Seal Conditioners-Mobil 1

[RooflessVW]

There is still some deterioration with age. 75K is probably when many seals begin to see some degree of deterioration.

View attachment 93759

https://www.infineum.com/media/w5kpot0y/api-engine-oil-classifications-brochure2.pdf

When we discuss seal compatibility, I believe we are discussing the elastomer compatibility section. Obviously SP/GF-6 sets limits to the percentage of change, but isn't this a situation where any change is undesirable?

I'll let you know. I've put my money where my mouth is and have 100k miles worth of Castrol Edge HM 0W-20 for the Odyssey.

Maybe it won't need a reseal with the timing belt, eh?

 

[wemay]

I seriously doubt ST and ST HM are the "exact same formula" or that you can tell by looking at the PDS/MSDS.

 

[AJB0009]

High Mileage Oil Seal Damage Debate; Finally Ended?

I have only recently started posting on this site, but I have been reading for several years. It seems that the topic of high mileage oils often brings out the most passion in many people. I work in industrial maintenance. Where I work, we use all Mobil lubricants. I often use Mobil's forum...

bobistheoilguy.com

 

[Scott S]

There are other attributes that an HM oil could have besides additional seal swelling or conditioning agents (or the "formula").

I know I never had a problem with switching back and forth. At least with Valvoline brand, I don't know anything about Pennzoil

 

[Scott S]

I had a feeling with cheaper oils it was a gimmick to it somewhere. The same thing with the synthetic I would imagine.. how is super tech giving you a 20,000 mile oil the same way Mobil is. Don't get me wrong I wouldn't run oil that long anyway. I know the cheap oils got to be using a cheaper base stock.

 

[Gokhan]

So the typical values listed on a PDS is "the formula"?

No, that wasn't a typical PDS. They listed every ASTM test data under the API category to several significant figures.

 

[Gene K]

That post was made by a PR rep. No one with a technical background talks like that.

75,000 miles is such an arbitrary and made up age. If my engine doesn't leak new and it doesn't leak at 75k miles and it doesn't leak at 150k miles, what's the difference?

Yet they recommend using HM oils at 75k miles.

A 15 year old seal is very stiff, dry and brittle.
An HM isn't likely to help once it fractures either.
Whether it could help before is a subject of much debate.

 

[RooflessVW]

I had a feeling with cheaper oils it was a gimmick to it somewhere. The same thing with the synthetic I would imagine.. how is super tech giving you a 20,000 mile oil the same way Mobil is. Don't get me wrong I wouldn't run oil that long anyway. I know the cheap oils got to be using a cheaper base stock.

How? Marketing, or lack thereof.

Mobil 1 has a huge marketing bill, they sponsor race teams, have manufacturer partnerships, etc.

Supertech is just put on Wal-Mart's shelves as a competitor to the big boys.

There's nothing "less than" about the oil in the bottle.

 

[Scott S]

How? Marketing, or lack thereof.

Mobil 1 has a huge marketing bill, they sponsor race teams, have manufacturer partnerships, etc.

Supertech is just put on Wal-Mart's shelves as a competitor to the big boys.

There's nothing "less than" about the oil in the bottle.

I was referring to supertech, I'm not saying it's bad oil, I have Kirkland in my truck right now. But like this post is saying is it considered a true synthetic, like Quaker State and Mobil 1 and Valvoline..

 

[Gene K]

I was referring to supertech, I'm not saying it's bad oil, I have Kirkland in my truck right now. But like this post is saying is it considered a true synthetic, like Quaker State and Mobil 1 and Valvoline..

I've never heard any evidence it's anything but a Group III just like the others you mentioned. Some people speculate that they might be able to meet D1G2 with a high GII+/GIII Blend because Shell did it but other than the fact that it cost a few bucks less than a name brand synthetic in a 5 qt container they have no evidence. Honestly it's usually not the cheapest synthetic at Walmart when you talk about sales prices and rebates on name brands.

I wouldnt put huge faith in the Warren PDS to be the right ones. RIght now the Mag-1 PDS (Which is what they have sent me in the past for ST) show the same data for 5W-20 Blend, 5W-20 HM and 5W-30 HM. I highly doubt their 5W-30 HM is 8.933 cSt @ 100C.

 

[Scott S]

I've never heard any evidence it's anything but a Group III just like the others you mentioned. Some people speculate that they might be able to meet D1G2 with a high GII+/GIII Blend because Shell did it but other than the fact that it cost a few bucks less than a name brand synthetic in a 5 qt container they have no evidence. Honestly it's usually not the cheapest synthetic at Walmart when you talk about sales prices and rebates on name brands.

I wouldnt put huge faith in the Warren PDS to be the right ones. RIght now the Mag-1 PDS (Which is what they have sent me in the past for ST) show the same data for 5W-20 Blend, 5W-20 HM and 5W-30 HM. I highly doubt their 5W-30 HM is 8.933 cSt @ 100C.

That seems a little low, and as of the other day, Quaker State was cheaper than super tech anyway.. hell you can get Kendall Is cheaper than supertech if you order it through PSC. I emailed Kendall some questions, they never even got back to me... A matter of fact..

 

[Scott S]

They also have that six quart box of havoline. If I'm not mistaken when I looked at the PDS wasn't oil partially refined to something?

 

[Hermann]

With all the "made no difference" claims, seemingly to me the big majority of HM users, I've concluded the effect on seals is very, very minimal. Do you really think they have that drastic an effect?

I've always switched to HM about the 75k or so point because I don't want a leak. I figure it's good for the seals at that age. I really don't know though. I think we need some folks to remove seals exposed to HM oil for a long time and spec them to know.

I have had 2 vehicles that "high mileage" oil really helped.. In a old BMW air cooled boxer it cut the oil leaking from the pushrod tube seals by 75% at least. Oil consumption dropped to about 1/2 qt every thousand miles. High mileage oils works, they do occasionally work miracles. The other is my 15 year old push mower with a Chonda motor, it is like the Energizer Bunny. Fired up for year 16, in 4 pulls.

 

[kschachn]

They also have that six quart box of havoline. If I'm not mistaken when I looked at the PDS wasn't oil partially refined to something?

I've never heard of a motor oil being partially refined to anything.

 

[incognito_2u]

……There are aftermarket seal swellers in a can that aren't the best thing for the seals other than a band aid

How does “ATP AT-205” rate?

 

[Scott S]

I've never heard of a motor oil being partially refined to anything.

My bad it's plant based, but that's not the one at Walmart sells.. recycled oils I believe is safety clean.. and a couple of other ones..

 

[Gene K]

They also have that six quart box of havoline. If I'm not mistaken when I looked at the PDS wasn't oil partially refined to something?

Rerefined? Perhaps off the MSDS? The Valvoline HM ML 5W-30 MSDS from 4/30/2021 appeard to have predominately a Hydroprocessed Group II+ Base produced with spent lube as a feedstock.

 

[Scott S]

Rerefined? Perhaps off the MSDS? The Valvoline HM ML 5W-30 MSDS from 4/30/2021 appeard to have predominately a Hydroprocessed Group II+ Base produced with spent lube as a feedstock.

Over 10 years ago Valvoline had oil called next Gen, they tried for a while it was 50% recycled oil.. do you remember that? LOL it ended up being a flop...

 

[ka9mnx]

I've never heard any evidence it's anything but a Group III just like the others you mentioned. Some people speculate that they might be able to meet D1G2 with a high GII+/GIII Blend because Shell did it but other than the fact that it cost a few bucks less than a name brand synthetic in a 5 qt container they have no evidence. Honestly it's usually not the cheapest synthetic at Walmart when you talk about sales prices and rebates on name brands.

I wouldnt put huge faith in the Warren PDS to be the right ones. RIght now the Mag-1 PDS (Which is what they have sent me in the past for ST) show the same data for 5W-20 Blend, 5W-20 HM and 5W-30 HM. I highly doubt their 5W-30 HM is 8.933 cSt @ 100C.

I have asked Warren Distribution specifically for SuperTech PDS's and that is what they sent me.

 

[kschachn]

Never mind, I see it is synthetic blend.