So why are cartridge style filters more expensive?

[HTSS_TR]

Thanks Motorking, your reasoning makes sense.

I think German brands cartridge filters for European vehicles are usually better quality and sometimes cheaper too.

 

[SilverC6]

Originally Posted By: Motorking
Hi,
I work for FRAM. Cartridge filters can be more expensive for a variety of reasons. Some are patented designs, so filter makers are forced to by from the original manufacturer and stick in their box or spend $$$ in engineering money to design around the patent. (Ford Powerstroke and new Jeep V6 are examples). Many companies in the USA have very limited ability to make them, FRAM has invested Millions of $$ to bring all cart filter manufacturing in house but it is a slow process. As they get more popular and volumes increase, the price will come down. That said, they are not all created the same. If it is really cheap, you can be assured the O rings are low quality and the media is plain cellulose. On the other hand, a high price does not mean high quality in some cases as it may just mean the seller is having issues sourcing it at a reasonable price.


Thanks, that does explain the early price structure on FRAM as it appeared to be sourced from the OE manufacturer for the Camry application.

The Purolator was exactly the same filter too.

But the FRAM is very different now, and even varies significantly from the standard filter to the TG to the Ultra version.

I am using the basic FRAM now on my 2010 Camry and it appears to be doing well. I'll know more at the end of the current OCI.

I have three Ultras that I plan to use this winter.

I'm really looking forward to an Ultra in the PH10295 category (Toyota Land Cruiser, 5.7 liter). I believe a high quality filter for that application, other than the M1 filter, would be appreciated by the market.

 

[David1]

Originally Posted By: Motorking
Hi,
I work for FRAM. Cartridge filters can be more expensive for a variety of reasons. Some are patented designs, so filter makers are forced to by from the original manufacturer and stick in their box or spend $$$ in engineering money to design around the patent. (Ford Powerstroke and new Jeep V6 are examples). Many companies in the USA have very limited ability to make them, FRAM has invested Millions of $$ to bring all cart filter manufacturing in house but it is a slow process. As they get more popular and volumes increase, the price will come down. That said, they are not all created the same. If it is really cheap, you can be assured the O rings are low quality and the media is plain cellulose. On the other hand, a high price does not mean high quality in some cases as it may just mean the seller is having issues sourcing it at a reasonable price.



Im not sure if you saw the post and I took a picture of FRAM Catridge filter and it was made by MALE and someone asked me what it cost and I was caught off gaurd.... since most Extra Gaurds Oil filters are in the 4$ range. I said 4$... However it was over 10$

Can you explain why Fram would have MALE make filters for them?

Thank you.


See here is a pic of one.

Actually I think you answered this question, however why the price differnce???

Its just a MALE oil filter... Also does the MALE oil filter meet Fram SPECS?? Meaning is it Cellulose and Glass blended media ????

like the regular Extra Gaurd??? b/c the filter media looks differnt on this filter MALE makes for you.

 

[Sayjac]

^^^^^In the interest of being completely accurate and factual, regarding the MAHLE made Fram CH10855 cartridge thread, the price quoted by the above poster was claimed several times to be $3.89. And initially this was with no questions from any Bitog poster regarding it's price. That price was then questioned, checked and proven to be inaccurate by several posters including me. The price is $10.24, and the price listed online is exactly the same as in store. Based on best available information, it is identical the Hyundai/Kia cartridge oem sold at the dealer, and it's pricing is the same or very close. And answer(s) regarding the reason for using the H/K oem was also provided in that thread by the Fram rep so no need to repeat. Safe to say it meets all H/K oem specs, which is the most important factor.

To the topic.
Originally Posted By: Pops1050
Originally Posted By: Eddie
Lower volume is also a reason.


+1 - Economics of scale -.....

+2 This is the reason, and has been discussed/answered numerous times before by many knowledgeable Bitog posters.

 

[FetchFar]

Originally Posted By: Motorking
Hi,
I work for FRAM. ..... Many companies in the USA have very limited ability to make them, FRAM has invested Millions of $$ to bring all cart filter manufacturing in house but it is a slow process. As they get more popular and volumes increase, the price will come down. That said, they are not all created the same. If it is really cheap, you can be assured the O rings are low quality and the media is plain cellulose. On the other hand, a high price does not mean high quality in some cases as it may just mean the seller is having issues sourcing it at a reasonable price.


I had an interesting Fram cartridge filter experience yesterday at Pep Boys in Colorado: I saw that the toughGuard TG8765 was priced less than the extraGuard CH8765, so I reached for the TG, box top was ripped off already, AND the filter inside said "Made in China" with "TG8765" printed on the filter itself (and missing o-ring, minor problem). ..... ToughGuards are supposed to be priced higher than ExtraGuards right (in same 8765 size)? ... Could this have been a counterfeit part? The filter "looked" good anyway. (Every time I have bought the TG8765 in the recent past it has been made in the USA.)

 

[FetchFar]

Originally Posted By: David1

Its just a MALE oil filter... Also does the MALE oil filter meet Fram SPECS?? Meaning is it Cellulose and Glass blended media ????

like the regular Extra Gaurd??? b/c the filter media looks differnt on this filter MALE makes for you.


I hope Motorking Jay answers this. I've known for some time that it is extremely rare to find a German-sourced oil filter that uses some glass fibers, as Mann does not, Hengst does not, and I think Mahle doesn't either. Since Fram says that CH extraGuards have some glass fibers, this might be an exception. Motorking are you lurking?

 

[PandaBear]

Low volume.

Usually for a particular filter there're 20 years of the same brand or multiple brands already using them. Cartridges are still new, you get only a small fraction of the demand and they are likely newer cars under warranty.

 

[FetchFar]

The most minimalist oil filter yet: This 2013 Prius oil filter --- click here for picture --- has no end caps? First I've seen in a cartridge like that. I use cartridges in my GM and BMW, all have end caps.

Kind of nice, less waste. Should be cheaper. Surely there can't be royalty/licensing on this basic design, nothing special.

 

[ZeeOSix]

The Toyota spin-ons made in Thailand have the same no end cap design. Each pleat is glued at the end to seal it.

 

[SilverC6]

Originally Posted By: FetchFar
The most minimalist oil filter yet: This 2013 Prius oil filter --- click here for picture --- has no end caps? First I've seen in a cartridge like that. I use cartridges in my GM and BMW, all have end caps.

Kind of nice, less waste. Should be cheaper. Surely there can't be royalty/licensing on this basic design, nothing special.


You can find this same style filter for Toyotas in OEM, Purolator, Wix, Microguard, and, at one time, FRAM boxes.

Mann is making some Euro application oil filters in this same fashion.