Terry ?

[satterfi]

Those of you who demand Redline oils should give superior used oil analysis versus M1 are going to be out of luck. It doesn’t. M1 is pretty good oil. Redline is better in some performance areas and weaker in others.

Use in a motorcycle is good example. M1 falls flat in viscosity retention compared to RL. However, M1 is good enough so it doesn't matter.

I think the internet rumor that RL doesn't hold TBN well is BS and repeated by the uniformed.

I've used 20 Dexsil kits to compare TBN retention between RL and M1. They both maintain TBN longer than most people are willing to leave oil in an engine.

If you really need Terry to give you some sort of comfort level for your oil choice, then pay him a few bucks. I've done it.

 

[buster]

quote:

---

Those of you who demand Redline oils should give superior used oil analysis versus M1 are going to be out of luck. It doesn’t. M1 is pretty good oil. Redline is better in some performance areas and weaker in others

---

Agree, I think you summed it up pretty well. It's always a choice between the +'s/-'s when comparing oils. I'm interested in the idea that ester based oils compete heavily with the additive package possibly compromising wear. It's in the AN thread. Click Here

 

[sprintman]

Remember there are some awesome Redline used oil analysis here. For some reason we end to forget them. Tyrolkid's 5W40 ones always come to mind

 

[Bio-T]

I have a good analysis on my 00 Mazda using 5W30 Red Line. In fact I had a quart left over and it is now in my John Deere lawn mower and it loves it.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3&t=001662#000013

 

[buster]

Their are certainly some good used oil analysis with RL. RL has it's great qualities as well. I just don't think it's really proven itself as superior in many cases on here. The whole RL/ESTER/MOLY/AN/PAO discussion is really interesting IMO. Vetteman, that is a great UOA you have their.

 

[satterfi]

 

[crossbow]

Well since were all talking about redline 5w-20...

I happen to have a new 04 Mazda 6s (which we have about 20+ used oil analysis for) that I'm willing to run 5w-20 redline in.

My only question is when to start? Redline's site seems to indicate (the new site) that you should wait until at least 2000 miles. I've heard from others (and browsing some threads) that this number should be more around 5,000 to 10,000 miles.

Because of the super ultra #1 happy moly (tm) amount in redline, should one wait a bit longer then 3600 miles (when I was planning on putting it in) before running the 5w-20 redline?

I probably won't do a used oil analysis on the redline the first interval, but will on the second with a terry analysis...

Gotta admit terry, its a pretty big sign of your importance to the community and the forum when your name shows up as the thread title

.

 

[Pablo]

Terry - public thanks for going the extra mile. I realize you don't have to do these things, yet you remain a "full service" company!

I've come to the conclusion that ALL oil companies are PR driven, and yes I can understand why, frustrating though....

 

[Terry]

Pablo, thanks, I really try to help the "people" cut through the marketing.

I ain't done with Redline or Castrol for that matter. I'm trying to get some ASTM data from a lab that will compare ( hopefully ) Red Line 5w-20 to Mobil 1 0w-20 and data for the GC Castrol 0w-30. This data is not free and I am trying to figure out how to pay for it. It is blinded and independent testing.

Buster, my Red Line guys aren't the majority of the folks who post here( sadly) If you trust me at all , then believe this, Redline in really stressful applications does one heck of a job and blows away most OTC formulations. After seeing the response I got from Roy Howell and Dave Granquist you can see I have no economic, leta alone egotistical reason to say that.

Most oil companies hate me equally.


TD

 

[mracer]

quote:

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Originally posted by Terry:


As far as posting independent proprietary data on a name brand oil that, YES I do like, sure, SHOW ME THE MONEY !

I give what I can and what I can afford so if the hard data on Red Line 5w-20 is what you want, ante up.

---

First let me say this is nothing personal against Terry. I don't know Terry but he is probably a great guy.

I know I am jaded but that is just the way it is. The above business attitude just will not cut it for me. I DO NOT TRUST anyone who sells anything. Sorry but that's just a fact, a way of life for me. I have seen people being ripped off and screwed over too many times to ever believe anything anyone says about a product or service they have a vested interest in.

If I am to believe in anything, it must be supported by trustworthy hard data. ANYTHING less than that will be interpreted by me as an attempt to hide the truth. In other words, prove it to me or I will assume its all lies and subterfuge.

 

[AcuraSLX]

You might do a search under Acura SLX and find a pretty good UOA under very difficult conditions such as 4x4, desert, Moab etc. Terry didn't do this UOA so there should be no problem with skeptics.

 

[ekpolk]

quote:

---

Originally posted by mracer:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Terry:


As far as posting independent proprietary data on a name brand oil that, YES I do like, sure, SHOW ME THE MONEY !

I give what I can and what I can afford so if the hard data on Red Line 5w-20 is what you want, ante up.

---

First let me say this is nothing personal against Terry. I don't know Terry but he is probably a great guy.

I know I am jaded but that is just the way it is. The above business attitude just will not cut it for me. I DO NOT TRUST anyone who sells anything. Sorry but that's just a fact, a way of life for me. I have seen people being ripped off and screwed over too many times to ever believe anything anyone says about a product or service they have a vested interest in.

If I am to believe in anything, it must be supported by trustworthy hard data. ANYTHING less than that will be interpreted by me as an attempt to hide the truth. In other words, prove it to me or I will assume its all lies and subterfuge.

---

Well, I've dealt with Terry a couple times, and what he has told me has always seemed to match my own observed reality, and I've encountered other unrelated data which bolstered his conclusions. You absolutely can not beat the value of the service he provides to individual customers for the price. In addition, by your rather rigid standard, how could you ever be satisfied by any commercial information. The world runs on commerce, and applying your rule, you'd have to assume that everyone's lying about everything (BTW, read some of my earlier posts -- you'll see I'm no corporate toady). In truth, there are some honest people and some others out there. As a general rule, I personally prefer to presume honesty, and then I let people demonstrate otherwise if they're so inclined. Obviously, as the stakes increase, so must your level of caution. For heaven's sake, try two Blackstone/Dyson kits, and check the value for yourself. Even if you decide it's not for you, you're only out $50 total. And even if you don't repeat, you WILL see that both Blackstone and Terry provide you a great deal of info and insight, especially considering what they charge.

 

[buster]

quote:

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If you trust me at all , then believe this, Redline in really stressful applications does one heck of a job and blows away most OTC formulations

---

In racing conditions, I believe RL does excel at maintaining it's viscosity. What OTC oils are we talking about? Mobil 1, Castrol Syntec? Mobil 1 and Amsoil are about equal +/- a few for each. And are we talking wear, Pb or Fe, viscosity etc? I need to see more IMO of RL before I can say it "blows away" anything. I know it hasn't blown away Mobil 1 on here, thats for sure. Thats just my opinion.

Terry, you have to admit their has been some legitimate arguement against Redline/Esters/Moly that one should consider. used oil analysis we've seen so far, have not been impressive.

[ August 27, 2004, 04:41 PM: Message edited by: buster ]

 

[VaderSS]

This is hitting on an "experiment" I was considering...

I have a Ford Festiva with 227,500 miles on it, but the engine is pretty tight, with no oil consumption, little blow-by and having about the same power as new. I had considered running a 20 weight oil in it, to get the max economy possible out of it, but was concerned about running too thin of an oil in it. I think I might give Red Line 5W20 a try in it, based on Terry's comments. Be a couple of months before I conclude my present "experiment" with it though. Ahh, the pleasures of owning a ****box.

I'll be sending the current oil in to Terry for analysis, once I hit 5k on it.

 

[427Z06]

quote:

---

Originally posted by mracer:
I know I am jaded but that is just the way it is. The above business attitude just will not cut it for me. I DO NOT TRUST anyone who sells anything. Sorry but that's just a fact, a way of life for me. I have seen people being ripped off and screwed over too many times to ever believe anything anyone says about a product or service they have a vested interest in.

If I am to believe in anything, it must be supported by trustworthy hard data. ANYTHING less than that will be interpreted by me as an attempt to hide the truth. In other words, prove it to me or I will assume its all lies and subterfuge.

---

I believe you and I suffer from the same genetic defect.

 

[XS650]

quote:

---

Originally posted by mracer:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Terry:


As far as posting independent proprietary data on a name brand oil that, YES I do like, sure, SHOW ME THE MONEY !

I give what I can and what I can afford so if the hard data on Red Line 5w-20 is what you want, ante up.

---

........

I know I am jaded but that is just the way it is. The above business attitude just will not cut it for me. I DO NOT TRUST anyone who sells anything. Sorry but that's just a fact, a way of life for me. ........

---

I think one of us misunderstood what Terry was saying. I read Terry's post you quoted from. I read his post as saying -The Redline 0W-20 test he was running got hosed, so if someone wants him to run another one they need to contribute-.

Not an unreasonable position, particularly since he isn't working for Redline.

However, Terry's post was flippant, which may be part of the reason I like Terry

 

[Terry]

Buster the RL chemistry both theoretically,bench testing ,and field trials wise, performs very well under stress against any available over the counter oil formulations that YOU or I can afford. OF COURSE MATCH THE OIL WITH THE ENGINE TO OPTIMIZE THE APPLICATION.

mracer , I test for HIRE, in order to get the next job I'd better be straight with the customer who HIRES me or I DON'T get the next testing job. You may not have enough money or knowledge to be so jaded when it comes to oil analysis and chemistry. How do you know when you get value or honesty ? If its something you know little about you have to TRUST an expert and like ekpolk says watch and learn. I have given away much here on this site but many times it is unnoticed or overlooked because many don't have enough knowledge or insight to crasp the depth of what was shared.

How many of us understand chemistry or physics without help from Molakule or Rick 20 or other experts in their field that are PAID for their specialties ? Do you get paid to do something well ? Can you be trusted in your job only if you are not compensated ? I agree wholehartedly with the cynical look you may have because there are many quick buck scam people on the internet and in sales but on this site hopefully we debunk that so you can find "truth in lubrication" !

Whether you pay me $100+ a hour to consult( including travel and expenses) or $35 for a oil analysis kit ( which includes my analysis interpretation) I treat you the same in value for services rendered. According to many who know me well I give too much info away that I intellectually own.
If you hire me for proprietary analysis interpretation I give the best I can or tell you I don't know and can't help you,wasting none of your time or money.

 

[Ugly3]

Terry - Whether you pay me $100+ a hour to consult( including travel and expenses) or $35 for a oil analysis kit ( which includes my analysis interpretation) I treat you the same in value for services rendered. According to many who know me well I give too much info away that I intellectually own.

Well said.

I sincerly appreciate the information you share with us.

 

[novadude]

One more in Terry's defense:

I gotta say, for the price, you cannot beat the Dyson analysis package. I have received my analysis comments from Terry and proceded to ask several questions in follow-up e-mails, and every question was promptly answered in a concise manner.

That is what makes his service worthwhile, IMO, is that he WILL talk to you and answer any questions that you may have, and you can learn from him. For a few bucks over a standard Blackstone report, it is worth my money every time!

 

[9c1]

Amen Novadude
a different Terry