Sad story - check your oil

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: NHGUY
Toyotas don't last forever.If they did,they would have no reason to sell new ones.No 2 similar vehicles will last the exact same.For every 300K vehicle I am sure there are plenty that went poof at 80K.
That's a gross ovesimplification. Properly mantained quality cars do not just go "poof" at 80k, unless they're GM maybe.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: mva
Yesterday I changed the oil. Last night my daughter was driving the van and it died going up a large hill.


That's the key sentence right there. The van was going up a hill when it died. That tells me the engine didn't have enough oil in the sump to cover the incline of the hill.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: mva
Yesterday I changed the oil. Last night my daughter was driving the van and it died going up a large hill.


That's the key sentence right there. The van was going up a hill when it died. That tells me the engine didn't have enough oil in the sump to cover the incline of the hill.

Well, the OP also said that he change the oil, so the oil level was presumably correct. So are you saying that Sienna wasn't designed to drive up a hill???

Must have been one heck of a hill.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Well, the OP also said that he change the oil, so the oil level was presumably correct. So are you saying that Sienna wasn't designed to drive up a hill???


I'm saying either the OP didn't add enough oil during that oil change, or the engine lost oil between the time of the oil change and going up that hill. One of the two.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: mva
Yesterday I changed the oil. Last night my daughter was driving the van and it died going up a large hill.


That's the key sentence right there. The van was going up a hill when it died. That tells me the engine didn't have enough oil in the sump to cover the incline of the hill.


He also said it was already making noise. The noise got worse. If it already had a damaged rod bearing the LOAD from going up the hill was probably what led to it spinning. Unless it had like 1 litre of oil in it (doubtful, since he just changed it), your theory doesn't work. On the other hand, if he had a massive oil leak (improperly installed filter, improperly torqued drain plug....etc) that he was unaware of that led to the engine basically dumping the majority of the sump on the journey, then your theory fits.

We won't know until we get some more information from the OP.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
He also said it was already making noise. The noise got worse.


Yes and that tells me the engine may have had a catastrophic leak before he did the oil change. He wasn't able to keep an eye on the oil level because the van was in possession of his daughter and girlfriend.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
He also said it was already making noise. The noise got worse.


Yes and that tells me the engine may have had a catastrophic leak before he did the oil change. He wasn't able to keep an eye on the oil level because the van was in possession of his daughter and girlfriend.


It didn't have a catastrophic leak; it was down 1 litre of oil. It was below the low mark on the dipstick before he changed it, the fact that it registered on the dipstick at all means that it was not at a problematically low level.

 

[zzyzzx]

Originally Posted By: mva
Last night my daughter was driving the van and it died going up a large hill. She called me and said it was making a horrible noise with lots of smoke and a bad smell. I'm pretty sure it blew a rod. The van had 345,000 km on it


Obligatory woman driver comment!

Anyway, unless youu seriously messed up the oil change, I don't think that was the problem. Maybe you dislodged a bunch of sludge, or something, since it is a Toyota.

 

[JC1]

Originally Posted By: mva
I knew that the van was overdue for an oil change and I had already purchased a jug of 5W30 QS high mileage oil and a filter. I have moved twice in the last few months so I had let the van go longer than normal (about 11,000 km) between oil changes.


I have a 98 Sienna and those engines are known for being sludge prone. I would never leave the oil in it for 11,000 km even with full synthetic. The most I go is 7500km. You should remove the front valve cover to see if you have a bad case of sludge.

Regards, JC.

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: mva
Yesterday I changed the oil. Last night my daughter was driving the van and it died going up a large hill.


That's the key sentence right there. The van was going up a hill when it died. That tells me the engine didn't have enough oil in the sump to cover the incline of the hill.


He also said it was already making noise. The noise got worse. If it already had a damaged rod bearing the LOAD from going up the hill was probably what led to it spinning. Unless it had like 1 litre of oil in it (doubtful, since he just changed it), your theory doesn't work. On the other hand, if he had a massive oil leak (improperly installed filter, improperly torqued drain plug....etc) that he was unaware of that led to the engine basically dumping the majority of the sump on the journey, then your theory fits.

We won't know until we get some more information from the OP.


I agree, it probably had damage from running too low, may have gone up a hill while oil was low to cause the damage, and even after it was changed the next hill probably just did it in with higher RPMs

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
It didn't have a catastrophic leak; it was down 1 litre of oil. It was below the low mark on the dipstick before he changed it, the fact that it registered on the dipstick at all means that it was not at a problematically low level.


If you combine that 1 litre low plus a steep incline such as a hill, that oil pickup tube will be sucking air instead of oil.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
It didn't have a catastrophic leak; it was down 1 litre of oil. It was below the low mark on the dipstick before he changed it, the fact that it registered on the dipstick at all means that it was not at a problematically low level.


If you combine that 1 litre low plus a steep incline such as a hill, that oil pickup tube will be sucking air instead of oil.


No, it won't. That's why cars have sumps and not a washtub for an oil pan. But the car didn't blow up when he discovered it was down a litre, it blew up after the oil change, presumably with the proper amount of oil in it.

 

[OVERKILL]

This thread may be relevant:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2869329&page=all

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
No, it won't. That's why cars have sumps and not a washtub for an oil pan. But the car didn't blow up when he discovered it was down a litre, it blew up after the oil change, presumably with the proper amount of oil in it.


And the keyword being in your post is "presumably."

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
No, it won't. That's why cars have sumps and not a washtub for an oil pan. But the car didn't blow up when he discovered it was down a litre, it blew up after the oil change, presumably with the proper amount of oil in it.


And the keyword being in your post is "presumably."

Yes. Because we have not heard back from the OP. Hopefully we do so that we get some more information. It is possible he did not verify the proper oil level after the change. It is possible he did not check for leaks after the change. There are a large number of possibilities here and without more information we are just guessing.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Yes. Because we have not heard back from the OP.


Yes and until we hear back from the OP, you're gonna be biting your fingernails. I can hear that chattering noise all the way from here.

 

[Donald]

If adding 1 QT brought it to full, then I doubt being down a QT caused the issue. Nor did an 11000km OCI (6835 miles). Was the oil level still fine when the engine died?

I would agree that high mileage was the issue if the oil was fine after it died.

 

[dlundblad]

Regardless of what happened, we all make mistakes my friend. Before I was a BITOG'r, I would run 6000 mile OCIs without checking my oil even with a RMS leak. Last full synthetic OCI, I happened to check my oil and it was slightly below the "safe" zone. Who knows how many times that happened, but my oil light never came on so I imagine all is well.

To top it off, I never checked the oil in the parents oil consuming 3.8 either. I had no idea the issue even existed. It would be ran at about 6000 miles and it seems to consume 1 quart every now. Im giving up on synthetic with this engine and am going to give PYB a try to see if it helps slow consumption. Its short tripped now with my dad driving it so I think 3000 mile OCIs are in order too.

 

[mva]

Thanks for all the comments.

I went and checked on the van this morning before turning it over to the junk yard.

The oil was still full to the top mark after the oil change last night. No issues with oil level or the filter gasket. I started the engine but the noise was horrific. It ran but sounded very bad.

I was anal about changing the PCV valve regularly and the engine had no significant sludge the last time I looked under the valve cover a few years ago. I actually posted a photo on this site - I'll have a look for the old post.

I am agreeing with some other posts here that it was very likely just wear over time. The van still showed some level on the dipstick when the ticking noise started. The 5W30 QS Defy oil was old and low combined with cold temperature may have been too much or it was just overall age and wear on this engine.

The timing belt was also overdue for a change but I doubt that that could cause the initial ticking sound or the noise I heard today. I took it for a good drive yesterday after the oil change and it ran fine except for the tick noise.

It was a great vehicle for many years with no major repairs required since I bought it used in 2001. I have only had to fix some power window switches, heater controls, door latches and handles, battery, tires and brakes.

RIP

 

[mva]

Here is a photo under the valve cover a few years ago:

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/2847997/Re:_Front_Valve_Cover_Off_of_2#Post2847997

Photo under valve cover

We have a large hill in this area that we go up and down daily, so the engine could have been starved for oil going up the hill with low oil level. This may have caused the initial damage.