the better deal on Craftsman tool kits

[mjoekingz28]

I was thumbing through a catalog and found a tool kit that covers all the socket sizes through a wide range. I like it alot and its all 6pt, but I read the reviews and they said the box is junk. The box isnt warranted they say and a good box is important to me.

http://www.craftsman.com/shc/s/p_10155_1...rop17=009-34142


Or this one. It is priced better and they say that with this box you can shake it and drop it and it begs for more. They say its quite strong and well made, but, half the sockets are in 12pt and it has a more narrow range.

http://www.craftsman.com/shc/s/p_10155_1...mp;blockType=L2


Under the overview paragraph you can click on a red sentence to see the complete list of tools.

 

[meangreen01]

Top, more expensive one is practically all sockets with a handful of wrenches thrown in. It looks like a pretty complete set of sockets and its nice that they're "easy to read". I've really thought about upgrading to those even though it might seem to be an unnecessary frill, it makes them much easier to pick out and keep organized. I have a standard set of Craftsman sockets that are about 15 yrs old and are getting kinda beat up, and that makes 'em even harder to read.

Bottom, cheaper set, is more well-rounded but doesn't include some of the larger sized sockets that are more expensive to buy a-la-carte. Not ETR.

So, it depends on what you want. Need a pretty complete socket set? Get the more expensive one.

Need nut drivers, allen wrenches, etc., along with a more basic socket set? Get the cheaper one.

IMO I wouldn't care that much about the case. I'd just buy a decent tool chest at HF or something.

 

[Vikas]

I purchased a set similar to the bottom one (Item#: 00937154000 154 pc. Mechanics Tool Set)but I only paid around $50 after coupon during Fathers Day sale. Personally, I would have liked to get the set with the laser etching and my advice is to buy the set with 6-pt laser etched "easy to read" sockets if you can get them for similar price.

- Vikas

 

[scurvy]

I bought the top set not long ago. The case is fine for keeping everything separated and organized and it does have an excellent assortment of tools & sockets. IMO the wide range of tools, six point sockets/wrenches and easy carrying case made it a good buy... but it was an astounding value when I got it for $60 (several discounts & coupon codes converging, nice!).

Any blow-molded case isn't going to be great, but that one is pretty decent. And never use 12-point sockets or wrenches on a 6-point fastener... 12 point tools should only be used on 12 point fasteners.

 

[bepperb]

" And never use 12-point sockets or wrenches on a 6-point fastener... 12 point tools should only be used on 12 point fasteners."

That's new. I guess I like six point sockets better, but the 1/2 inch drive in either of those sets were six point. Really, I'd prefer 12 point wrenches, since the very fact I'm using a wrench probably means it's a difficult to access part. If you get an impact wrench that will come with a better selection of deep 1/2" sockets as well, if you're worried about the limitations of the cheaper set.

I'd buy the first one, but I don't drive my tools all around they stay in a wheeled box in my garage. Er... I mean a safe in my basement.

 

[tom slick]

Originally Posted By: scurvy
... And never use 12-point sockets or wrenches on a 6-point fastener... 12 point tools should only be used on 12 point fasteners.


I never got the memo on that one, and neither did my 12 point wrenches.

 

[scurvy]

It's a best practice. Your tools won't know the difference, but you will when a 12 point socket rounds off a six point nut into a zero point circle.

99% of the time you can get away with it, but that last 1% will make you into a believer. And when you're using a 4' torque wrench to tighten the flywheel bolts on an industrial press to 900 ft-lbs, you use sockets that match the fasteners.

 

[bepperb]

The garagejournal forum has a few 6 vs 12 point threads, they're kinda like BITOG for tools. And the threads were just like something here. People who have never owned 12 point sockets but know they suck, people who only own 12 point sockets for 85 years and have never had a problem. People wondering why, if 12 pointers are ok, there are very few 12 point impact sockets. People pointing out that most 3/4 inch drive sockets are 12 point and obviously built to handle higher amounts of torque than 1/2" impact sockets...

It just never ended. And there were several.

I guess I'll stick with 6point sockets and 12 point wrenches and see how far I get. Agreed 6points are probably "best practice" especially in sockets, but then again there have been a lot of times when I can only get a tooth or two per turn with a 12 point wrench which is why I like them.

 

[Kestas]

Originally Posted By: tom slick
Originally Posted By: scurvy
... And never use 12-point sockets or wrenches on a 6-point fastener... 12 point tools should only be used on 12 point fasteners.

I never got the memo on that one, and neither did my 12 point wrenches.

Tom, I went back and reread your post. Just as I thought, the statement was made by someone in California.

I didn't get the memo either. I learned on my own a long time ago that I had to set aside the 12-pt sockets and get myself some good 6-pt sockets. Dealing exclusively with cars that rust, my 12-pt sockets would round hex heads. You don't run into that problem. The fasteners I have to deal with under the car are effectively welded together by rust. PB Blaster and Kroil will only take you so far. 6-pt sockets will often turn a nut that is rounded by 12-pt sockets.

For those cases where you only get a bit of turn with your breaker bar, I remove the 6-pt socket and remount it 90° on the square drive for best fit.

 

[Herz]

12 point is a perfect way to round off bolt heads in older cars.

 

[scurvy]

Originally Posted By: tom slick
I never got the memo on that one, and neither did my 12 point wrenches.

It isn't a written memo, it's called 'paying attention'.

Do some work besides snugging a bolt on something older than you on occasion and you'll find out or die trying.

Stupid hurts and using a 12 point tool on a 6 point fastener is stupid. I've seen people get hurt when they used the wrong tool for the job, more than once it was from using an adjustable wrench, 12-point socket or wrench on a 6-point fastener, hex bit not fully seated, using torx/torx plus/hex bit on the wrong bolt, etc...

If all you want is 'good enough' then I'll issue you a Jeremy Clarkson toolkit that contains only a flat screwdriver, a hammer and adjustable wrench.

 

[tom slick]

Guys, notice I wrote WRENCHES, not sockets. Using a 6 point wrench in an area with limited clearance/movement is worthless. If it's a tough nut to crack then a 6 point SOCKET is the way to go.

A blanket statement of "never use XXX on an YYY" is ridiculous. Tools are to be used in whatever fashion to get the work done. "Rules" on tool usage need to be used with common sense, none are absolute.


BTW how common 12 point fasteners are used outside of aerospace? Then how come the majority of WRENCHES from all manufacturers are 12 point?

 

[bepperb]

"I've seen people get hurt when they used the wrong tool for the job, more than once it was from using an adjustable wrench"

I relived a few great memories reading that one, thankfully not all involved myself.

 

[Kestas]

Originally Posted By: tom slick
BTW how common 12 point fasteners are used outside of aerospace? Then how come the majority of WRENCHES from all manufacturers are 12 point?

I imagine 12-pt wrenches are good for tight areas where less than a 1/6 turn is available. For REAL force, one should start with a 6-pt socket and breaker bar.

The only 12-pt fastener I've seen outside of aerospace are the U-joint fasteners for my old Crown Vic.

What is somewhat troubling are all the torx, allen head, and triple-square fasteners that are popping up here and there. There was a time (when Model Ts were made) where all the fasteners on an automobile could be worked on with the modest tool set that came with the car. I've seen an Apollo capsule in a museum, and that appears easier to work on than your average automobile.

 

[scurvy]

Originally Posted By: tom slick
BTW how common 12 point fasteners are used outside of aerospace? Then how come the majority of WRENCHES from all manufacturers are 12 point?


Plenty of external 12 point fasteners in machinery & automobiles. I've come across many and I haven't had to look too hard.

The majority of wrenches from all manufacturers are 12 point because for the majority of their buyers will never use them anywhere near their limits (or on old, corroded, partially rounded off fasteners) where a 6 point wrench would clearly be better, and they're perceived as being a better value as a 12 point wrench will turn ideal 6 & 12 point fasteners.

By your logic, all wrench makers will be going to spline profiles as you can do 4, 6, 8, 12 & spline fasteners with them... but you're VERY likely to round off everything but the latter.

Originally Posted By: tom slick
A blanket statement of "never use XXX on an YYY" is ridiculous.

As is stating that 12 point tools are always OK to use on 6 point fasteners.

That street runs both ways, buddy.

I've never come across a 6 point fastener that couldn't be undone with a 6 point wrench but could with a 12 point wrench. The only place I can think of is a mounting bracket fastener for a vacuum line on VE-engined TDIs that needs a deep offset wrench. There are coolant glowplugs in the way of getting a socket in there & I don't have a deep offset 6 point wrench for comparison... it may be doable with a 6 point socket & u-joint.

 

[Jim 5]

Originally Posted By: Kestas
Originally Posted By: tom slick
BTW how common 12 point fasteners are used outside of aerospace? Then how come the majority of WRENCHES from all manufacturers are 12 point?

I imagine 12-pt wrenches are good for tight areas where less than a 1/6 turn is available. For REAL force, one should start with a 6-pt socket and breaker bar.

The only 12-pt fastener I've seen outside of aerospace are the U-joint fasteners for my old Crown Vic.

What is somewhat troubling are all the torx, allen head, and triple-square fasteners that are popping up here and there. There was a time (when Model Ts were made) where all the fasteners on an automobile could be worked on with the modest tool set that came with the car. I've seen an Apollo capsule in a museum, and that appears easier to work on than your average automobile.


I'll agree they are rare. I've seen them somewhere else and can't remember where...maybe it was the ARP main-bearing cap bolts I installed in my early bronco's 302 during the rebuild. Its U-joint were grade-5 6-points, but I recall that the bolt that clamps the u-joint in the steering column to the steering shaft was a 12 point. That was the only 12 point fastener on the entire vehicle as I recall.

 

[lipadj46]

I have 12 point fasteners all over my land rover. 6 points will work on most of them but certain sizes you need 12 point sockets.

And to the OP those ratchets in both those sets are [censored]. Save your money for the 360 (over whatever the exact #) piece set that comes with the thin profile fine tooth ratchets. The cheap craftsman ratchets break surprisingly easy both the plastic pieces and the gear. I believe the combo wrenches in those sets have 6 point closed ends which kind of stinks.

 

[Papa Bear]

12 point sockets turn metric fasteners into SAE (and visa versa)...

 

[mjoekingz28]

Got the 145. Too bad I couldn't get it for $60 like was mentioned. Looks like a good set. The only metric size it skips is 16mm in the 1/2" drive, yet it has from 9mm on up. Who needs a 9mm 1/2 drive, not me its too dangerous. Other than that it appears to be one of the more complete kits Sears sells.

Just have to watch that case. If the tang does break, then I can prolly drill a hole and use a zip tie on it. If that happens it would be nice if they made a retractable zip tie and not have to cut it each time.