Tesla is about to explode?

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

Shanghai sold almost 71K cars in Dec. That allows for about 850K per year.
They are hiring 25% more employees and their latest expansion is due to be complete in Q2.
Is 1M cars in 2022 doable in China?

Austin is coming online any day. Apparently the employee parking lot is full... Berlin is close behind. Fremont continues to expand.

They have got some competition and they are not the only company building here and selling to the China/Korea markets... that is all I will say.

Give it about a year for models that can actually compete on the electric car playing field with Tesla to materialize and be built.

Tesla Austin plant, well they made the right move by getting out of California. Now let's see if they become the next GM..

 

[UncleDave]

Its already cheaper to run gas than use commercial charging.

This is not a universally true statement.

In the case of some of the chains like EA and chargepoint its likely true.

In the case of the tesla network it's likely not true by a solid margin.

 

[JeffKeryk]

They have got some competition and they are not the only company building here and selling to the China/Korea markets... that is all I will say.

Give it about a year for models that can actually compete on the electric car playing field with Tesla to materialize and be built.

Tesla Austin plant, well they made the right move by getting out of California. Now let's see if they become the next GM..

The "wait for the big guys to get in" arguement...
Rather than leaving, Tesla is expanding in CA. There are over 10,000 workers in Fremont and the tech unit is in Palo Alto.
Giga Austin, Berlin and Shanghai are more expansion.

 

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

The "wait for the big guys to get in" arguement...
Rather than leaving, Tesla is expanding in CA. There are over 10,000 workers in Fremont and the tech unit is in Palo Alto.
Giga Austin, Berlin and Shanghai are more expansion.

I'm just saying, sir.. don't think Tesla single-handedly has this market on lockdown anymore.

I'll admit, they have come a long way, but they are not going to be the only game in town.

This, I assure you.

I am not telling you to not go out and buy a Tesla but do you really think they are the only ones moving to an all-electric SUV as the next most awesome thing....

 

[JeffKeryk]

I'm just saying, sir.. don't think Tesla single-handedly has this market on lockdown anymore.

I'll admit, they have come a long way, but they are not going to be the only game in town.

This, I assure you.

I am not telling you to not go out and buy a Tesla but do you really think they are the only ones moving to an all-electric SUV as the next most awesome thing....

Agreed. Every major car maker is building EVs or even going all electric; this is a good thing for the consumer as competition tends to make the product better.
I am not sure Tesla was ever the only game in town. The Volt/Bolt and Nissan Leaf have been around for longer, I believe.
I bought a Model 3 in Dec 2018 and might buy a Model 3 Performance in a year, if and when things settle down.

 

[Slow Car Sport Mode]

Agreed. Every major car maker is building EVs or even going all electric; this is a good thing for the consumer as competition tends to make the product better.
I am not sure Tesla was ever the only game in town. The Volt/Bolt and Nissan Leaf have been around for longer, I believe.
I bought a Model 3 in Dec 2018 and might buy a Model 3 Performance in a year, if and when things settle down.

Yeah but were people clamoring for a Bolt/Volt or Leaf..

I want to say a LOT more but. Its confidential.

 

[Kjmack]

Average electric bill for December for apartment in Sweden was 600 euros!!! Yes, six hundred! Some houses were slapped with 2,000 euros electric bill.
Europe is going through energy crisis that might become biggest since WWII. And it is all about electricity and gas.
So, while there is this push for EV, expect brakes to be engaged very soon and diesel might become popular again.

Thanks for posting that info . That is nothing other than criminal . With a gluttony of natural resources that this world has to offer and other sources such a nuclear , it's sickening that people have to suffer like that .

 

[edyvw]

Thanks for posting that info . That is nothing other than criminal . With a gluttony of natural resources that this world has to offer and other sources such a nuclear , it's sickening that people have to suffer like that .

It is bit more complicated than that. There is a push to get rid of coal completely there. I say more power to that. But, there is an irrational push to pretty much gut anything that is not wind or solar it seems. I am not sure how solar will work in most of Europe in winter.
These kinds of policies usually go through stages like this. Allout push, then reality kicks in, then adjustment comes.

 

[Kjmack]

I wonder what percentage of their bills for home energy is tax ?

 

[OVERKILL]

It is bit more complicated than that. There is a push to get rid of coal completely there. I say more power to that. But, there is an irrational push to pretty much gut anything that is not wind or solar it seems. I am not sure how solar will work in most of Europe in winter.
These kinds of policies usually go through stages like this. Allout push, then reality kicks in, then adjustment comes.

Yeah, that's been working swimming for Germany since they shuttered 3 nukes in December...

 

[Rand]

This is not a universally true statement.

In the case of some of the chains like EA and chargepoint its likely true.

In the case of the tesla network it's likely not true by a solid margin.

If I said the world was round it wouldnt be a universally true statement either.
Didnt supercharger recently double in price?

I was specifically talking prices nearby.. I'm sure if you went to some country that has kwh at .05 and 9$/gal gas it wouldnt be true either.

So please list specific facts about commercial charging that is available nearby to you that makes my statement false.

I was referencing these tesla supercharger prices with my earlier post.. and I know the others are even more expensive.

0-60 kW is $0.17 per minute, 60-100 kW is $0.45 per minute, and 100-180 kW costs $0.84 per minute. The highest level of 180-250 kW now costs $1.35 per minute

 

[edyvw]

I wonder what percentage of their bills for home energy is tax ?

Sweden has VAT and several rates. I think not more than average sales tax here.

 

[UncleDave]

If I said the world was round it wouldnt be a universally true statement either.
Didnt supercharger recently double in price?

I was specifically talking prices nearby.. I'm sure if you went to some country that has kwh at .05 and 9$/gal gas it wouldnt be true either.

So please list specific facts about commercial charging that is available nearby to you that makes my statement false.

I was referencing these tesla supercharger prices with my earlier post.. and I know the others are even more expensive.

"Doubled" from what to what though?

Give me 2 destinations, pick a car and we'll use 3rd party tools to compute the price to drive the same trip with each car and post it up here.

We'll do a supercharger price, and a 3rd party charger price. (non tesla car)

Then we'll compute it with your actual vehicle.

Cant get any fairer than that.

 

[edyvw]

Yeah, that's been working swimming for Germany since they shuttered 3 nukes in December...

View attachment 84273

Two months ago EU was pressing export countries to figure out how to shut off coal plants. Today they are pretty much saying: can you please burn more?
I personally think coal has to go. But these irrational policies against hydro and nuclear is ridiculous.

 

[PandaBear]

I'd buy a 15-20k one for second car with 150mile+ range wake me up when they are here.
Oh and how much will it cost to run them when electricity price doubles or triples.

Its already cheaper to run gas than use commercial charging.

Gas price is $4.30 / gal this morning. Charging without telling PG&E you have an EV is about 26-31c/kwh. Gas is more expensive now.

Gas will continue to be more expensive now that OPEC has finally bankrupted the horizontal drilling / fracking boom, until another boom happens this will be the case. Maybe natural gas is going to be expensive too but who knows. I'll place my bet on plug in hybrid until the dust settles.

 

[PandaBear]

The "wait for the big guys to get in" arguement...
Rather than leaving, Tesla is expanding in CA. There are over 10,000 workers in Fremont and the tech unit is in Palo Alto.
Giga Austin, Berlin and Shanghai are more expansion.

You would be stupid to build cars in Fremont in large volume, competing with tech workers working from home making 200k a year (because if you make $300-400k a year you probably wold move to Saratoga or Sunnyvale and if you make $500-1M a year you would live in Palo Alto).

R&D will keep Fremont going. Don't think they can move everyone out there to Texas (many would refuse to move if they already have homes and families here).

 

[DwightFrye]

Panda Bear, Uncle Dave, Jeff Keryk and other California residents, are you aware that there is currently a proposal moving through Sacramento that would add about $60 a month to anyone who has a solar electric system's monthly bill ? This is supposedly because those customers aren't paying "their fair share" towards maintaining the grid.

I suspect it really has to do with the lobbyists from the big electric companies here who see lost revenue to their monopolies and paid off the politicians. While there is something to be said for reducing pollution, the cost savings from having a solar system on your home that has reached the break even cost point and having an EV rather than paying $5.00 a gallon for gas are going to disappear once the politicians decide to add additional taxes on those citizens to make up for the loss. We already know that a large portion of our gas tax doesn't even go towards maintaining the roads as it is supposed to.

 

[JeffKeryk]

You would be stupid to build cars in Fremont in large volume, competing with tech workers working from home making 200k a year (because if you make $300-400k a year you probably wold move to Saratoga or Sunnyvale and if you make $500-1M a year you would live in Palo Alto).

R&D will keep Fremont going. Don't think they can move everyone out there to Texas (many would refuse to move if they already have homes and families here).

Fremont continues to expand. Not everyone can be a high tech worker. Many workers commute in; some sleep in their cars and others team up through the week in motels.

Fremont builds S/X and tons of 3/Y. They are slated for the Roadster 2. Fremont isn't going anywhere.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Panda Bear, Uncle Dave, Jeff Keryk and other California residents, are you aware that there is currently a proposal moving through Sacramento that would add about $60 a month to anyone who has a solar electric system's monthly bill ? This is supposedly because those customers aren't paying "their fair share" towards maintaining the grid.

I suspect it really has to do with the lobbyists from the big electric companies here who see lost revenue to their monopolies and paid off the politicians. While there is something to be said for reducing pollution, the cost savings from having a solar system on your home that has reached the break even cost point and having an EV rather than paying $5.00 a gallon for gas are going to disappear once the politicians decide to add additional taxes on those citizens to make up for the loss. We already know that a large portion of our gas tax doesn't even go towards maintaining the roads as it is supposed to.

I am aware of the push for an increased "on the grid" charge. If that happens, I will consider going battery. Maybe I can use the Model 3? Ha!

PG&E's revenue is down because of the number of solar installations, but they can still give their execs huge bonuses to burn down our forrests. The better idea, IMO, would be to end their energy monopoly.
I already pay them more due to the excess energy my panels send back to the grid.

 

[OVERKILL]

Panda Bear, Uncle Dave, Jeff Keryk and other California residents, are you aware that there is currently a proposal moving through Sacramento that would add about $60 a month to anyone who has a solar electric system's monthly bill ? This is supposedly because those customers aren't paying "their fair share" towards maintaining the grid.

I suspect it really has to do with the lobbyists from the big electric companies here who see lost revenue to their monopolies and paid off the politicians. While there is something to be said for reducing pollution, the cost savings from having a solar system on your home that has reached the break even cost point and having an EV rather than paying $5.00 a gallon for gas are going to disappear once the politicians decide to add additional taxes on those citizens to make up for the loss. We already know that a large portion of our gas tax doesn't even go towards maintaining the roads as it is supposed to.

There's some legitimacy to their claim actually.

Transmission upkeep is expensive, and if transmission costs are baked into the rate (they aren't here in Ontario, they are a separate charge called "Delivery") then by using net metering or a FIT scheme, you reduce income that is supposed to be directed toward that transmission maintenance.

Transmission neglect has been a HUGE issue in California (hence the fires caused by power lines).

If your solar system is connected to the grid, and you are using the consumer transmission network to buy/sell power, you should definitely be paying your fair share of maintaining that infrastructure, just like those that only buy do.

Of course if you are paying a delivery charge separately (which should be on kWh moved, not net kWh consumed) then an additional charge is just highway robbery.