Tesla is about to explode?

[OVERKILL]

See PGE's breakdown.

See how infrastructure is covered in multiple places. now we pay WILDFIRE fees on top of the fee for distribution.

So the client get 3 bills now for the maintenance service which then gets spent as executive bonuses.



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Your distribution charge is more in-line with what I am expecting. Jeff isn't getting charged that, nor are the other net metering customers I suspect, that's the issue. Either it is getting wiped out by the "net" part or there are other shenanigans in play.

Is your distribution fee fully variable, tied to consumption, or does it have a base rate component like ours?

 

[JeffKeryk]

Quoting you from another thread:


As I mentioned, that's not sufficient to cover the "poles and wires" cost to keep you connected, that's why they are looking to bump up that fee.

You can't have it both ways. You can't brag that you are paying $9/month (sometimes less) and then complain that PG&E is trying to recoup $60 to cover the poles and wires cost on the number of kWh you shuffled to and from the grid, that's a real cost for them, as a grid operator, regardless of your opinion on their profitability. Calling it a subsidy (assuming net metering and not a FIT arrangement) is incorrect, but it's definitely a legitimate charge, transformers, transmission lines, linesmen, line trucks, these things aren't free and people with $9 hydro bills are not contributing their fair share toward that cost, particularly considering they are using the transmission in a bidirectional manner.

Here's an Ontario bill. You can see our transmission costs are clearly broken out, separately, as Delivery, and that has a base rate component as well as a variable that increases based on the number of kWh consumed.

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Full disclosure, I rarely read my PG&E bill, and I am sure I do not fully understand it. I believe my bill is low is because our net usage is in PG&E's favor. December was not so good for me, as winter is here and wifey's Christmas lights contribute to usage.

You can make the case I am subsidizing PG&E. Local solar reduces the need to build more poles and wires to transport electrons from distant power plants. In fact, rooftop solar has enabled CA to scale back numerous power line projects, saving billions.
By the way, these projects are highly profitable for PG&E...
Raising solar costs will only discourage future solar projects, in a state that wants to reduce pollution.

I strongly suggest this is simply a revenue scheme for PG&E and other power companies. I understand that the 1M solar projects in the state have reduced revenue. But profits are another thing. The problem is the PG&E monopoly.
Do I have all the data and all the answers? Heck no. Do I trust PG&E as far as I can throw them? Heck no.

 

[OVERKILL]

Full disclosure, I rarely read my PG&E bill, and I am sure I do not fully understand it. I believe my bill is low is because our net usage is in PG&E's favor. December was not so good for me, as winter is here and wifey's Christmas lights contribute.
View attachment 84509

Do you have something with more detail, like what Dave posted? Looks like you made money in April and June and that's because your export kWh are valued at the same as the ones you buy (that's how net metering works). In the future (not for you, as I expect you are on contract) this is likely to change.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Do you have something with more detail, like what Dave posted? Looks like you made money in April and June and that's because your export kWh are valued at the same as the ones you buy (that's how net metering works). In the future (not for you, as I expect you are on contract) this is likely to change.

I tried to send you the bill but cannot start a conversation.
Appreciate you @OVERKILL

 

[OVERKILL]

I tried to send you the bill but cannot start a conversation.
Appreciate you @OVERKILL

Just followed you, you should be able to now.

 

[Owen Lucas]

There is a use charge. The only way to get around it is to go off the grid with a battery. Additional charges will only push people away from the grid, especially over time.

With our high energy costs, the $50 (or whatever) will extend the breakeven point. But the cost of solar continues to drop while PG&E rates only increase. I love my solar project.
The losers will continue to be the poor who cannot do much about the PG&E monopoly.

If you were to get off the grid completely, have the line disconnected from your house (if they would even entertain that), I've heard you will still get a bill for upkeep or something. Not sure if this was CA or another state but there might be no way out unless you build a cabin in a forest or something.

 

[UncleDave]

I COMPLETELY get the beefs about PG&E/Enron, absolutely I do, but in terms of the legitimacy of a transmission/distribution charge, they are in the right on that, regardless of how much of a total gong show the rest of the business is.

My bill is ~1,100kWh shown there.

I see - You have to total the tiers yourself vs a summation they provide.

I get 1186. You have much cheaper juice than we do. (as do most)

 

[JeffKeryk]

If you were to get off the grid completely, have the line disconnected from your house (if they would even entertain that), I've heard you will still get a bill for upkeep or something. Not sure if this was CA or another state but there might be no way out unless you build a cabin in a forest or something.

My understanding is, there is no connection to the power lines. Please take that with a huge grain of salt.

 

[OVERKILL]

I see - You have to total the tiers yourself vs a summation they provide.

I get 1186. You have much cheaper juice than we do. (as do most)

Summation was on the previous page that I didn't include

Yes, we have less expensive power than Cali for sure.

 

[Wolf359]

If you were to get off the grid completely, have the line disconnected from your house (if they would even entertain that), I've heard you will still get a bill for upkeep or something. Not sure if this was CA or another state but there might be no way out unless you build a cabin in a forest or something.

Never really heard of that. I don't think they can really do that. All you do is tell them you're moving out of state and you want the power shut off.

Here if you shut off the gas or electric for more than a year, they require that a gas or electrical inspector sign off on a permit that say it's fine to turn back on. The electric company owns the electric meter too so I suppose they could remove the meter at some point and charge extra to have it installed when whoever turns on the power if it ever gets turn on again.

 

[UncleDave]

If you were to get off the grid completely, have the line disconnected from your house (if they would even entertain that), I've heard you will still get a bill for upkeep or something. Not sure if this was CA or another state but there might be no way out unless you build a cabin in a forest or something.

Never really heard of that. I don't think they can really do that. All you do is tell them you're moving out of state and you want the power shut off.

Here if you shut off the gas or electric for more than a year, they require that a gas or electrical inspector sign off on a permit that say it's fine to turn back on. The electric company owns the electric meter too so I suppose they could remove the meter at some point and charge extra to have it installed when whoever turns on the power if it ever gets turn on again.

Yeah I dont think so either - plenty of remote cabins here with no bill.