Straight 30 or 15W40 for hard use air cooled small engine?

[jeepman3071]

How often do you take the engine shroud off and blow out the cooling fins? I must confess I never did in 23 years with my F510 and did finally have exhaust valve issues. Right before that I replaced the valve cover gasket as it had hardened and cracked from the heat, I belatedly figured out..

+1

Cleaning the cooling fins is just as important if not more important than changing the oil. I've seen so many engines damaged due to mouse nests plugging the fins.

I am not going to argue with you. You are one of these guys who knows everything. But if you talk to anyone that makes a living as a contractor, or talk to the folks who sell parts and service, no one uses 0w-anything in air cooled equipment. If you want to use it in your machines, that is your business but be aware it is not the recommended viscosity for almost any of these machines.

I service a few machines for landscape companies. Most know almost zero about motor oil, and put in whatever the cap says or they think it should take. 0w40 is perfectly fine for most small engines, many manufacturers even recommend a 5w30. I'd definitely prefer a Euro 0w40 over any run of the mill cheap 5w30. Most places that service and sell equipment sell whatever oil that manufacturer provides them with, or whatever cheap bulk oil they can get.

Don't overthink small engine oil. Small engines are not demanding on oil. All of my air-cooled stuff runs lower oil temps in summer than my BMW does, and they are all very simple engines with low valve spring pressures. No high zinc special oils needed, just change it frequently and keep it full. I've worked on equipment from people with all sorts of beliefs about oil, from only running 5w20 in them for fuel economy, to 20w50 and everything in-between, including a guy who only uses non-detergent SAE 30, and they are all fine.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

What approvals does an iffy Chinese knock-off of a honda ac engine require**?
__________________________________________________________________

**My junky (near new) TORO snowblower 250cc OHV AC LONCIN engine requires a two decades old, near-obsolete API SJ, and a "synthetic" 5W30 above 45degF

Whoop-de-do !

 

[RAVL]

+1

Cleaning the cooling fins is just as important if not more important than changing the oil. I've seen so many engines damaged due to mouse nests plugging the fins.

I service a few machines for landscape companies. Most know almost zero about motor oil, and put in whatever the cap says or they think it should take. 0w40 is perfectly fine for most small engines, many manufacturers even recommend a 5w30. I'd definitely prefer a Euro 0w40 over any run of the mill cheap 5w30. Most places that service and sell equipment sell whatever oil that manufacturer provides them with, or whatever cheap bulk oil they can get.

Don't overthink small engine oil. Small engines are not demanding on oil. All of my air-cooled stuff runs lower oil temps in summer than my BMW does, and they are all very simple engines with low valve spring pressures. No high zinc special oils needed, just change it frequently and keep it full. I've worked on equipment from people with all sorts of beliefs about oil, from only running 5w20 in them for fuel economy, to 20w50 and everything in-between, including a guy who only uses non-detergent SAE 30, and they are all fine.

Understood and appreciate the hands on perspective. I am actually not of the view that these motors are hard on oil; rather I just look at what the recommendation is (straight 30, 10w30, 15w40) in the manual and use that. I would not use a Euro spec 0w40 in one of these machines because first it is likely overkill and more expensive than necessary and second it is not what the manufacturer will typically recommend, so in the rare event there is an issue, I don’t want to have a debate with the rep - I just want to give them the serviced receipts and get the machine repaired. That is really all.

Take care.

 

[SC Maintenance]

What approvals does an iffy Chinese knock-off of a honda ac engine require?

From my WEN, which is I think 3 years old now?

 

[jeepman3071]

Understood and appreciate the hands on perspective. I am actually not of the view that these motors are hard on oil; rather I just look at what the recommendation is (straight 30, 10w30, 15w40) in the manual and use that. I would not use a Euro spec 0w40 in one of these machines because first it is likely overkill and more expensive than necessary and second it is not what the manufacturer will typically recommend, so in the rare event there is an issue, I don’t want to have a debate with the rep - I just want to give them the serviced receipts and get the machine repaired. That is really all.

Take care.

As someone who has had to warranty engines for customers you are on track that they want proof of service. I've never had a company request info on the oil used or change interval, but they usually want pictures of the engine internals and damage, or the engine itself to examine it. Usually it is pretty obvious when a client has run the engine low on oil, or if it has never been changed, and that is their main concern. I had one customer who clearly ran the engine out of oil, then tried to fill it before making a warranty claim, and it was pretty clear his engine burned up due to lack of oil.

 

[jeepman3071]

What approvals does an iffy Chinese knock-off of a honda ac engine require**?
__________________________________________________________________

**My junky (near new) TORO snowblower 250cc OHV AC LONCIN engine requires a two decades old, near-obsolete API SJ, and a "synthetic" 5W30 above 45degF

Whoop-de-do!

Contrary to popular belief, the approvals and requirements listed in small engine owners manuals are often outdated and reused for years. Briggs only recently changed their manuals to recommend 5w30 synthetic as the preferred oil, and my bet is that is related to emissions/fuel efficiency. Prior to that they had the same oil recommendations for 40+ years. Kawasaki, Honda, and Kohler were similar. The specs in the engine manuals and the machine manufacturer manuals are also frequently different. For the last 40 years or so John Deere has pretty much recommended their 10w30 for every single lawn and garden machine regardless of it being a push mower or large garden tractor.

The Chinese engines seem to vary depending on the manufacturer, some of the manuals I have seen just say "motor oil" with no approvals, specs, or viscosity listed.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

For short use gens - I run mine about 45min every 2 hrs and shut off just to get heat and cool the freezer -
An ACEA A40 MB spec 229.51 approvals should be O.K. But this is a high VM (vii) load lubricant, and as such will "typically" produce gum and varnish in hot spots and in the ring land area in scupper and splash lubed engines.
You get hot stuck rings your engine is going to wear fast and lose power. But Try it it may perform well it is a high spec oil will tough to pass approvals.

You can usually tell if an engine is unhappy by the song it sings - if you been around the animal long enough.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

And "Synthetic" is not a spec and mean nothing by itself. Currently it is a marketing term for oils based product using ther higher tier mineral oil base stock interchange. No guarantee whatsoever of the traditioan group iv and v majority true synthetic.
Now, if you believe the check box advertising on the back of and oil jug, most manufacturers claim improved performance (beyond ILSAC and API requirements) in various areas with their premium product offerings.

Should be better- but in areas your application needs it to be better?

- Ken

 

[kschachn]

As someone who has had to warranty engines for customers you are on track that they want proof of service. I've never had a company request info on the oil used or change interval, but they usually want pictures of the engine internals and damage, or the engine itself to examine it. Usually it is pretty obvious when a client has run the engine low on oil, or if it has never been changed, and that is their main concern. I had one customer who clearly ran the engine out of oil, then tried to fill it before making a warranty claim, and it was pretty clear his engine burned up due to lack of oil.

Yes, several of the things that actually cause failure. The oils that I mentioned will help protect your engine, not the other way around. They will work to protect your warranty which is predicated on engine damage related to the oil.

 

[fantastic]

10w-30 in the V-twin & 15w-40 in the rebuilt single cylinder 17hp Kawasaki engine.

 

[jake wells]

Mobil 1 15W50.

 

[z71bill]

OP - you're overthinking this.

Just about any decent grade will do just fine.

Are you going to be operating below 0F? No. So thinner oils are not a necessity.
Are you going to be operating above 100F? No. So thicker oils are not a necessity.
IOW - anything from 5w-30 to 15w-40 will do fine because they all are applicable between those conditions.

Find something else to worry about. Use whatever you have that meets the API spec (likely SJ or higher).

I have run my generator is temps down to 15 degrees and Houston after a hurricane can be over 100 degrees.

 

[Nmr1981]

I grab straight SAE 30 or 10w30 because that is what came with my mower and it is easy to find. I usually run to Dollar Genny they have decent prices on single quarts and is a mile from my house. Pennzoil 10w30 conventional is going in my Honda today after I pull out my knock off mitivac.

I would run straight 30 weight in my mower but I like to mow well into November for the leaves and starting it gets a little sluggish.

 

[jeepman3071]

10w-30 in the V-twin & 15w-40 in the rebuilt single cylinder 17hp Kawasaki engine.

I love those single cylinder Kawis. The V-Twins are good engines, but the older single cylinders were bullet proof. I have an FC540V on an Exmark mower.

 

[Nmr1981]

That was pretty quick and easy it was the first time using that fluid extractor for something other than my Xmas tree stand. How do you guys clean these things for storage?

 

[RazorsEdge]

That was pretty quick and easy it was the first time using that fluid extractor for something other than my Xmas tree stand. How do you guys clean these things for storage?
View attachment 211575

Rinse it out with simple green and water.

 

[repairman54]

+1

Cleaning the cooling fins is just as important if not more important than changing the oil. I've seen so many engines damaged due to mouse nests plugging the fins.

2x, pay attention to the engine when starting it after it has been parked. If there is a nest in it there will be something blowing out of it on initial startup. Maybe not a lot but something will blow out if a rats nest is in it. I've caught that a few times on my equipment. I always start up with the hood up on my riders.

 

[dguzzi]

I use the liquid kind, usually 5-40 just because I have it, I used to use 15-40 because it was free...
Newer mower gets 5-30 and I want to add a cooler...it really runs hot. (Kaw FR691V) I'll go to a 0 or 5-40 when its worn in a bit.

 

[tig1]

Say Rotella T-1 SAE 30 ($18 gallon) vs Rotella T4 15W40 ($16 a gallon) to keep it brand comparable.

In something like a pressure washer or generator in hot weather.

I use M1 10-30 in all my OPE with excellent results for the last 35+ years.

 

[billt460]

Say Rotella T-1 SAE 30 ($18 gallon) vs Rotella T4 15W40 ($16 a gallon) to keep it brand comparable.

In something like a pressure washer or generator in hot weather.

I just did a small job yesterday with my Simpson 3300 PSI Pressure Washer. (It started on the first pull after sitting for almost 6 months). It has a 6.5 HP Kohler engine. I did an oil change after I was done, because the engine was nice and hot.

I used Mobil 1 15W-50. It's what I use in all of my air cooled 4-stroke small engines. 2 Westinghouse 9500 generators, and a small Honda EM600 Generator.

It gets pretty hot around here in the Summer months, and not too cold in the Winter. So the 15W-50 really works out well. While not a very scientific analysis, I'll will say this. When you get that stuff, (15W-50 Mobil 1), on your hands at room temperature, it is a royal PAIN to wash it off!