Update & Diagnosis on Honda V6 Timing Belt Failure

[CrackyWainwright]

Thank you, fellows, for all the many good comments a couple weeks ago about my Accord V6 timing belt failure. I have TWO important pieces of information for those who want to know. First, I sold the car to a mechanic who wanted to re-build the engine and keep the car for his wife since my Accord was so clean and well-maintained. After a week he messaged me and told me that while the accepted common knowledge is that a broken t-belt on an interference engine usually means bent valves, he recalled a Honda mechanic saying once that the SOHC 3.0 V6s usually **DO NOT** bend valves despite being an interference design. This mechanic who bought my car put a new t-belt on this week along with a replacement of the part that caused the failure (discussed below), and . . . that engine fired up and ran as smoothly as the day the car was first purchased! Now remember that I was at 2,000 RPMs and going up a hill when the belt turned loose. I just knew the engine was done. That's why I sold the car so quickly. So you all can imagine how much of a dumb*ss I feel like now. OK, here's what failed. It was essentially a parts failure rather than a technician error, although some may disagree. The pre-installed nut on the tension roller/pulley worked itself loose allowing the belt to flop off. The mechanic who did the job a few months ago told me today that he seldom checks that nut because it's always tight from the parts factory. Well, in this case it wasn't apparently. I have certainly learned an expensive lesson, even with what I believed to be OEM parts.

 

[MrMoody]

You got ripped twice. I'd be P. I. double-snaked. How did your mechanic learn an expensive lesson? Did you get money back? You can try to console yourself with the knowledge that if one of the exhaust valves is slightly bent, it might run OK at first but won't last long.

 

[benjamming]

The torque for the other bolt (not shown) is 19 ft-lb per Service News July 2002, but I've not see the torque for the factory installed bolt. What is it?

 

[geeman789]

Many years ago I put off a timing belt replacement for ONLY about 60 000 extra miles (broke college student ... ). Yep, it broke. Despite being told by multiple people that the engine was toast, my Dad told me to slap on a timing belt, and see what happens. If the engine is toast, well now you know for sure, for less than a $ 100.00. That engine fired right up, and ran perfect for almost 200 000 more miles ... a 1993 Acura Integra. You seem to have had it in your head that the engine must be broken ... without taking the time to find out if it was ACTUALLY broken. Somebody got a good deal ...

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Thank you for the update and writeup What kind of car did you replace it with?

 

[ctechbob]

I don't remember which youtube mechanic posted it (I know it WASN'T Scottie...) but his opinion was that since it doesn't take much time for him, the first thing he does is put a new belt on the car and see if it will run. He mentioned that he's got a pretty decent success rate with it. Thinking is that, its probably broke, but might not be, so why not check. If it runs, proceed with leakdown testing etc.

 

[The Critic]

It may have started right up, but I doubt the engine did not suffer damage. The J30 I worked on had 9 bent valves when the timing jumped at idle; this was verified with leakdown tests and from visual inspection of the removed valves. Prior to head removal, I never installed a new belt to test mine. These engines almost always bend valves.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Good to know your Accord will live to run another day. We all make decisions that seem to make sense only to find .... I guess I am too much of a knucklehead and too curious to not find out what happened.

 

[Schmoe]

My tensioner on the 06 is toast. Talked with the mechanic that swapped out the t belt at about 95K said they normally don't replace tensioners because he's never seen one fail. I thought I was getting ALL that replaced when I had the t belt work done. Great. So now I got to replace the tensioner, got 70K on that t belt now, might as well and take the plunge and replace everything once it's opened up. Ugghhhh and $$$$$$$

 

[Rand]

It was well known on older subaru EJ engines to change everything.. most dealers would just do the belt.. The pullies might have made it to 105k miles but they usually didnt make it to 210k miles. And the dealership techs would just give you the retard look if you asked about replacing everything. Did the mechanic supply the bad part?

 

[Hall]

How much did you sell it for ? Couldn't have been much because you were selling it on the basis of it having a dead engine. First thing that mechanic did was put a scope inside to see if there were any 'dings' on the piston. Why else go through the labor of replacing the belt.

 

[AC1DD]

Originally Posted by MrMoody

You got ripped twice. I'd be P. I. double-snaked. How did your mechanic learn an expensive lesson? Did you get money back? You can try to console yourself with the knowledge that if one of the exhaust valves is slightly bent, it might run OK at first but won't last long.

I too feel bad for "Cracky" If I was the tech that bought the car I would have thrown a TB onto it and if it worked properly I would have asked the PO if he just wanted to buy it back for the cash he received plus the cost of the belt install. That would be the stand up way to handle that situation. @Cracky: Thanks for the follow up. Wish the tech that bought your car would have the character to sell it back to you for what he paid you and just asked for the belt install..

 

[dishdude]

Originally Posted by AC1DD

Originally Posted by MrMoody

You got ripped twice. I'd be P. I. double-snaked. How did your mechanic learn an expensive lesson? Did you get money back? You can try to console yourself with the knowledge that if one of the exhaust valves is slightly bent, it might run OK at first but won't last long.

I too feel bad for "Cracky" If I was the tech that bought the car I would have thrown a TB onto it and if it worked properly I would have asked the PO if he just wanted to buy it back for the cash he received. That would be the stand up way to handle that situation. @Cracky: Thanks for the follow up. Wish the tech that bought your car would have the character to sell it back to you for what he paid you.

Not me, I'd tell him every valve was bent and I had to send the heads out to be rebuilt. Lost my tail on this deal!

 

[AC1DD]

Originally Posted by dishdude

Not me, I'd tell him every valve was bent and I had to send the heads out to be rebuilt. Lost my tail on this deal!

Yeah, I know. But the car has sentimental value to Cracky so in cases like this I'd take the high road. Karma and all.

 

[sloinker]

A leak down test would indicate any bent valves. Any competent mechanic can perform this test.

 

[pbm]

Originally Posted by dishdude

Originally Posted by AC1DD

Originally Posted by MrMoody

You got ripped twice. I'd be P. I. double-snaked. How did your mechanic learn an expensive lesson? Did you get money back? You can try to console yourself with the knowledge that if one of the exhaust valves is slightly bent, it might run OK at first but won't last long.

I too feel bad for "Cracky" If I was the tech that bought the car I would have thrown a TB onto it and if it worked properly I would have asked the PO if he just wanted to buy it back for the cash he received. That would be the stand up way to handle that situation. @Cracky: Thanks for the follow up. Wish the tech that bought your car would have the character to sell it back to you for what he paid you.

Not me, I'd tell him every valve was bent and I had to send the heads out to be rebuilt. Lost my tail on this deal!

Sending the message that it only needed a belt was rubbing salt in the wound.....I wouldn't have lied but I wouldn't have bragged about it either.....If asked, I would have told him about the loose nut on the tensioner causing the belt to break and say something like "the bent valves weren't as many as I thought there would be"....

 

[WyrTwister]

Originally Posted by ctechbob

I don't remember which youtube mechanic posted it (I know it WASN'T Scottie...) but his opinion was that since it doesn't take much time for him, the first thing he does is put a new belt on the car and see if it will run. He mentioned that he's got a pretty decent success rate with it. Thinking is that, its probably broke, but might not be, so why not check. If it runs, proceed with leakdown testing etc.

I think that sounds like Eric the Car Guy .

 

[Gebo]

If it is any consolation, your post may save one of us a lot of money one day. Thanks for sharing as I never would have believed the engine was not destroyed. Could you offer to buy it back for a little more than he paid you for it? Say let him make $300 or so? Just thinking... If I really wanted the car back, I'd try and get it back. You have nothing to lose. Make it worth his while. I, too, have a few concerns about how the mechanic handled everything but did he do anything wrong? I don't think so.

 

[BAJA_05]

One mans trash is another mans treasure. Hopefully the mechanic that purchased it for his wife gets multiple years of worry free service if anything.

 

[brages]

Originally Posted by Schmoe

My tensioner on the 06 is toast. Talked with the mechanic that swapped out the t belt at about 95K said they normally don't replace tensioners because he's never seen one fail.

I don't know about the Accord J30, but on the J35's the hydraulic tensioners leak and go bad all the time.