tankless water heater replacement . $$$$

C

CarLuver

Joined
Jul 14, 2020
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my cousin has an issue with her tankless water heater. had a company stop by and check it out. they said its the mother board, circ pump and a elbow. looked up the parts online, and it around $450 for them . They wanted $3k to replace them.

then other option would be a new replacement model. looked up cost and its around $2k. they wanted $7k for a R&R . all the piping is there already .

they did charge her a $100 service fee to check it out. seemed rather cheap to me. i think they may be using the car service model of cheap oil change and expensive repairs .
 
How many 50-65 year olds do you know that have told you their son/daughter is going to school to be a plumber or starting work at a Plumbing Contractor learning the trade?

How many people age 30-65 do you know that tackle their own home repair needs such as Plumbing and Electrical work? How many do you know that change their own oil?

How many service calls do you estimate the average residential plumbing and electrical contractor gets per day? How many do you think have to be scheduled 2-4 days down the road?
 
Lubener said:
A second opinion might be a good idea. The quote seems awful high to me.

That is the reason I will stay with my old fashioned tank heater. Any energy savings obtained with tankless is quickly lost when a repair is needed.
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We are looking at building a MIL suite addition. I have always leaned very hard to a standard 40/50 gal gas water heater with regular gravity vent, no electricity hooked to it. That's what I've had since 1996 in my own homes, too.

I am 90% certain I will put in another 40-gallon gas water heater for this addition. I contemplated a gas tankless. A co-worker used to be very high on the heat pump water heaters, mainly because he got a client (major water heater manufacturer) to give him one about 4 years ago. About 6 months ago, the heat pump quit working and he's got a low refrigerant light. He hasn't pursued fixing it because he knows it's going to be a $500+ repair.
 
A second opinion is in order. My parents get cheap estimates like that from decent HVAC/plumbing outfits for excessively expensive plumbing fixes.
 
Warlord said:
Living alone I hate the idea of heating a big tank of water all day that doesn’t get used but this old tank keeps on ticking so I might as well use it till it dies.
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This is a radio commercial farce if you are speaking about a gas fired water heater. Yes, there is a pilot burning in most of them, but that alone keeps the temp high enough to where the burner does not fire unless there is a draw down. I turn the control valve to pilot when we are gone on vacation.... for a week plus. Come back and the water is hot enough to take a shower.

Hot water tanks are very well insulated.
 
Hillbilly Deluxe said:
We are looking at building a MIL suite addition. I have always leaned very hard to a standard 40/50 gal gas water heater with regular gravity vent, no electricity hooked to it. That's what I've had since 1996 in my own homes, too.

I am 90% certain I will put in another 40-gallon gas water heater for this addition. I contemplated a gas tankless. A co-worker used to be very high on the heat pump water heaters, mainly because he got a client (major water heater manufacturer) to give him one about 4 years ago. About 6 months ago, the heat pump quit working and he's got a low refrigerant light. He hasn't pursued fixing it because he knows it's going to be a $500+ repair.
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4 years out of a HPWH? That's unacceptable.

I've heard tankless become a maintenance nightmare but I see them in new construction all the time.
 
A second opinion is a good idea - or at least a quote for repair/replacement options if you're inclined to believe the first company's diagnosis. Furnace and hot water tank prices with install can be all over the map.
 
BMWTurboDzl said:
4 years out of a HPWH? That's unacceptable.
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I'm not sure when heat pump water heaters started really hitting the market, but I suspect 4-5 years ago it was fairly new and slightly before huge production numbers. I don't know if the failure he's seeing is rampant or a low, one-off type of number. Again, the manufacturer is a client, we have connections, he has not gotten in touch with anyone there to explain what's going on yet.

I have a 50-gal gas (propane) water heater from the same company. I have a ~29 year old propane tank. If you know anything about propane, there's a nasty oily mess involved, when the tank gets low, some of that stuff can get into the gas and it has fouled the ceramic/metal tip (not the thermocouple) of the pilot assembly on mine. I have a new assembly that I have not yet installed.

I have experienced a no pilot light several times over the last 5 years. The burner gives a blinking light code. I was in the R&D, testing/troubleshooting lab of the water heater manufacturer....talking with people there that solve problems. I told them my model, that it was propane, what was happening (before I disassembled it and figured out what was going on), gave them the code....

Not a soul there could figure out what MIGHT be happening. No one had a clue. It helped solidify my opinion of most people working at giant companies....

I took everything apart, cleaned what I could with a small wire brush and it works great. The problem is when we forget to call for a refill and the gas gets low, the cycle repeats.

S*** happens, especially in the age of making most everything with the cheapest parts with the cheapest labor. That's what we want, right? I suspect he's got a pinhole leak in a coil in or one developed. That sort of thing happens a lot with consumer-grade cooling coils in HVAC equipment.
 
Hillbilly Deluxe said:
I'm not sure when heat pump water heaters started really hitting the market, but I suspect 4-5 years ago it was fairly new and slightly before huge production numbers. I don't know if the failure he's seeing is rampant or a low, one-off type of number. Again, the manufacturer is a client, we have connections, he has not gotten in touch with anyone there to explain what's going on yet.

I have a 50-gal gas (propane) water heater from the same company. I have a ~29 year old propane tank. If you know anything about propane, there's a nasty oily mess involved, when the tank gets low, some of that stuff can get into the gas and it has fouled the ceramic/metal tip (not the thermocouple) of the pilot assembly on mine. I have a new assembly that I have not yet installed.

I have experienced a no pilot light several times over the last 5 years. The burner gives a blinking light code. I was in the R&D, testing/troubleshooting lab of the water heater manufacturer....talking with people there that solve problems. I told them my model, that it was propane, what was happening (before I disassembled it and figured out what was going on), gave them the code....

Not a soul there could figure out what MIGHT be happening. No one had a clue. It helped solidify my opinion of most people working at giant companies....

I took everything apart, cleaned what I could with a small wire brush and it works great. The problem is when we forget to call for a refill and the gas gets low, the cycle repeats.

S*** happens, especially in the age of making most everything with the cheapest parts with the cheapest labor. That's what we want, right? I suspect he's got a pinhole leak in a coil in or one developed. That sort of thing happens a lot with consumer-grade cooling coils in HVAC equipment.
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I remember seeing them in new construction in Florida starting about 8 yrs ago. They were being promoted for their excellent efficiency*.

*For obvious reasons it should be no surprise that a heat pump WH in a garage in Florida is a smart idea in terms of getting the best efficiency possible.

I had the pilot light on my furnace go out a couple of summers ago. I was in deep trouble because my wife didn't want me to drain the tank to wash out sediment. Luckily I was able to take the ignitor out and sand some oxidation off the thermocouple in order to get the pilot to light.
 
I suppose converting to a tank water heater isnt an option?
Tankless water heaters are the most overrated thing on the market.
Take a simple device like heating water with a tank and change it back to something developed 100 years ago and sell it as a benefit for new homes, and make a massive profit to boot instead of a $500 tank water heater. GO figure.
Amazing ... but aint that America. :)

(almost sounds like the EV story)
 
Eddie said:
My 15-year-old LOWES' water heater is working well and when it leaks, I will replace it with the same plain 40 gal again.
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It amazes me how companies can make something so complicated as simple as heating water, make it sound like it's energy efficient, make massive profits from it and home builders make it sound like a feature.
I would suggest to anyone if you have a choice chose a plain old modern 40 or 50 gallon TANK water heater.
My whole life they have proved very servicable and reliable.

We didnt have a choice with our new home, it's what the builder puts in and now have our first tankless water heater.
Much more complicated and do you know what it does? It heats water like a tank heater, only thing is with the new tankless design I waste a little more water while it kicks in.
I am sure whatever energy benefit is almost zero and cost me more in wasted water. It's just nuts. Our last house had a 50 gallon NG tank water heater and our gas bill so low that I had to pay the min. charge anyway. *LOL*
 
alarmguy said:
I suppose converting to a tank water heater isnt an option?
Tankless water heaters are the most overrated thing on the market.
Take a simple device like heating water with a tank and change it back to something developed 100 years ago and sell it as a benefit for new homes, and make a massive profit to boot instead of a $500 tank water heater. GO figure.
Amazing ... but aint that America. :)

(almost sounds like the EV story)
Click to expand...
now that is an interesting question. she asked them about converting to a tank system . the told her that it would cost as much a tankless. i call BS on that. normally if i know what wrong with something like this and its just a parts swap, i would do it. but she lives in neighbor hood with nosy people and he HOA requires licensed companies to do almost everything. She also lives right across the water from Seattle and i am sure they have special " tax" for people on the island. tax as in charge more because of location.

i told her to get another estimate. interested to see how much another company will be
 
In my opinion there is no long term savings with a tankless water heater. First there is the initial additional cost of the unit, secondly they require periodic flushing with a heat exchanger cleaner which most homeowners are incapable of as it requires a seperate pumping system and then there is the more frequent and costly breakdowns that occur. IMHO you will do better financially with a tank style heater.
Also I have installed heat pump water heaters for customers and almost every one of them had a problem and a few had to be replaced, thankfully under warranty.
 
walterjay said:
In my opinion there is no long term savings with a tankless water heater. First there is the initial additional cost of the unit, secondly they require periodic flushing with a heat exchanger cleaner which most homeowners are incapable of as it requires a seperate pumping system and then there is the more frequent and costly breakdowns that occur. IMHO you will do better financially with a tank style heater.
Also I have installed heat pump water heaters for customers and almost every one of them had a problem and a few had to be replaced, thankfully under warranty.
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I could not agree more, defies logic to turn a simple device into a complicated at times nightmare.
From time tested and true solid performance of the 50 gallon water heater to what is supposed to be an energy saving tankless water heater. I say baloney.
It’s about profits and for builders simplicity of installation, as well as marketing, a so-called green product. That is questionable at best and it’s not going to save the homeowner any money.
Just my opinion, being this is your occupation I certainly believe you.

I remember the days when I was a kid growing up in what was at one time a brand new home that my parents purchased in the 1950s. It had a tankless hot water heater which was a coil inside the boiler unit used to heat the house. I remember helping my dad run acid through the coil because every couple years if that long it wouldn’t heat the water properly because of slime buildup in the tubes from chemicals that they added to the public water supply to protect the public water supply pipes from corrosion. It was a well-known problem on Long Island, New York.
Fast forward two decades so everybody got standalone 50 gallon hot water heaters and now here we are couple decades later, going back to the same theory using tankless technology again with the tubes will get a buildup of slime overtime and stop heating the water properly and efficiently.
 
alarmguy said:
I suppose converting to a tank water heater isnt an option?
Tankless water heaters are the most overrated thing on the market.
Take a simple device like heating water with a tank and change it back to something developed 100 years ago and sell it as a benefit for new homes, and make a massive profit to boot instead of a $500 tank water heater. GO figure.
Amazing ... but aint that America. :)

(almost sounds like the EV story)
Click to expand...


I agree 100%.

While the pricing for tankless/tank water heaters is very close together now, the installation/re-pipe/electrical to put in a tankless over tank is huge money now and has always been expensive.

You will NEVER EVER NEVER re-coup the additional costs of a tankless where it's a replacement for a gas tank water heater with any savings in fuel costs over a tank. NEVER.

Now... if you install a tankless water heater upon initial construction, you might see some sort of ROI over 12 years over a tank. But, like all these pricing exercises where some uneducated dweeb is shouting from the rooftops as to how much better something is, you've got a 12 year old something-another that might or might now have had some fairly expensive service or repair work done and it's nearing it's promised end of life.

And lemme clarify alarm man - There is not such thing as a $500 standard 40-gallon gas water heater anymore. $850 is about the minimum. I can find scratch-n-dent stuff on the north side of Atlanta (3 hour round trip on a good day for me) for $450-500. That's what I did 7 years ago, I paid $350 for a 50-gallon standard propane water heater from a major manufacturer (HD sell-off).
 
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