The Ford 500 CVT didn't fall apart.....

[WMSmotorhead]

I did a filter/pan service on it, and a 5Qt refill with....
Amalie CVT Fluid

I can't tell any real difference in the performance of the transmission... and it didn't fall apart...

Nobody on the Ford car boards had the guts to use anything but OEM... so I guess I'm the guinea pig.

The Amalie page actually listed my Ford's transmission as one that's been tested with it.

 

[JOD]

Thanks for posting the follow-up! Yes, I'm too afraid to try something else. I found some of the Motorcraft stuff pretty cheap and I still have 12 quarts left, so I'll be on that for a while. After that, if yours is still working I'll give it a try!

How many miles on your 500? Also, I'm curious is you've changed the AWD fluids (if yours is AWD)?

 

[MolaKule]

Originally Posted By: WMSmotorhead
I did a filter/pan service on it, and a 5Qt refill with....
Amalie CVT Fluid

I can't tell any real difference in the performance of the transmission... and it didn't fall apart...

Nobody on the Ford car boards had the guts to use anything but OEM... so I guess I'm the guinea pig.

The Amalie page actually listed my Ford's transmission as one that's been tested with it.


It didn't say they tested it, they said:

Quote:
PERFORMANCE APPLICATION CHART
*The chart below lists suitable for use applications


Do another drain and fill with the Amalie to get more Amalie in there and let us know how it shifts.

I suspect they are using one of those wide spectrum CVT PI packages.

 

[WMSmotorhead]

It IS the AWD... It's at about 70K miles... and had the original fill... 8 years old.... Time for a refresher.

The 500 is a garage baby and comes out for the long drives or date night. The daily driver is an old Focus hatchback.

I discussed it with my parts supplier... they supply lots of the regional repair joints. Apparently they've been selling a fair amount of it, and they've yet to get a bad report. My only complaint is that it STINKS.

I had it on the shelf for a few months... since I didn't have time to get around to the job.. I had my friend take care of it for me whilst I checked on him. He did a fine job. The filter was another adventure... got an ATP brand kit for it.

 

[WMSmotorhead]

I know it's just a bunch of sales chatter but.....

Quote:
This new CVT fluid is engineered to offer the highest level of protection against metal-to-metal wear. Actual side-by-side tests prove that Amalie’s new fluid technology out performs OEM CVT fluids and allows Amalie to claim better protection against scuffing than many of these OEM fluids. Better anti-shudder performance and better anti-scuffing performance lead to longer life for transmissions, and quieter, more vibration free operation.


I'm yet to have Any Amalie or WH product fail to perform... Granted it was Motor oil and Transmission fluid for a GEAR transmission... but still... I'm not really worried.

I've been using SuperS (Smitty's) Synthetic gear lubes with good success too... I have always took the word of the Parts store (Federated, Avon OH)...... I've yet to get anything out of their store that I thought was junk.

Odds are, the stuff in the OEM bottles could very well be made in the same plants as the aftermarket stuff. I bet that there's a number of folks on these boards that PREFER certain aftermarket lubes over OEM's... and it's not just the Amsoil fans.

 

[nitehawk55]

Is it just 5 Qt for drain and refill ? Had the filter done on mine in the fall of 2012 by the Ford dealer where I bought it for a really good deal and thinking I would like to just do a drain and refill this fall having put about 50K km (30K miles) on it and do this each year .

Mine is an AWD and has near 150K km (95K miles) on it . I've been thinking the AWD fluids should be drained soon if not already . Had a local fellow who specialises in Volvo and their AWD systems say he does it for around $400 . Why the cost ? Also , he says a lot of transmission issues are caused by the AWD controller unit and he has serviced a number of these cars where the Ford dealerships did not know how to . Anyone heard of this ?

I got this car last Oct 2012 and have to say I really like it . The CVT took some getting used to and I try and drive it with an awareness so I'm not pushing it too hard on acceleration and I use the cruise when I can for best MPG's . It runs around 1600 RPM at 100kmh (60mph) and gives pretty decent fuel economy for a full size car .

 

[bdcardinal]

The proper fluid for the AWD components can get expensive. There is the angle gear, EDM, and rear diff. Plus those parts only have fill plugs, so you have to extract the fluid. I can say that as long as I have been at the dealer, no-one has ever asked for this to be done.

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Is it just 5 Qt for drain and refill ? Had the filter done on mine in the fall of 2012 by the Ford dealer where I bought it for a really good deal and thinking I would like to just do a drain and refill this fall having put about 50K km (30K miles) on it and do this each year .


I typically get out about 6 qts, but I'd have 7 on-hand just in case.


Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Mine is an AWD and has near 150K km (95K miles) on it . I've been thinking the AWD fluids should be drained soon if not already . Had a local fellow who specialises in Volvo and their AWD systems say he does it for around $400 . Why the cost ? Also , he says a lot of transmission issues are caused by the AWD controller unit and he has serviced a number of these cars where the Ford dealerships did not know how to . Anyone heard of this ?


It's hard to find anyone to do it, so the price isn't surprising. If it includes front PTU, rear diff, Hadlex fluid and filter, then it's not horrible. Of course, you could DIY for under $100.00. Your choice. DEM problems on these cars are actually pretty rare. They're more common on Volvos since the controller is directly under the exhaust on that car, and the heat can affect the solder joints. The most common problem is pump failure of the Haldex unit or a failed pressure switch, both of which typically stem from sludge-filled fluid.

If you want to DIY, you have to suck out the fluids w/a vacuum pump, then refill. There's a tutorial on the Freestyle forum with some pictures if you go that route. I posted pics of my diff fluid and Haldex filter @ 90K. It wasn't pretty. I'd definitely recommend changing all of the AWD fluids and that Haldex filter ASAP before you're in for an expensive repair. 150K seems to be the max people get before having trouble.

 

[WMSmotorhead]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Is it just 5 Qt for drain and refill ?


That's all mine needed based on the mini-dipstick. The Car's onboard system shows no transmission issue... it did of course before we refilled it.

I am going to follow up with the fluid for the X-fer case and rear... is there a good trick to that, I didn't see a drain or fill plug on the X-Fer

 

[bdcardinal]

Originally Posted By: WMSmotorhead
I am going to follow up with the fluid for the X-fer case and rear... is there a good trick to that, I didn't see a drain or fill plug on the X-Fer


No trick, just a PITA. There are fill plugs only on the angle gear, Haldex and rear end.

 

[nitehawk55]

Thanks JOD .

What is the Haldex filter ? and is that the unit at the rear of the car ?
I had the high pressure filter in the transmission replaced when they serviced it .

 

[bdcardinal]

Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Thanks JOD .

What is the Haldex filter ? and is that the unit at the rear of the car ?
I had the high pressure filter in the transmission replaced when they serviced it .


There is a filter on the Haldex/Electronic Differential Module. Its a little paper one, I have one kicking around for my R car somewhere.

 

[JOD]

Ed, you really need to change that filter! I could be wrong, but on your car the driveshaft may have to come down to get to it. On the 500/Freestyle it's pretty accessible.

Here's the filter cap on my original filter @ 90K:

And here's the new filter:

Nitehawk, the filter part number is Volvo PN# 30787687. That includes a new top cap, o-ring, spring and bolts. I don't know if there's a Ford equivalent-bdcardinal will know. The filter from Volvo is $20.00 or so online. It's easy to remove; 2 4mm allen bolts hold the filter cap in place. Remove those and pop out the filter. Installation is the opposite of removal... The filter location is in the upper left in this photo. The bottom part sticking out is the Haldex pump. Above that, recessed to the upper left is the cover for the Haldex filter. The new cap is a bit different than the old cap (rusty car not mine!):

For the Haldex fluid, there's no substitute, either Volvo's Haldex fluid or Motorcraft XL-13. You'll need at least 300ml on-hand.

For the front PTU and rear differential, you just need a GL-5 rated fluid. The PTU has an additional "low foaming" spec, BOT-1 or something. I've been using M1 synthetic 75W90 front and rear for the last 60K miles and all's well. As mentioned, there are only fill plugs so you need to pull it out with a vacuum pump. The Haldex and rear diff bolts are right next to each other, Haldex towards the front of the car, rear diff towards the back. Here's a bad picture where I'm pointing to the bolts:

http://i56.tinypic.com/2cpt3rm.jpg

The front PTU/bevel gear is best accessed from the front. Here's the bolt (picture taken from behind the unit):

http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/9185/ptufrontsidedrain.jpg

One note: draining the Haldex and rear diff fluid require a bit of patience, but you can extract most of the fluid pretty easily. The front PTU is more difficult and requires a lot of playing around w/the tube. Use vinyl, not rubber, so you don't cut it on a gear and get it stuck in there. I did 3 drain/fills getting out 8-12 oz each time. Total capacity is roughly 30oz.

 

[nitehawk55]

Great Info JOD , thanks a lot .

I should likely be looking at doing the wifes' Fusion AWD too although it's a different system .

 

[bdcardinal]

No Ford number for that filter.

And I know I need to do mine, it is sitting next to my computer right now.

 

[WMSmotorhead]

??? All this talk of Haladex talk is interesting. I swear the owner's book on the 2005 Ford 500 just called for Ordinary gear lube on the back end.... I will look into it.

http://www.motorcraftservice.com/pubs/content/~WO5500/~MUS~LEN/34/05500og3e.pdf

Page 247......

Ok... the rear end is Gear lube... the PTU (aka transfer case) is gear lube.... and then we have the "Coupler"... that's the magic sauce and filter?

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: WMSmotorhead
??? All this talk of Haladex talk is interesting. I swear the owner's book on the 2005 Ford 500 just called for Ordinary gear lube on the back end.... I will look into it.


There's a front transfer case (PTU), a rear differential, then a electronic-controlled wet clutch unit (Haldex III) in the middle. The Haldex unit is actually bolted to the rear diff, so they look like one unit--but you can see the seam. The controller is back there and it operates a fluid-controlled pump, which operates the wet clutch. That fluid ends up being where things go bad.

 

[WMSmotorhead]

Ok, Groovy. Glad to know about it before it went neglected for a long time.

Some of the more unique aspects of this car can be a headache.

Is there an online source for the Fluid/filter kit?

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: WMSmotorhead
Ok, Groovy. Glad to know about it before it went neglected for a long time.

Some of the more unique aspects of this car can be a headache.

Is there an online source for the Fluid/filter kit?


I think I got both from Tascaparts.com last time I ordered. Part numbers are as follows:

Haldex filter kit: # 30787687
Haldex fluid # 31325136

M1 75W90 syn gear oil works fine in the front and rear units, Amsoil's SVG looks like it would also work well. The little bit of added maintenance is a pain but the system is pretty robust if maintained, and seems to work pretty well. I like the fact that it's not sensitive to tire size, so you don't need to be obsessive about tire rotations.

 

[WMSmotorhead]

Thank you very much. Even the Ford dealer was unfamiliar with the Haldex filter... (SERIOUSLY!!?)

However, they did confirm the model Haldex unit, and knew of the fluid for it... just not the filter. I've found a few online sources for it... mostly places that specialize in Volvo stuff.

I really like my Ford dealer, but I'm guessing that Ford didn't make a huge effort to inform the mechanics about the maintenance for it.

I'm always pleased that Internet communities for vehicle owners have collectively built such a network of know-how.

Once again, the Savvy owner has a one-up on the "professionals".