Toyota 2AZ-FE changes for 5W20

[John_Snyder]

I have a 2009 Vibe with the Toyota 2AZ-FE 2.4 which specs 5W20 or 0W20. From what I've read recently, until a couple of years ago, these engines were spec'd for 5W30.

I was wondering what changes were done to the engine for the 5W20 usage. I've read that the older ones aren't supposed to run it, so I figure there must have been a few changes.

I'm mainly wondering because IF 5W30 may be preferable to use during the warmer months (wear-wise), then I'll use it. I live only about 250m from the highway on-ramp I use every day - so I'm sticking with 5W20 for the winter for sure. In the summer I occasionally do some towing (up to about 1,000 pounds). This doesn't seem to faze it much - but I'd like to do what's best for it. I'd like to avoid car payments for as long as possible once this one's done!

Although it shouldn't make much difference - the majority of my mileage is for commuting to work each day - 58km each way (36 miles), with the odd shorter trip on the weekends.

Any input would be welcome. Thanks in advance!
John

 

[PT1]

I have an 08 Rav4 with the same engine (5w20 as well) I am wondering the same thing. I will use the 5w20 at least until the warranty is up.

 

[tomcat27]

no clearances, tolerances, or machining was changed to "accommodate" the 20 weight oils. simply a desire for better mileage, and also faster oil flow to the valvetrain, especially the VVT components.

 

[hate2work]

If you lived in a warmer climate, you MIGHT be better off with a 30W in the summer, although that's been debated many times on this forum and elsewhere.

If I were me, I'd stick with 5W-20 year round, even for towing.

Putting your thoughts and efforts into properly maintaining your vehicle regularly ( including changing your oil ) will pay much larger dividends than which weight oil you use.

 

[The Critic]

The 2006 and newer 2AZ-FE engines hold about 4.5 quarts of oil, while the older 2AZ-FE engines held 4 quarts, sometimes a bit less. 2006 was when the 2AZ-FE switched over to 5w-20, or at least that's what the TSB said.

 

[RCPetrol]

The 5W-20, 0W-20 id for fuel economy reasons, not a whole lot else.

 

[crinkles]

aussie sump capacity = 4.5 qts
here is the aussie chart for motor oil in the 2AZ-FE

 

[prax]

Originally Posted By: crinkles
aussie sump capacity = 4.5 qts
here is the aussie chart for motor oil in the 2AZ-FE


What kind of oil is recommended in your owner's manual? ILSAC and/or API SL/SM? ACEA? In the US they tell us to use ILSAC oil for the 2AZ-FE. I think the starburst symbol is on the oil cap.

Is there any difference in pricing and availability between 5w-20, 5w-30, 10w-30, 15w-40, and 20w-50?

 

[crinkles]

Originally Posted By: prax
Originally Posted By: crinkles
aussie sump capacity = 4.5 qts
here is the aussie chart for motor oil in the 2AZ-FE


What kind of oil is recommended in your owner's manual? ILSAC and/or API SL/SM? ACEA? In the US they tell us to use ILSAC oil for the 2AZ-FE. I think the starburst symbol is on the oil cap.

Is there any difference in pricing and availability between 5w-20, 5w-30, 10w-30, 15w-40, and 20w-50?


well... in the main section... it is SJ/L *OR* ILSAC oil .
in the back section, it is SJ/L *AND* ILSAC.

problem is, even though the chart shows 15w-40 and 20w-50 as OK, they CANNOT be ILSAC oils due to the viscosity. (but CAN be SJ/L/M)

clear as mud!

a 15w-40 mineral will be about half to 2/3 of the price of a 10w-30...

 

[prax]

I guess the next question would be, what year is this for?

Camry- all 2az-fe. In 2007 they modified the engine a bit, don't remember what exactly.

2007 ILSAC, 5w-20, 0w-20.
2006 ILSAC, 5w-30.
2005 API SL or ILSAC, 5w-30.
2002 API SJ/SL or ILSAC. 5w-30 preferred, 10w-30.

As for availability here, no Pennzoil, Castrol, etc. for 15w-40. It's only sold as something like Shell Rotella. There's a lot more 5w-20,5w-30, and 10w-30. SAme price for those 3. 15w-40 isn't much cheaper.

 

[crinkles]

2002-2006

 

[odessit]

2007 and newer engines have extra oil jets and couple other minor mods to allow xW-20 oils.

2006 2AZ-FE was back-specked for xW-20 oils, I never found out if it received the hardware changes.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I suspect out local Toyota dealer put 5w20 in our 05 Rav 4 and I beleive this is what contibuted to its early demise at 58K. They may have misinterpreted the TSB which was allowing GF4 oil as "Genuine Toyota Motor Oil"

 

[ARCOgraphite]

The 5w-20 has a nice tight 15pt vis spread which should make it robust (other than a high volatility). Why go to a 0w and ruin the party, though 0w is prob just a small difference at -30 or so before loss of pumpability and may point to to severe hydrocraked or syn base stock usage - or the lack of long alkanes due to dewaxing. Ignore pour point, pretty useless AFA the engine is concerned.

 

[bepperb]

For the Highlander, there was a change to the block that took place in the summer of '03. After that, the blocks are all the same. In 05, to prepare for the 5w-20 spec, the size of the oil pan was increased by 1/2 quart, as stated.

The American made Camry's did not get a change in the engine block at that same time (the Highlander is made in Japan) and I'm not sure when they did as their blocks are not the same code.

Even with the small pan, 5w-20 probably isn't a concern since the OCI is so short anyway, and at lest the Highlander has a coolant/oil heat exchanger.

ARCO, again with the "early demise"? A leaky water pump has nothing to do with 5-20, as much as you want to blame something for it.

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
I suspect out local Toyota dealer put 5w20 in our 05 Rav 4 and I beleive this is what contibuted to its early demise at 58K. They may have misinterpreted the TSB which was allowing GF4 oil as "Genuine Toyota Motor Oil"


Did that make a DIY oil changer believer out of you? That is the #1 reason I do my own. At least my engines all get a decent synthetic oil and quality filter (pure one) for a fraction of the cost of some dealers bulk oil change with a no name filter.

 

[JohnBrowning]

My 2003 2AZ-FE is not backwards certified for 5W20 or 0W20 so it was not just a matter of them deciding they wanted better fuel ecconomy like tomcatt27 assumes or else my 2003 2AZ-FE would be go to go. Let not let facts get inthe way of a good disccussion though.

I know they added piston squirter on the 2AZ-FE and mine does not have these. They also increased sump capacity from 3.9 quarts to 4.5 quarts. Not having a 2003 and a 2007 Repair Manual for either car I can not tell you the clearances of the parts. It goes with out saying though that only a moron company like GM would keep making the old part if the new part will fit. SO if they made changes you might not be able to tell looking in parts catalog because they might have gone to the better of the two parts in any place where they are the same in terms of clearance. So for instance if they decided to make the oil pump,crank bearing,rod bearing,cam followers, valve guides,chain,sprockets etc.....out of a higher grade of material and to heat treat it differently or deeper to better wisth stand the 5W20 they would not keep the lesser specification parts on hand any longer only where the new part would nto fit at all. So one really needs a Service Manual and access to production or replacement parts blue prints with specifications...........

I spent 7 years doing a mix of catalog research,quality control,and analytical tear downs for GM you have to have acess to the engineering screens, prints, all production part and casting number's as well as any changes and updates and the prints for production parts and replacement as often they are not made to the exact same specification and often not made by the same supplier!I have spent days before looking for a valve that waas used in limited production for RV's that was titanium or stainless steel exhast manifolds for big blocks fromt he OEM that where tubular had the air injections holes and where hand welded etc.......I have also spent days tracking part and casting changes looking for the problem in an axel assebly comeing to use from American Axel from outside the USA etc.........Trying to nail down these changes with out all of the above and no engine to tear into as a source of casting numbers and parts numbers is almost impossable unless someone at the OEM tells you!

So seeinghow my 2003 model can not use it as specified by Toyota in their TSB on which years and engines could and could not be switched over I think it is safe to say they changed more then we are aware.

I would guess heavily they are using Honda's low lead hybrid matrix to toughen their already low lead aluminum bearings! I am guessing most of you guys have not read the threads of 5W20 when Ford and Honda first went over to it. Honda had invented a new latice matrix for the lead in their bearing that was insanely tougher and more resistant to streaking, embedding or deforming then all other allows of lead in bearings!

Also clearance do not need to change much to handle 5W20 or 0W20 assuming the car had decent presure and volume with 5W30 the difference is not that great in a healthy engine. You would need though to harden the parts a tad deeper which might mean you need to change allows.

I do not think the piston squirter where added specifically for the use of 5W20. I think they added them to allow more timing variation especially under boost. A lot of Tc owners had issues with detonation at even modest levels of boost pressure. Piston squirter's help take some heat away allow slightly more radical timing and boost.It was around the same time though that that change was made that you also say the ability to use 5W20 so knows what else they did!

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Originally Posted By: bepperb
... ... ...

ARCO, again with the "early demise"? A leaky water pump has nothing to do with 5-20, as much as you want to blame something for it.
That was just the nail in the "trade in - or not" coffin. That engine ran great on the 5w30 and vehicle died after 1 OC service interval at the dealer. I Didnt regularly drive the vehicle (it was wife's) so i had no aural evidence of impending doom. The probem was heavy piston slap and excessive oil burning, low power. Add to that 6 tappets required reclearancing and maybe a cam if found worn. Traded it. I have the VIN (posted here somewhere) if you want to check service history through a service data source.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Originally Posted By: JohnBrowning


I do not think the piston squirter where added specifically for the use of 5W20. I think they added them to allow more timing variation especially under boost. A lot of Tc owners had issues with detonation at even modest levels of boost pressure. Piston squirter's help take some heat away allow slightly more radical timing and boost.It was around the same time though that that change was made that you also say the ability to use 5W20 so knows what else they did!
No stock hair drier on these - do you mean "BOOST" with a TRD blower kit?

 

[elwaylite]

I have no doubt that is what John meant...