Swapping motors

[Rix]

chevy engine built by mercury marine - LT5 IIRC.
Corvette ZR1 engine.
Me likey.

I have no desire to own a pushrod engine, besides having another AMC on the road to mess with.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
The GM boys just love getting their rocks off by stuffing their engines into everything and anything. Saying they have no alternative is a cop-out. There are plenty of older F-bodies and G-bodies surfing around. Use one of them.

FWIW, I have nothing against the RX-7 swaps, the Miata swaps....etc. Cars that didn't have a V8 as an option, and the manufacturer doesn't make one that is worthwhile to put in there. But that is hardly the case between the Ford and GM crowd and their rivalry. The GM guys do it to make the Ford boys angry.



Hey, don't lump ALL "GM boys" into the same basket!!

I would NEVER put a GM (or Mopar, or ESPECIALLY any import nameplate) engine into a Blue Oval product, and NOT just because it would "make the Ford boys angry"!
I also believe in keeping the marque/manufacturer bloodlines correct, and the ONLY reason to not go with a new 5.0 'Coyote' crate engine into a Ford product (besides co$t) is if it just WILL NOT FIT!! (But I still would not put an LSx in a Blue Oval, as there are PLENTY of SBFs around which WILL fit!

)

I would however have NO qualms about installing the venerable Ford 9" axle in my ride (or any other GM product in which it could be made to fit), as it is hands down one of the BEST solid axles (with the MOST options) ever made!

One company now even makes a 9" center section for the latest GM independent rear axles!!!

BTW; I myself am not a totally devoted 'GM boy', I have owned Blue Ovals in the past, and most certainly WILL AGAIN in the future.

I AM though, a totally devoted and loyal domestic nameplate boy, as I d**n near

when I spied that first gen f body with the 2JZGTE in the engine bay.

 

[JT1]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


I'm on summit all the time. Have you? price out heads for a Windsor and a 350:



I'm not in anyway condoning the activities of those that decide to put a chevy motor into a ford chassis.

However, you've given me one example to which I see your one example and raise you one.

Ex: Holley/Summit "3 Deuces" carb/intake packs, sbc-$2261, SBF-$2741, Humm thats nearly a 500 dollar difference for the same thing.

Ex2:Scat 4340 con-rods sbc $465, sbf $519.

The list goes on. Sure there may not be a huge difference in each individual item, but it really adds up.

I will tell you again that it has not much to do about making "ford boys" angry, but if you want to get upset about it you go right ahead.

 

[OVERKILL]

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but really, a "3 deuces" intake as an example? If we are talking about building a drag car, lets at least use an intake that makes sense? Sound fair?

1. Edelbrock Victor Jr:
SBC: $219.95
SBF: $249.95

So $30.00 here.

2. Edelbrock Performer Air-Gap:
SBC: $225.95
SBF: $259.95

$34.00 here.

3. Edelbrock Performer RPM:
SBC: $149.95
SBF: $195.95

$46.00 here.

4. Weiand X-Celerator:
SBC: $159.95
SBF: $199.95

$40.00 here.

5. Weiand Stealth:
SBC: $165.95
SBF: $169.95

$4.00 here, LOL!!


And any of the above would use the same Holley carb, making that point moot

Rods and stuff? We usually find a lower mileage stock 302HO. They have forged rods and pistons (up to '92), and can be had for cheap.

If I were going the new internals route, then we are into a Dart or FMS block and it is no longer a "budget" build.

See what I'm saying? If I can use a stock HO shortblock and we dress it with the heads and one of the intakes we are talking about above, then slap a Holley 650 on it (same carb for a Ford or Chev) then where is the "price" advantage here?

If I'm building a sub-550RWHP 302, I don't need to buy rods, pistons, crank, any of that stuff. A stock HO shortblock is good to go. So while you are "freshening up" a 355 with rods and pistons to the tune of $1000 in parts plus the machine shop labour, I can buy a stock low mileage 302HO for $400.00 and be out the door for LESS money.

If I'm shooting for over 550RWHP, then we are into a lot more money to make it reliable anyways. Aftermarket block, crank, probably go stroker at that point....etc It gets more expensive for both brands when you turn up the wick.

FWIW: I won't touch a "rebuilt" 302 HO with a 10 foot pole. They are normally "freshened" with parts that are inferior to the factory originals. It is like that with a lot of rebuilds, regardless of the brand. Good parts and machine work don't come cheap. Cheap rebuilds don't last.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
It gets more expensive for both brands when you turn up the wick.

regardless of the brand. Good parts and machine work don't come cheap. Cheap rebuilds don't last.



At least within all the "Ford" rootin' there was a few gems. I even have a 3rd gen machinist in the family and he still ain't cheap.

It's money that becomes the limiting factor in almost every motor I've ever put together.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: tdpark
I have heard that David Letterman has a ford v-8 in a volvo wagon- sleeper car as he was getting too many tickets on his ride down to the city.


Next door neighbour when I was a teenager had a Volvo (240/244) with a turbo and 18psi boost...after too many turbos, he threw in a 305Chev with some decent work.

It was an awesome car.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: Maritime Storm
One of my techs put a SBC in his 87 RX-7, it's currently up for sale, too much power in too light a car = instant death waiting to happen. He was telling us that even on the strip it was too unpreditable.


They put them in 2200lb 1970s Toranas down here without creating unpredictable deathtraps...they can make them that way 'though.

 

[SteveSRT8]

I've said before in another thread that a real hot rodder will be more interested in how it runs or drives than what it is.

My Healy replica has 550 hp of small block Chevy stroker in it, no one has ever turned up their nose that I noticed.

I own more than just GM products. In this modern age it seems ridiculous to have a ton of brand loyalty to any manufacturer.

They've all got some dogs, and they've all got some winners. I'll pick the best ones for me!

 

[Rhymingmechanic]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
I've said before in another thread that a real hot rodder will be more interested in how it runs or drives than what it is.


Well said, again.

I have a Nova with a Pontiac 400 and a Mopar 8 3/4 rearend. The drivetrain was what I had, and the rear end was the cheapest and most available way to leave behind the world of highway-geared, one-leg differentials. The installation wasn't all that difficult, since the Ventura and Nova were basically the same car.

The guy who helped me make the swap drove a '65 Ford pickup with the entire drivetrain from an early Olds 442. He bought it that way, but I doubt whoever made that swap was intending to put the smackdown on Ford or Oldsmobile fans. When the 330 started giving up, he put in a 455.

 

[Norm Olt]

Two of the all-time greatest engine swaps:

SBC (& a GM tranny, automatic usually) into a Jaguar Sedan or a Toyota LandCruiser.

At one time these were basically cottage industries with multiple small companies that made and distributed swap kits.

Always looked for either one with a freshly blown engine as a project car: never did see one.

Cheers!

 

[TooManyWheels]

There is nothing novel about cross-brand engine swaps. As a kid reading car mags in the sixties, there were all kinds of odd-ball and cross-brand swaps, and no one ever got their undies in a wad over it, and no one would ever take themselves so seriously as to suggest that someone else went to all that effort just to make some them angry.

They might hint that putting a big-block Chevy in an Opel Kadette didn't produce a very good result, but they wouldn't position themselves as the centerpoint of other people's intentions.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I'm not trying to be argumentative, but really, a "3 deuces" intake as an example? If we are talking about building a drag car, lets at least use an intake that makes sense? Sound fair?

1. Edelbrock Victor Jr:
SBC: $219.95
SBF: $249.95

So $30.00 here.

2. Edelbrock Performer Air-Gap:
SBC: $225.95
SBF: $259.95

$34.00 here.

3. Edelbrock Performer RPM:
SBC: $149.95
SBF: $195.95

$46.00 here.

4. Weiand X-Celerator:
SBC: $159.95
SBF: $199.95

$40.00 here.

5. Weiand Stealth:
SBC: $165.95
SBF: $169.95

$4.00 here, LOL!!


And any of the above would use the same Holley carb, making that point moot

Rods and stuff? We usually find a lower mileage stock 302HO. They have forged rods and pistons (up to '92), and can be had for cheap.

If I were going the new internals route, then we are into a Dart or FMS block and it is no longer a "budget" build.

See what I'm saying? If I can use a stock HO shortblock and we dress it with the heads and one of the intakes we are talking about above, then slap a Holley 650 on it (same carb for a Ford or Chev) then where is the "price" advantage here?

If I'm building a sub-550RWHP 302, I don't need to buy rods, pistons, crank, any of that stuff. A stock HO shortblock is good to go. So while you are "freshening up" a 355 with rods and pistons to the tune of $1000 in parts plus the machine shop labour, I can buy a stock low mileage 302HO for $400.00 and be out the door for LESS money.

If I'm shooting for over 550RWHP, then we are into a lot more money to make it reliable anyways. Aftermarket block, crank, probably go stroker at that point....etc It gets more expensive for both brands when you turn up the wick.

FWIW: I won't touch a "rebuilt" 302 HO with a 10 foot pole. They are normally "freshened" with parts that are inferior to the factory originals. It is like that with a lot of rebuilds, regardless of the brand. Good parts and machine work don't come cheap. Cheap rebuilds don't last.


^^^AGREED!

About the only place the costs become much more divergent is when one starts modding the multi valve 'Romeo' (and now 'Coyote') engine heads, for obvious reasons vs. an OHV, 2 valve per cylinder motor.

 

[tig1]

About 1984 I helped a friend swap a Chevy staight 6 in a mid 70S Chevy 1/2 ton for a new VM Italian 6 cyl diesel he bought that was going to be a stationary power plant engine.(he got a very good price on the engine) I had to alter the bell housing they provided a bit, and the 3 speed stick tranny wasn't geared very well. But he drove it for several thou before selling.

 

[morris]

odd ball swap? in 1969, my dad and i put a chrysler 392 hemi in a 1959 plmouth. dad realy liked dusting off GTOs

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: morris
odd ball swap? in 1969, my dad and i put a chrysler 392 hemi in a 1959 plmouth. dad realy liked dusting off GTOs


That's not odd, that's awesome

 

[morris]

had only two real troubles. the ext manifold was small , and it would not make good power at high rpm. and the torsion bars was not made for that much weight, and we had to crank, bottoming out. the adjuster to get it to the right height. that would knock out the bushings of the shocks .

 

[Propflux01]

Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
Two of the all-time greatest engine swaps:

SBC (& a GM tranny, automatic usually) into a Jaguar Sedan or a Toyota LandCruiser.

At one time these were basically cottage industries with multiple small companies that made and distributed swap kits.

Always looked for either one with a freshly blown engine as a project car: never did see one.

Cheers!


I always loved those SBC into an AMC Gremlin or Hornet!

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: morris
odd ball swap? in 1969, my dad and i put a chrysler 392 hemi in a 1959 plmouth. dad realy liked dusting off GTOs


The only 1959 Mopar vehicle in which you could have a 392 Hemi from the factory was the 300C, correct?

And YES, that was a VERY cool swap!!

 

[morris]

NO the 392 hemi came ONLY on a 1957 or 1958 new yorker, or 300. the new port did NOT have a hemi. the 392 came only two years. i know cause i have a factory service manual for a 1957. the 1956 new yorker and 300 had a 354 inch. a 1955 new yorker and 300 had a 331 hemi, and was the first car in the U.S. to have 300 horsepower. the first year for the 300 is 1955. it had the front grill out of the imperial.

 

[Virtuoso]

Putting a Chevy heart in a Ford (or vice versa) is like sleeping with your sister..

It might be fast but it's just plain wrong!