Should I Let a Sleeping Dog Lie?

[sciphi]

Yesterday my fiancee and I were taking a drive in her 1995 Escort LX when we heard a loud "clunk" from something after we went over a bump.

Checked the ATF level because the pan was a bit wet. Normal.

The fluid was very brownish, and had left a grayish tinge on the white napkin I wiped it on. I'm thinking that's because the car is used hard, put away wet, and only serviced when something goes wrong, or when I bug on her to (aka do it myself in my limited spare time).

She asked if we should drain and fill, then added her mechanic (lives across the street from her, hasn't steered her wrong yet, and a very busy shop) told her not to change it because the stuff in it is holding the transmission together.

If I were to do anything, I'd add Auto-RX to it after draining a quart of old fluid and replacing with a quart of new along with the Auto-RX. After 1000 miles I'd do two drains and refills with cheap Dex/Merc compatible and call it good.

Thanks for reading this long post, and thoughts are welcomed!!

 

[Barkleymut]

how many miles on the car? how many since last flush or pan drop/filter change and refill?

What was the clunk from? If you just scraped the bottom of the car I really doubt you did any damage.

 

[sciphi]

147k, no idea when it was last changed. Knowing my fiancee, likely years and years ago. Love her to death, but she is of the mentality that if her car works and she can remember when the oil was changed, she is good to go.

No idea what that clunk was. Probably a scrape or something similar. No leaking fluids as of this morning

 

[FZ1]

Yes,let the sleeping dog lie.

 

[SilverC6]

Don't go looking for trouble.

Leave it alone.

 

[Vspec]

Old train of thought is old.

Its possible that buildup has kept certain seals from leaking, but I would auto-rx it and replace it with a high quality fluid.

If nothing mechanical is broken, a fluid wont break anything mechanical.

A old fluid, can hide problems that already exist.

 

[crazyoildude]

if you do change it use a high mileage transmission fluid and get all the old fluid out also drop the pan and put a new filter in. the old thinking is if it aint broke don't fix it problem is if it aint broke now and you don't maintain it it will be broke soon.. the transmission shop down the block from our shop tells me he says that because if the fluid is burnt smelling the trans is on its way out and if he changes the oil and it goes from the original problem it can cause the customer to blame him.. that is only my opinion we are an engine shop we dont do transmissions he does..

 

[oilboy123]

I would do as you say with adding the Auto-RX. Otherwise the bad fluid will do it in.

 

[sciphi]

Thanks for the replies!

The transmission shifts fine, if a bit abruptly.

I'll try to sell my original plan to my fiancee. I do not know if she would let me drop the pan to change the filter. But that should satisfy her wanting to do something about it.

And Auto-RX the engine for the heck of it. I'd be interested in seeing what it would do for that little motor.

 

[kingrob]

That makes about as much sense as not changing your old oil because it's "holding everything together". Adding fresh fluid will do nothing except benefit the tranny.

Never draining your transmission because it's "old" is another bit of "mechanic" wisdom that's tired and dead. There's no telling how many AT's were ruined because of that "fact".

 

[Junior]

If you went over a bump and heard a clunk it is probaby a lower ball joint and nothing to do with the transmission.

That said, It won't hurt to change the trans fluid.

 

[Kestas]

sciphi's problems aren't technical as much as interpersonal. The title of his thread reflects this.

If you can talk her into changing out the ATF and convince her that it'll likely extend the useful life of the transmission, make sure she understands that the transmission is already in an iffy position and there's always a small chance that the transmission will go south, and that you can't take responsibility for that happenstance. Don't touch the car if she only reluctantly agrees - it has to be a true understanding. Otherwise, she'll blame you for that and anything else that may go wrong.

It's strange that she "wants to do something about it" but is hesitant to let you change the fluid. Ask her opinion what she wants to do about it. I'm curious what her answer will be.

It hurts to watch someone ignore the maintenance of a car. You can't ignore the situation and use the argument that it's her money because she's your fiancee. Any money she loses now is that much less money coming into the marriage.

 

[sciphi]

Kestas, she heard she should not change the fluid from her mechanic. Her mechanic is a family friend with a very successful shop who has kept her car running for years. So she's hesitant to go against what his advice is.

She wants the fluid to be changed out "a quart at a time" to avoid wholesale changes to the transmission. I have to convince her that it's better to drain out the entire pan after Auto-RX'ing it to clean up the seals and fluid passages.

Yeah, I'm trying to wean her from the "only when it fails" mentality to something closer to my "prevent it from failing within reason" mentality. She's gotten me to have a more reasonable interpretation of "within reason". I think this is within reason.

Now to hammer out a compromise!

 

[Kestas]

My sister used to say "Why don't you take it to a REAL mechanic?" when I was trying to solve a difficult problem, which is rather laughable. She doesn't say that anymore. My gray hair, a stable of fine running vehicles, and a history of good maintenance in the family put an end to such remarks. ALL the ladies listen to my advice. You'll get there - it takes time.

It's hard to compete againt an otherwise good family friend with a successful shop. Lay low on this one. Enjoy the time you'll have to yourself by not having to do the work. Watch some TV.

 

[doitmyself]

Re-read what Kestas says....I agree with him.....must be kindred spirits or something.....direct from Ann of Green Gables....never mind (real men don't know about A of GC).

This is a true test of your relationship. "I have to convince" is a bad way to approach this. Let the decision be hers to CYA.

All you can do is lay out two scenarios and the pros/cons of each, gently swaying (spin) the argument to your side. No matter which course she takes, the tranny is going to puke eventually. Which course will stave it off the longest?

Please tell us how this turns out. This type of thing will happen MANY times in your marriage.....health issues, kids, etc..

Best regards.

 

[Donald]

Her mechanic does not want to be blamed for ruining the tranny and thus tells her not to change the ATF. I can understand that position. He did not make $100 on a flush, appears to have given out good advice and no one will blame him for a ruined tranny. Thats whats best for his business, but not for the tranny. You could install a Magnefine inline filter before you do anything and it should catch the bulk of what is loosened up by introducing new ATF.

Clearly the best way would be to drop the pan and clean it, and install a new filter. If the pan has a lot of crud on it, then its better to wipe off the crud with a rag than have new ATF and/or Auto-Rx loosen it.

If dropping the pan is not an option, then I would go with a Magnefine (for $20) and do a drain and refill every few weeks until you have done at least 3, 4 would be better. You can go with Supertech ATF if it meets the spec for your vehicle.

She needs to understand (like other have said) that the reason your mechanic said to leave it alone was because it may be on its way out already. If thats the case then nothing will help. However it also may not be on its way out and then new ATF will help the tranny last longer.

If the fluid is dark thats one thing, if its burnt that is another.

Some shops drain the ATF into a clean container and drop the pan to inspect, if it does not look too bad, then they clean things up and change the filter and refill with new ATF. If after the pan is dropped it looks like a basket case, then they refill with the old ATF.

 

[sciphi]

She's pretty set against doing anything right now, so I'm dropping the subject. Better for everybody that way.

I'm a grad student and she recently got her masters, so new cars are not in the cards for another few years. She's getting a newer one first because hers is in far worse shape than mine. And we are already agreed I'm taking over maintenance on that one.

 

[AzFireGuy79]

Since she has decided against it I would say the best plan would be to go on ebay and look for a used transmission just so when this thing goes out you have a decent replacement. And after she replaces the transmission then maybe you can get her on a steady maintenance plan to avoid this in the future. Thats the beauty about older cars that are paid for ( assuming this is the case here) when they break its usually only the equivilent of one car payment for a new vehicle to fix them. Keeping in mind you can do the work

 

[Craftsman]

Originally Posted By: sciphi
She wants the fluid to be changed out "a quart at a time" to avoid wholesale changes to the transmission.

...

Now to hammer out a compromise!


Actually that may not be a bad compromise....

I think everyone knows that the old fluid has about had it. So replacing it would probably be a good thing. Now if you replace it and it breaks, then there is always going to be the "I told you so" or "we should have listened to the mechanic" even if it was going to break anyways.

So, if we start replacing the fluid using an fluid extractor in small doses, small amounts of the old stuff with the dirt will come out over a period of time. If the shifting improves as you are doing this, you can probably convince her to let you drop the pan and do a good cleaning. If it doesn't improve, you can honestly say that you did listen to her - get those brownie points when you can

!!

Either way, it could be a win-win situation for you.

 

[mechtech2]

The mechanic realizes the car is old, and the transmission is well on it's way to being puked.
If he touches it, he will be the bad guy when it has it's coming demise.

But for your best chance at longer life, get new fluid in there.
New fluid is your only hope.