The recall merry-go-round spins again...

Joined
Feb 1, 2009
Messages
8,859
Location
Texas
We had our first problem with the 2011 Grand Cherokee over the weekend. No-start, then intermittent no-start. Often start-stumble-die, restart fine. I could hear the fuel pump wasn't always running normally when you first turn the ignition on, so I knew what it was: the infamous (among Jeep forum rats anyway) non-replaceable fuel pump relay built into the Totally Integrated Power Module. Thanks for that legacy of engineering idiocy, Daimler. Hope it bites you in the M-class, and I bet your version is even more expensive. When I bypassed the TIPM, the pump runs normally, engine starts normally, so the relay is definitely the problem (FWIW- this page has a beautifully elegant kludge-around to a) diagnose the problem and b) get back up and running). A little more web-grepping reveals that as of Sep 20 there is now an official recall (P54) for this, but (wait for it!) it doesn't officially go out until Oct 24. And (wait again....) the parts aren't kitted up yet. The gal at Chrysler Customer Service was very helpful and tells me that my case and VIN has been sent to special handling, and I'm "at the top of the priority list" since I'm actually experiencing the problem. Well... I will be again when I remove the work-around before taking it to the dealer. ;-) I'm *still* waiting for parts for two non-critical recalls, one of which has been pending since June. Now I understand that one is a "snow-belt" critical recall (corrosion and freezing water in the brake booster) and so they're working the northern states before winter, but geez-o-Pete! Maybe its just Chrysler being Chrysler- I'm a fan, but I admit their weak spots and the service network is definitely a weak spot. But I hear the same thing from co-workers with all sorts of brands- recalls come out, and then its weeks or months before it can actually get done. And to make matters worse, the automakers are responding to questionably critical recalls at the same priority as ones, like a fuel pump relay, that render the vehicle inoperative (unless you know how to hack around the issue). Ever since the high-publicity Toyota and GM recalls of the past few years, the NHTSA had gone recall-crazy, and its saturating the system (IMO, anyway). This is why I so rarely buy new vehicles. How do people that can't read a schematic and hack together a temporary fix even function when their cars act up these days?
 
Joined
Apr 9, 2008
Messages
15,200
Location
Central NY
I feel bad when I read about someone getting a new vehicle and having it completely out of service for days ,weeks, months at a time while they are making payments on it. Someone in the local jeep club (not picking on them in particular, but that's one that happened just last month) had their Jeep at the dealer for over a month because the W5A580 transmission wouldn't shift right. Felt bad for him. Same for the people that buy the Focuses and Fiestas and have bum dual clutch transmissions. It is nice buying a used vehicle that has had all of the bugs worked out - that's for sure!
 
Joined
Oct 9, 2011
Messages
5,091
Location
USA
Cant beat a 3 speed hydraulic control TorqueFlite and an external ASD relay....we are supposed to forget about those with all these fancy 300hp/VVT/HEMI/MDS/AWD/SRS/ABS technology packed computers rolling around now.Bet you remember that old stuff when your newer rig is broken down and an old K car or Escort drives by living just another ordinary day.
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Messages
16,696
Location
NE,Ohio
this is a whole byproduct of the ever increase CAFE and the search for that last MPG... and cheapness. That and the whole bean counter mentality. Part A has been around for 20 years in various forms.. works great. Part B can be made 5% cheaper and it should work just fine.....
 
Last edited:
Joined
Oct 7, 2012
Messages
3,001
Location
NYC
My recent service experiences with my '13 300 would be in line with yours. They're trying.... I gotta give them that, but some of the engineering and build quality still isn't up to scratch, and no ones gonna take them seriously until they can make a small car that Americans want to buy... Lookin at you, Dart!
 
Joined
Sep 14, 2010
Messages
7,485
Location
S California
A co-worker has had his Jeep parked at the dealer since late June. I don't know exactly what's going on but with no end in sight for getting it fixed he called Chrysler Capital and told them this month that he's no longer making payments. His claim is that part of the sales contract is to provide a serviceable vehicle that at least starts and runs and since the dealer supplied the loan through factory finance maybe they can get together and solve this problem. The vehicle can do neither of those functions. There are also other problems like body rust, shifting problems, brake booster failure, contaminated and leaky fuel tank, stuck driver's window and all this on a brand new vehicle. The Jeep has in fact been parked with the driver's window stuck open to the weather. They did not even bother to seal the opening. One prediction I can make as an outside observer, he will never purchase another Chrysler product after having been a Chrysler person for many years. He said the problems are bad enough but what really set him off was the factory's response. Evidently the assembly line has all the parts they need and continues building vehicles but customers that have already paid are left behind. Logic has it that new improved parts are going in or maybe Chrysler isn't bothered by such details.
 
Joined
Mar 16, 2003
Messages
3,565
Location
Colorado
Why anyone would buy a Jeep or any Chrysler vehicle today is beyond me. They are among the worst made and most unreliable vehicles ever! Up there with Land Rover. Sorry for your troubles but cut your losses and get rid of those POS.
 
Joined
Oct 10, 2008
Messages
19,699
Location
Sunny Florida
Originally Posted By: Chris B.
Why anyone would buy a Jeep or any Chrysler vehicle today is beyond me. They are among the worst made and most unreliable vehicles ever! Up there with Land Rover. Sorry for your troubles but cut your losses and get rid of those POS.
Brainless brand bashing really undermines your point. Which is that EVERY mfgr makes lemons, every single one. The problem here is far more related to stealerships being unable to diagnose and properly repair the vehicle in a timely manner.
 
Joined
Oct 4, 2007
Messages
1,606
Location
Oahu, Hawaii
What turned me off from buying a used Chrysler product is the possibly of the TIPM failing. Why did they have to make something simple complicated? All this complicated stuff and CAFE requirements are useless anyways, people drive like idiots anyways, why need this [censored]?
 

440Magnum

Thread starter
Joined
Feb 1, 2009
Messages
8,859
Location
Texas
Originally Posted By: Chris B.
Why anyone would buy a Jeep or any Chrysler vehicle today is beyond me. They are among the worst made and most unreliable vehicles ever! Up there with Land Rover. Sorry for your troubles but cut your losses and get rid of those POS.
Not to be too blunt, but that's just not reality. They have their issues, but I've put >200,000 miles on every Chrysler product I've owned, over 400,000 on one in particular, and have had VERY few problems. In fact, this is the first in about 10 years. And maybe you missed the part where they took some action, despite the recall not actually going into effect for another 3 weeks. The point of the thread isn't so much the particular VEHICLE, its the REGULATORY process drowning legitimate problem fixes under a sea of ridiculous recalls because anyone with web access these days can be a thorn in the NHTSA's side, and the press will jump on any bandwagon these days, too. It used to be the really dangerous defects got recalls.
 

440Magnum

Thread starter
Joined
Feb 1, 2009
Messages
8,859
Location
Texas
Originally Posted By: wirelessF
What turned me off from buying a used Chrysler product is the possibly of the TIPM failing. Why did they have to make something simple complicated?
Because that part comes from the Diamler era. That says all that needs to be said about why its over-complicated and expensive. :-/
 
Joined
Jun 4, 2005
Messages
750
Location
North Florida
I understand that some Chrysler products have a bad reputation for reliability, but I my last two cars have been Chrysler products (Dodge) and I have been satisfied with them. My 2005 Dodge Magnum RT had a few minor problems that were fixed under warranty. It was not Honda/Lexus quality, but I loved the car and, other than hassles with a certain dealer, I was happy with the car. I did not hesitate to trade it on a 2012 Dodge Challenger SRT8. The Challenger has been even more reliable. It has only been back to the dealer once, and that was for a recall for an air bag wiring harness problem (although it had not exhibited itself on my car, I had the wiring harness replaced). And both of my Dodge's were designed during the Daimler era, in fact many of the suspension components used a shared design with Mercedes products during that period. I know each persons experience with a particular brand can vary. My experience with VW has soured me on them and I will never own another Volkswagen based on my previous experience with them.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Nov 11, 2010
Messages
9,783
Location
Saskatoon canada
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Chris B.
Why anyone would buy a Jeep or any Chrysler vehicle today is beyond me. They are among the worst made and most unreliable vehicles ever! Up there with Land Rover. Sorry for your troubles but cut your losses and get rid of those POS.
Not to be too blunt, but that's just not reality. They have their issues, but I've put >200,000 miles on every Chrysler product I've owned, over 400,000 on one in particular, and have had VERY few problems. In fact, this is the first in about 10 years. And maybe you missed the part where they took some action, despite the recall not actually going into effect for another 3 weeks. The point of the thread isn't so much the particular VEHICLE, its the REGULATORY process drowning legitimate problem fixes under a sea of ridiculous recalls because anyone with web access these days can be a thorn in the NHTSA's side, and the press will jump on any bandwagon these days, too. It used to be the really dangerous defects got recalls.
Chris You obviously have some kind of brand bias and it's showing. Firstly I like mustangs. Not really a ford guy though,if anything I'm a chev guy. That being said I've owned 3 dodge trucks. 2 of them went in excess of 450000kms on them,never having opened an engine. Went thru a few trannies and a rear end though. Then my 04 hemi quad cab 4x4 was dead reliable and at 270k needed nothing but routine maintenance. My 06 charger has had routine maintenance and has 85k miles right now. So another notch for dodge. My dad has only bought dodge trucks since 1989 and he puts gas in them. That's it. So I'd call that reliable. Now I've had many chev and ford trucks too. Fuel pumps got changed at 200000kms. Never had any other real issues. So I'd call that reliable too. Over the years I've bought all makes and models and I can say without a doubt dodge is easily as reliable and long lasting as anything else I've owned. The driver might have something to do with potential problems,more so than the manufacturer being defective. So lose the chip on your shoulder. If anything my dodge products have been better than any other manufacturer. In fact if I had to call any if my previous vehicles junk it would be my 2000 mustang. And only because it spit out plugs costing me time and effort changing heads. The engine itself was great. The heads sucked. I've put over a million miles on 3 dodge ram trucks. Not one of those trucks owed me anything when they got totalled and because of those trucks is why I bought my charger. The hemi is a great engine and with mds it's a gas miser as well. I've still got chev 4x4's and they are both over 200k and they still start first turn. And are great in the mud. And snow. And calling 1 manufacturer junk based on quality control these days is hillarious and has to be a joke. This year alone hasn't every manufacturer recalled something. But yeah,Chrysler is bad. Hillarious.
 
Joined
Sep 15, 2011
Messages
3,566
Location
Somewhere
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Chris B.
Why anyone would buy a Jeep or any Chrysler vehicle today is beyond me. They are among the worst made and most unreliable vehicles ever! Up there with Land Rover. Sorry for your troubles but cut your losses and get rid of those POS.
Not to be too blunt, but that's just not reality.
To be blunt, it is the reality. JD Powers, Consumer Reports, and just about every other publication that tracks long term dependability puts Chrysler corp. vehicles at the bottom of the heap! Those are the facts. In addition, purchasers of those vehicles are not very loyal which makes you wonder why. If you had a good experience you would buy another, if not you stay away. http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/08/17/cars-most-likely-to-be-dumped/14121469/ #2 Chrysler #3 Dodge Sorry Mopar fans, while YOU may have had a good/great experience the majority of Americans have not. The excuses are always there "It was Daimler", "it was Cereberus", "it was xxx". Really? What are the excuses now that the 2010's are showing to be [censored]-boxes too? Call it bashing, but it's not bashing when the facts support your claim.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Sep 15, 2011
Messages
3,566
Location
Somewhere
Originally Posted By: Clevy
That being said I've owned 3 dodge trucks. 2 of them went in excess of 450000kms on them,never having opened an engine. Went thru a few trannies and a rear end though.
Quote:
Now I've had many chev and ford trucks too. Fuel pumps got changed at 200000kms. Never had any other real issues.
What's wrong with this picture? Dodge = reliable if it spits a few transmissions and a few rear ends. Ford, Chev = reliable if it only needs fuel pumps. I'd call puking transmissions and rear ends unreliable....
Quote:
In fact if I had to call any if my previous vehicles junk it would be my 2000 mustang. And only because it spit out plugs costing me time and effort changing heads.
The engineer that approved that POS should be drawn and quartered.
 
Joined
Apr 9, 2008
Messages
15,200
Location
Central NY
Originally Posted By: itguy08
Originally Posted By: Clevy
That being said I've owned 3 dodge trucks. 2 of them went in excess of 450000kms on them,never having opened an engine. Went thru a few trannies and a rear end though.
Quote:
Now I've had many chev and ford trucks too. Fuel pumps got changed at 200000kms. Never had any other real issues.
What's wrong with this picture? Dodge = reliable if it spits a few transmissions and a few rear ends. Ford, Chev = reliable if it only needs fuel pumps. I'd call puking transmissions and rear ends unreliable....
Quote:
In fact if I had to call any if my previous vehicles junk it would be my 2000 mustang. And only because it spit out plugs costing me time and effort changing heads.
The engineer that approved that POS should be drawn and quartered.
Cost saving measure. "Lets only drill 3 threads!"
 
Joined
Jun 24, 2004
Messages
14,505
Location
Top of Virginia
Originally Posted By: jhs914
And both of my Dodge's were designed during the Daimler era, in fact many of the suspension components used a shared design with Mercedes products during that period.
To sort of echo your statement, I think the Chryslers that are more German underneath than those that are not have been the best ones sold. We had two minivans and neither were spectacular. The later one, an '07 model, was a pure nightmare. It seems that the vehicles with the tightest cross-walk between Daimler and Chrysler, the LX platform cars, are generally the most durable. Maybe it was because they were brand new platforms, and didn't suffer from engineering shortfalls that continued on through two or three generations of product. That was prevalent in the minivans.
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
4,276
Location
Central Maryland
It pains me since I own one and like the styling and the brand, but Chrysler/Dodge does have its problems. I did the research when car shopping last year, and indeed Mitsubishi (which provides a lot of engines and tech for Chrysler) is bumping along the bottom of every stat and survey, and Dodge and Chrysler just barely above Mitsubishi. The Ram brand does a little better, and of course trucks are more servicable and often have better parts availability than the crampled little automobiles. I try not to brand-bash because they all have their problems. One exception I make is Ford and Triton engines- so many of my friends and family have been hit with big head repair bills due to ejecting spark plugs and breaking long-nose spark plugs, and yet those you-know-whats never recalled or paid a dime to any owners for their design issues. So Ford has a special place in my heart for screwing over their loyal owners.
 

440Magnum

Thread starter
Joined
Feb 1, 2009
Messages
8,859
Location
Texas
Originally Posted By: HangFire
It pains me since I own one and like the styling and the brand, but Chrysler/Dodge does have its problems. I did the research when car shopping last year, and indeed Mitsubishi (which provides a lot of engines and tech for Chrysler) is bumping along the bottom of every stat and survey, and Dodge and Chrysler just barely above Mitsubishi.
Mitsubishi and Chrysler haven't shared anything whatsoever for many years now. The last Mitsubishi engine that Chrysler used was the 2.5 liter V6 in the Cirrus/Stratus/Sebring of the early 2000s. The Diamond-Star alliance is long gone (10+ years). The GEMA engine (Chrysler/Hyundai/Mitsubishi) was the very last remnant and it has been replaced by the Tigershark which though based on the same basic architecture, is very heavily updated. Don't let the ignorant brand-haters bother you. The "I'd rather push a Ford than drive a Chevy" (or vice-versa) mentality will never die. All manufacturers have hiccups and glitches. GM has their ignition switch fiasco. Honda has more recalls this year than Chrysler, despite a smaller market share. Even mighty Toyota got caught writing very poor powertrain control software and it bit them in the tush... and unfortunately caused a spate of accidents when the throttle hung open while the process rebooted (which it was found to do MULTIPLE times on an average drive, though usually too fast for the driver to notice.)
 
Top