The future of Saturn

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Saturn will become like the Kirkland brand for Costco. Just as Kirkland puts their label on good made by someone else, Saturn will simply re-badge vehicles that they get from other manufacturers.

Not a bad idea, really. And not too far off from the current business model, where many carmakers spec-out sub-assemblies that suppliers produce...the carmaker typically just does final assembly of these sub-assemblies.
 
Saturn's brand value is so diminished that I don't think it is salvageable. It's very early buzz and success was squandered by a decade of neglect and the early powerplants were notorious oil burners. Even with GM's "latest" product (they actually got the Opel Vectra/Saturn Aura before Chevy got the Malibu) sales were lackluster. The only product that was really holding its own was the previous generation VUE which was a platform shared with the Opel Antara/Pontiac Torrent/Chevy Equinox/Suzuki XL7 and which had a fuel efficient and RELIABLE Honda 3.5L V6 + Honda 5sp auto. So what did they do? Replaced it with a rebadged Opel Antara (designed mostly by Daewoo), replaced the engine and transmission with GM parts that offered worse fuel economy and then moved assembly to Mexico from Spring Hill.

I could go on, but I think many will agree that Saturn died a death of a thousand incompetent cuts rather than from any one particular shortcoming. While I think it is unfortunate that so many jobs are being cut and will continue to disappear in the US, I think the blame lies with the big 3 and their toxic relationship with an even more incompetently managed labor union.

Sad...but life goes on. Americans will continue to buy autos...they'll just be made by someone else.
 
Originally Posted By: G-MAN
Originally Posted By: 1999nick
Should be no problem with parts for the Saturn Aura, as it is a re-badged Chevy Malibu.


Actually, both cars are based on the Opel Epsilon platform so neither is a "re-badged" version of the other.


Auras come down the same Chevrolet assembly line as the Malibu, and uses the same mechanical components (engines,etc.) as the Malibu. They have about the same kin to Opel as various models of Ford and Mazda have to Volvo. The Malibu and Aura are the same kin as a Ford Crown Vic is to a Mercury Grand Marquis.

There would not be the present Aura if GM had not produced the Malibu, and the Aura is, you might say, just an after thought.
 
The Spring Hill, TN Assembly plant (the former Saturn plant) is being shut down. Now it's idle but supposed to be completely shut down by November I believe.

It's a retooled and modern plant. Dunno why VW just doesn't move their aspirations for a new plant HERE rather than build a brand new facility near Chattanooga, TN.

I can only hope Penske does something good with Saturn and hopefully keeps American workers making Saturns rather than having them be some rebadged foreign unit.
 
Yeah, I wish GM would have just focused all their small car/fuel efficent tech on the Saturn brand. The Vue Greenline was a start. They should have kept it up and made Ion Greenlines. People also forgot about the dent-resistant panels. Saturn had real credibility at one point.
 
The resale of my 03 saturn ion dropped to nothing. Mine has 40k miles on it, and is in great shape.

I'll keep driving the thing, put a new hd-radio stereo and speakers in it, and laugh at my buddies who make car payments.

Mine has the dent resistant panels, and the 2.2L ecotec motor.
 
Read an article in Motor Trend last night stating that Penske has put forth the requirement that the cars sold under the Saturn name are to be manufactured in the U.S. I can't remember the details because I read it so fast, but excess plant capacity at Nissan for the Sentra and Altima are involved.
 
Originally Posted By: Familyguy
and RELIABLE Honda 3.5L V6 + Honda 5sp auto.


Honda's 5sp Auto is not reliable.

I own one.

Honda makes fantastic engines,particularly the I4.

Auto transmissions not so much.
 
The transmission in the first year Vues is a huge piece of junk.You will read about this a lot and an used transmission for this model is not cheap,about $1,400.00 for an used transmission.My father almost bought one with the transmission in pieces and glad he did not buy it.Roger Penske whom bought Saturn does own a Dodge dealership somewhere also.
 
That was the "VTi" CVT used with 2.2L VUEs.

Worst auto trans ever IMO and I consider myself quite a fan of Saturn.

Replaced by the "old fashioned" GM 4T45-E that also holds up much better than the Honda transaxle with its rather tiny torque converter that occasionally causes shuddering problems.

It will be interesting to see if Penske is brave enough to offer another CVT equipped Saturn if he is going to sell the Nissan based cars. Many Saturn buyers were badly burned by the VTi, despite the extended warranty.
 
Originally Posted By: DeeAgeaux
Originally Posted By: Familyguy
and RELIABLE Honda 3.5L V6 + Honda 5sp auto.


Honda's 5sp Auto is not reliable.

I own one.

Honda makes fantastic engines,particularly the I4.

Auto transmissions not so much.


I'd have to disagree with you there. I've put 150k on two of these and had nary a problem. I did dump and refill the transmission fluid every 30k though (there's no filter).

It's the same trans used on the Pilot/MDX/Odyssey of the same vintage.
 
Originally Posted By: wafrederick1
The transmission in the first year Vues is a huge piece of junk.You will read about this a lot and an used transmission for this model is not cheap,about $1,400.00 for an used transmission.My father almost bought one with the transmission in pieces and glad he did not buy it.Roger Penske whom bought Saturn does own a Dodge dealership somewhere also.


That would have been either an Aisin or a Vti (if it was a CVT). The Aisin is about average, but the VTi was a steaming pile and had a very high failure rate with the VUE. It was so bad that Saturn didn't offer them anymore after 2004. The Honda drivetrain was by far the most reliable offered in that vehicle.
 
I purchased a 2008 Saturn Aura XR last year. I was recently considering a 2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe and I was shocked at the resale value offered for my extremely clean, low mile Aura XR. I like the car and it drives very well. I bought it because I was considering a Saab 9-3 and the cars have several similarities and the Saturn had a better motor. I originally wanted a GTI, but my wife wanted me to get a 4 door sedan. I have no complaints about the Saturn, which is good because it looks like I will be driving it for a very long time. I wonder if the resale values will ever level off?
 
The first few years is where car depreciate the fastest. I think saabs depreciated by something like 50% in the first 2 years.
 
Originally Posted By: Burt

Penske has no business trying to run a manufacturing company, much less engineer a car. He is a retail distributor.


You might want to do a bit of research on RP before you embarrass yourself. Roger Penske did a fantastic turnaround at Detroit Diesel.
smirk2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Lucky
I purchased a 2008 Saturn Aura XR last year. I was recently considering a 2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe and I was shocked at the resale value offered for my extremely clean, low mile Aura XR. I like the car and it drives very well. I bought it because I was considering a Saab 9-3 and the cars have several similarities and the Saturn had a better motor. I originally wanted a GTI, but my wife wanted me to get a 4 door sedan. I have no complaints about the Saturn, which is good because it looks like I will be driving it for a very long time. I wonder if the resale values will ever level off?


Unfortunately, Saturns have always had rather poor resale value and GM's recent antics and the uncertainty around Saturn's future seems to have only made things worse. Imagine my surprise when my wife asked a local dealer about trading in her 3 year old VUE on a new vehicle. They offered her approximately 25% of what we paid for it 3 years ago and it only has 35k miles on it. No major complaints with it, but if you're one of those folks that flips rides every few years you'll get eaten alive by the depreciation on a Saturn. The Honda drivetrain has been a joy to own and I wouldn't have even considered buying the vehicle if it had a GM V6 in it.
 
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Originally Posted By: Familyguy
Originally Posted By: Lucky
I purchased a 2008 Saturn Aura XR last year. I was recently considering a 2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe and I was shocked at the resale value offered for my extremely clean, low mile Aura XR. I like the car and it drives very well. I bought it because I was considering a Saab 9-3 and the cars have several similarities and the Saturn had a better motor. I originally wanted a GTI, but my wife wanted me to get a 4 door sedan. I have no complaints about the Saturn, which is good because it looks like I will be driving it for a very long time. I wonder if the resale values will ever level off?


Unfortunately, Saturns have always had rather poor resale value and GM's recent antics and the uncertainty around Saturn's future seems to have only made things worse. Imagine my surprise when my wife asked a local dealer about trading in her 3 year old VUE on a new vehicle. They offered her approximately 25% of what we paid for it 3 years ago and it only has 35k miles on it. No major complaints with it, but if you're one of those folks that flips rides every few years you'll get eaten alive by the depreciation on a Saturn. The Honda drivetrain has been a joy to own and I wouldn't have even considered buying the vehicle if it had a GM V6 in it.

the 'original' saturns (read: plastic S series) had great resale value, actually. once they lost their focus, it all looks the same, and people don't see an advantage to a saturn anymore. the 1st gen VUE is a great car, easy to work on and parts are cheap; well, the ecotec engine 5 speed ones ones are. I wouldn't be caught dead w/ a honda-engined one, esp when the trans goes out or I have to replace the timing belt.
 
Originally Posted By: mpvue
Originally Posted By: Familyguy
Originally Posted By: Lucky
I purchased a 2008 Saturn Aura XR last year. I was recently considering a 2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe and I was shocked at the resale value offered for my extremely clean, low mile Aura XR. I like the car and it drives very well. I bought it because I was considering a Saab 9-3 and the cars have several similarities and the Saturn had a better motor. I originally wanted a GTI, but my wife wanted me to get a 4 door sedan. I have no complaints about the Saturn, which is good because it looks like I will be driving it for a very long time. I wonder if the resale values will ever level off?


Unfortunately, Saturns have always had rather poor resale value and GM's recent antics and the uncertainty around Saturn's future seems to have only made things worse. Imagine my surprise when my wife asked a local dealer about trading in her 3 year old VUE on a new vehicle. They offered her approximately 25% of what we paid for it 3 years ago and it only has 35k miles on it. No major complaints with it, but if you're one of those folks that flips rides every few years you'll get eaten alive by the depreciation on a Saturn. The Honda drivetrain has been a joy to own and I wouldn't have even considered buying the vehicle if it had a GM V6 in it.

the 'original' saturns (read: plastic S series) had great resale value, actually. once they lost their focus, it all looks the same, and people don't see an advantage to a saturn anymore. the 1st gen VUE is a great car, easy to work on and parts are cheap; well, the ecotec engine 5 speed ones ones are. I wouldn't be caught dead w/ a honda-engined one, esp when the trans goes out or I have to replace the timing belt.


I've owned a few Saturns (including a few SL "plastic" ones). I've also owned 2 VUEs with the Honda drivetrain. And I changed the timing belt on one of them. It wasn't a big deal. Apparently, a lot of people "wouldn't be caught dead" in Saturns which is why the resale value is what it is. Oh well.

I'm unsure why you need to dump on the Honda drivetrain in the vehicle. I'm unaware of ANY issues at all with it other than a recall from VERY early on that involved the trans ingesting water from a poorly located (by Saturn) vent tube. Check any Saturn forum and you'll see scant few complaints about it. You'll see plenty of complaints about the 3.0L they imported from Opel/Vauxhall and a number of outright blown engines from early 3.6L GM engines in the 2008 redesign. Also, I really pity the folks who bought 1st generation Equinox or Torrents with the GM 3.4L V6 imported from China. I suppose you'd rather us VUE owners got stuck with those? Ugh...

People seem to like the ecotec 4-banger, though it is really underpowered for a 3800lb SUV. It's a bit more bearable if you've got a manual transmission and can keep it within its usable powerband. With an automatic (4sp...yech), it's a serious pig in the VUE.

To each his own.
 
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I rented a Vue for a week a couple of weeks ago and was very impressed with the car. I was particularly impressed with the engine, both the performance and the engine layout. It had nice power, decent fuel economy, and a very tidy and thoughtful engine bay layout for all the wires/hoses/etc. The interior layout and fit/finish was also pretty good. Can't speak to the long term reliability issues, but it was a nice drive for the week.
 
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Originally Posted By: mpvue
the 'original' saturns (read: plastic S series) had great resale value, actually.


Yeah, actually up until sometime in the early 2000's, they were sometimes kind of expensive compared to other low mileage used compacts, save for mabye the Civic.
 
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