel for 40 days of commuting in and out of Arlington. I don't think my car could survive 6000 miles in 8 weeks commuting in and out of D/FW anyway.
Can't I just go up there and show them I'm fat and squishy and not about to change and leave it at that?
Originally Posted By: occupant
My wife insisted that I get a college degree before I attempt to start a car lot and get a dealer's license and all that expense.
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Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Read this excellent story from NY Times. A guy turns down a $40,000 entry level Claims Adjuster position because he feels that his degree should land him a corporate type position
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/07/busine...eral&src=me
[quote]Rather than waste early years in dead-end work, he reasoned, he would hold out for a corporate position that would draw on his college training and put him, as he sees it, on the bottom rungs of a career ladder
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Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Read this excellent story from NY Times. A guy turns down a $40,000 entry level Claims Adjuster position because he feels that his degree should land him a corporate type position
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/07/busine...eral&src=me
[quote]Rather than waste early years in dead-end work, he reasoned, he would hold out for a corporate position that would draw on his college training and put him, as he sees it, on the bottom rungs of a career ladder
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
[quote=LT4 Vette]Read this excellent story from NY Times. A guy turns down a $40,000 entry level Claims Adjuster position because he feels that his degree should land him a corporate type position
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/07/busine...eral&src=me
Yeah, but that's what Cathrine said Cousin Eddie was doing in Vacation. Holding out for a management position...
Quote:
Rather than waste early years in dead-end work, he reasoned, he would hold out for a corporate position that would draw on his college training and put him, as he sees it, on the bottom rungs of a career ladder
Look at what it got Eddie...Originally Posted By: JHZR2
No, Johnny's post reiterated my point (and the article's). His two-year associate's degree paid far more than the significantly more expensive secondary eduation degree. So going back to ROI, which had the better ROI, Johnny, who didnt actually even have a Bachelor's degree or his wife? Just proves the point that many full-up college degrees are NOT worth it in the big picture. There is a lot more to it than just having a slip of paper, and we are doing ourselves a disservice selling all sorts of degrees that dont get anyone anywhere.
Now that said, like was mentioned previously, one needs to follow their head and heart, and do what they enjoy. Johnny's wife may well do this and absolutely love and get a lot out of it... But it still does not mean that the ROI is very good.
Math and science are merely a prime example of a set of knowledge that one cannot really reasonably get without significant formal training. The average self-taught person is not going to derive all the basis tenets of calculus, physics, chemistry, etc. in their basement or back yard. But these things are the bedrock upon which any sort of other progress is made.
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