Small filter on garden tractor=bad idea??

[dlundblad]

According to WIX, the spec'd filter for a Kubota G1800 is a 51034 which has no bypass setting. The guy at Oreillys cross referenced that to a WIX 51394 which has an 8-11 psi bypass. I am not satisfied due to how small this thing is.. Or the price. It was $4 more than the others. It is easily half the size of what the Kubota dealer gives us and even the filter's sizes they gave us seemed to fluctuate year to year..

This garden tractor sees harsh conditions. Dust, cutting grass, mulching etc equals more contaminates in the oil which would cause the filter to fill up faster right? Would it be better to run a bigger filter or am I over thinking it? The engine isn't dirty. It is a diesel, but gets regular oil changes every season.

Other options are the 51085. My Jeep, as well as the Kubota 4330 take this size. The Wrangler takes the 51348, which is slightly smaller. Both filters have the same bypass setting and thread pitch. I realize just because its screws on, it doesn't mean its okay to run, but am I missing anything else?

*** Heck, while I'm at it, our Kawasaki Mule has a different filter as well.. but it also has the same thread pitch and bypass setting. This one seemed to barely screw on though which tells me there are better options. Space is limited on this one though.. Surely there is some universal filter that can be used between the G1800 and the Mule. I'm guessing the 51348.

Opinions.

 

[KCJeep]

Garden tractors eat so much dust I would want the bigger filter. I'm not sure I'd trust the O'Reilly's guy to cross it for me either. Have you double checked the Wix site?

The 51348's are FL-910s equivalents IIRC and pretty small too. A Motorcraft FL-400s would add length to 4", or a PH3600/51516 equivalent would jump to 5". I have run as small as the FL-400s on my 4.0 but would not want to go any smaller.

As far as crossing you also need to pay attention to gasket dimensions in addition to the other things you mentioned.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: KCJeep
Garden tractors eat so much dust I would want the bigger filter. I'm not sure I'd trust the O'Reilly's guy to cross it for me either. Have you double checked the Wix site?


The WIX numbers do not match up.. He was only going from what his computer said. The Kubota 4330 is spec'd for a 51311 filter and he was able to cross reference that to a M1-204 which is the WIX equivalent of the 51085.

As far as the gasket size, I just compared the little booger to a 51085. It is smaller.. I have no 51348's (3.8 filter) to compare it to, but that's my next step.

 

[dlundblad]

Holy smokes

Spec'd filter gasket ID: 2.430
Given filter gasket ID: 2.173
51348 gasket ID: 2.430

The Jeep filter is closer than the filter he gave me. Is that .26" gap enough for oil to seep through? Then again it is the inner diameter.. It could possible be too big for the plate on the engine block.

 

[901Memphis]

Don't some of those similar engines run with the same size filter as that or none at all? I think it should be fine. You can always cut it open after X amount of hours to see how the media held up and adjust your interval.

 

[vssjim]

The 51034 is a longer filter for your diesel I would use that over the 51348, the 51085 filter is a shorter filter than a 51515 but same OD size. The 51348 is a short sized filter same as a 51516 OD size. All four of these numbers are Chrysler/ Ford thread and gasket sizes. Chrysler has used all these numbers over the years and Ford has used all but the 51348 filter so they all interchange but it just is all about fitting in the right spot. The mule probably takes a 51358 or a 51357 and possbly 51356/57356 but you will have to do a cross on that at the Wix web site.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Don't some of those similar engines run with the same size filter as that or none at all? I think it should be fine. You can always cut it open after X amount of hours to see how the media held up and adjust your interval.


Do you think the gasket's inner diameter differences are an issue?

 

[Bandito440]

Do you have room for a taller filter?

The 51516 or my preferred PL20195 might fit everything you've got.

Part Number: 51516
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 4.828
Outer Diameter Top: 2.921
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=6/20
Burst Pressure-PSI: 275
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micron Rating: 21
Gasket Diameters
O.D. 2.734 I.D. 2.430

 

[901Memphis]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Don't some of those similar engines run with the same size filter as that or none at all? I think it should be fine. You can always cut it open after X amount of hours to see how the media held up and adjust your interval.


Do you think the gasket's inner diameter differences are an issue?



Depends on if its going to leak or not!

 

[dlundblad]

Awesome. Thanks for the info guys.

Why do diesels need a longer filter though? All of the OEM filters I've dealt with were normal size.

 

[DSparks]

Do you know which engine you have?...look just below the injector pump mounting pad...its stamped in the block...im very curious..I work with alot of kubotas in industrial applications...

 

[dlundblad]

Ill have to check for you, but I believe the G1800 has a 16 horse 3 cylinder and the 4330 is a 43 horse 4 cylinder. IIRC that engine is used in some generators??

The Mule just has a 953cc Kawasaki diesel.

***What sort of applications do you see them in? What kind of hours do they have?

 

[NormanBuntz]

Baldwin calls for a B7285, which appears to be a smaller filter. Baldwin has an excellent e catalog:

http://catalog.baldwinfilter.com/startoffhighwayapps.html

 

[DSparks]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Ill have to check for you, but I believe the G1800 has a 16 horse 3 cylinder and the 4330 is a 43 horse 4 cylinder. IIRC that engine is used in some generators??

The Mule just has a 953cc Kawasaki diesel.

***What sort of applications do you see them in? What kind of hours do they have?


That 3-cyl 16hp should be a d600 or a d662...they also make d722,d782 and d902 in that line called "super minis"...awesome little engines imho...I have a fleet of 13 rental pressure washers with the d902 engine and have sold 50-60 of them over the last 3 years and they all come oem with the small filter although they have the 20 x 1.5 thread instead of the 3/4-16 that yours has..mine all have the little filters and some of them are nearing 3000 hours with nothing more than a 200 hour oil/filter change with 15w40 conventional diesel oil..no issues....i think the metric thread was an accross the board update quite a few years ago...i also have some d600s and d722s out of big lawnmowers that i got off ebay that all have the metric thread.....personally i wouldnt worry about the big filter unless you wanted to do it for peace of mind...it cant hurt...help ?..who knows.

here are some pics of the filters i use...left-oem comes on engine.....center kubota hh150-32430 oem replacement...right mileguard/fram orange can ph3614 that we use on our engines...$2.50 vs almost $12 for oem.

 

[dlundblad]

3000 hrs.. Very impressive.

The G1800 has about 5-600 hours on it total so the OCIs are much shorter in our situation. Lol. Its pretty "young" for being a 17 year old tractor.

The 4330 has about 300 hours total and receives the same yearly treatment.

 

[artificialist]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Don't some of those similar engines run with the same size filter as that or none at all? I think it should be fine. You can always cut it open after X amount of hours to see how the media held up and adjust your interval.


Do you think the gasket's inner diameter differences are an issue?


It could be. You have to measure the diameter of the filter mounting baseplate, then see what diamater the of the filter gasket is.

I have replaced numerous filters with ones of different sizes.

 

[Black_Thunder]

The MC 910-S is what i use on my TC30 New Holland.

I could probably fit a 400-S on there but it might be real close the engine guard/screen, perhaps next time I'll measure it, but its kind of nice being to put in exactly a gallon of oil and having it read perfectly full on the dipstick.

but the 910-S is the same size as the New Holland branded filter that I removed and I've been changing the oil in it once a year with Rotella.

 

[dlundblad]

I did a bit more digging and found out from the oil filter cross reference site (which is down at the moment..) that the Mule takes the WIX 51394 which is the one the Oreillys guy game me for the Kubota G1800. Different sites show different information.. Go figure?

I compared that to a Kubota OEM filter and they are pretty close in size. I will add the OEM is of exceptional outside quality and it even has a silicon ADBV. It could also be used for personal protection. They have the same gasket diameter, but the WIX is slightly taller. Maybe the 51394 is the best option i have. Heck it is bigger than OEM technically and seems to fit both applications.

*Oddly enough, this is also the same filter used on a 1999 Toyota Corolla. Pretty easy to remember for future reference. Lol

 

[RF Overlord]

@ the OP: If the suggested and cross-referenced filters are causing you so much consternation, why not just use the manufacturer's recommended filter? Even if it's a little more expensive it seems like it would be worth it to not have all these headaches.

 

[doitmyself]

Originally Posted By: RF Overlord
@ the OP: If the suggested and cross-referenced filters are causing you so much consternation, why not just use the manufacturer's recommended filter? Even if it's a little more expensive it seems like it would be worth it to not have all these headaches.


Yea, I agree. The Kubota sight shows two different filters for this application. Why??
https://www.kubota.com/part/PartsLookup.aspx ...HH150-32430 or HH152-32432

If you search WIX for Kubota G1800 : 51358
HH15032430 : 51365
HH152-32432; 51064

I had a Kubota B2150 at work some years ago and had this type of confusion with WIX filters also. While engine oil filters are more forgiving, I am much more careful about air filters and especially transmission/hydraulic filters. You don't want a hydraulic filter with wrong micron filtration and/or wrong flow restriction.