I am a new member to the site and the more I read the more I am questioning things I have done in the past(in regards to vehicle maintenance). I recently had my radiator flushed at Pepboys. To my knowledge this is the first radiator flush for the vehicle(118k miles). It is a 2001 nissan pathfinder. I bought it several years ago and it had around 42k on it. After reading some of the post on the site I am questioning the antifreeze that Pepboys used. It is the Proline brand. Should I be concerned about this type of antifreeze in my car? Don't bash me too hard, but before a few days ago I really didn't know that there was much of a difference in antifreeze other than the brand name.
Recently flushed antifreeze
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Originally Posted By: ryan604
I am a new member to the site and the more I read the more I am questioning things I have done in the past(in regards to vehicle maintenance). I recently had my radiator flushed at Pepboys. To my knowledge this is the first radiator flush for the vehicle(118k miles). It is a 2001 nissan pathfinder. I bought it several years ago and it had around 42k on it. After reading some of the post on the site I am questioning the antifreeze that Pepboys used. It is the Proline brand. Should I be concerned about this type of antifreeze in my car? Don't bash me too hard, but before a few days ago I really didn't know that there was much of a difference in antifreeze other than the brand name.
Was it green "Ethylene Glycol" antifreeze, or a different color?
I am a new member to the site and the more I read the more I am questioning things I have done in the past(in regards to vehicle maintenance). I recently had my radiator flushed at Pepboys. To my knowledge this is the first radiator flush for the vehicle(118k miles). It is a 2001 nissan pathfinder. I bought it several years ago and it had around 42k on it. After reading some of the post on the site I am questioning the antifreeze that Pepboys used. It is the Proline brand. Should I be concerned about this type of antifreeze in my car? Don't bash me too hard, but before a few days ago I really didn't know that there was much of a difference in antifreeze other than the brand name.
Was it green "Ethylene Glycol" antifreeze, or a different color?
Its green.
Originally Posted By: GearheadTool
Was it green "Ethylene Glycol" antifreeze, or a different color?
Tool, don't confuse the issue... COLOR DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING, and almost all coolants are ethylene glycol, including DexCool, G-05, Asian formula... everything except the "low toxicity coolants which are propylene glycol. The Glycol matters not at all, its the anti-corrosion additives that can ruin an incompatible engine.
"Conventional" antifreeze, which was traditionally green, uses inorganic corrosion inhibitors. DexCool (which is orange when a name brand, but can be other colors in the aftermarket) uses 2-EHA organic acid. G-05 (red when Mopar brand, gold when Zerex or Motorcraft brand) uses non-2-EHA organic acids plus silicates. Most "asian" formulas use non-2-EHA organic acids plus phosphates.
I believe that "Proline" (last time I checked, and its been a long time so it should be confirmed) is an old-style inorganic inhibitor type coolant made by Peak's parent company. I *think* that's the general type of coolant Nissan was using in 2001, maybe someone with more Nissan knowledge can chime in. What you really want to avoid is something like an alleged "all-makes / all models" coolant because its probably a DexCool clone. One exception to that is Peak Global Lifetime, which according to most discussions here is considered safer than, for example, Prestone all-makes-all-models.
Was it green "Ethylene Glycol" antifreeze, or a different color?
Tool, don't confuse the issue... COLOR DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING, and almost all coolants are ethylene glycol, including DexCool, G-05, Asian formula... everything except the "low toxicity coolants which are propylene glycol. The Glycol matters not at all, its the anti-corrosion additives that can ruin an incompatible engine.
"Conventional" antifreeze, which was traditionally green, uses inorganic corrosion inhibitors. DexCool (which is orange when a name brand, but can be other colors in the aftermarket) uses 2-EHA organic acid. G-05 (red when Mopar brand, gold when Zerex or Motorcraft brand) uses non-2-EHA organic acids plus silicates. Most "asian" formulas use non-2-EHA organic acids plus phosphates.
I believe that "Proline" (last time I checked, and its been a long time so it should be confirmed) is an old-style inorganic inhibitor type coolant made by Peak's parent company. I *think* that's the general type of coolant Nissan was using in 2001, maybe someone with more Nissan knowledge can chime in. What you really want to avoid is something like an alleged "all-makes / all models" coolant because its probably a DexCool clone. One exception to that is Peak Global Lifetime, which according to most discussions here is considered safer than, for example, Prestone all-makes-all-models.
The factory service manual for our Pathfinders specify "Genuine Nissan anti-freeze coolant or equivalent". Equivalent is probably "ethylene glycol" antifreeze, as older FSMs cite. I've never used anything but green Nissan coolant in my Pathfinder, though I've read of other owners using other Prestone without issue. Somebody even used Honda genuine coolant since it was cheaper than Nissan coolant for them.
Don't go by color as other have said. You could ask them what they used. Look up the MSDS. Also tell them you have a 2008 (pick any GM vehicle) and a 2009 Jeep that you may want a flush done and would they use the exact same stuff in those also. From there you can deduce.
If your vehicle from the factory did not have the "old green" but a newer formulation extended life then they should not have put in the "old green" after the flush and should do it again if it was done wrong.
Welcome to BITOG and even if you never lift a wrench, being an educated auto consumer is a positive thing and will save you money as fewer will try and pull stuff on you.
On the negative side, you will want to use better oil, filters and get used oil analysis done. No more $19.95 oil changes for you.
So it will probably cost you being on BITOG
If your vehicle from the factory did not have the "old green" but a newer formulation extended life then they should not have put in the "old green" after the flush and should do it again if it was done wrong.
Welcome to BITOG and even if you never lift a wrench, being an educated auto consumer is a positive thing and will save you money as fewer will try and pull stuff on you.
On the negative side, you will want to use better oil, filters and get used oil analysis done. No more $19.95 oil changes for you.
So it will probably cost you being on BITOG
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2001 Pathfinder came with Nissan's original green coolant from the factory, with a 4 year or 60k mile initial change then every 2 years or 30k thereafter. Extended life blue coolant began being used with some 2009 models. The two can be mixed, but mixing reduces the change interval to that of the green coolant. I do not recall the change intervals for the blue coolant, sorry. I'll probably get the coolant flushed at Nissan with the blue coolant at some point.
Originally, the service procedure was a flush and fill, but a TSB with revised maintenance procedures now specifies a drain and fill of the radiator only.
Originally, the service procedure was a flush and fill, but a TSB with revised maintenance procedures now specifies a drain and fill of the radiator only.
Pep Boys coolant is a Dexclone. I'm not going to get that debate started other than saying I don't like it, I wont use it and I have my personal reasons why.
You did not get an actual flush. They call it a flush but it just an exchange. I'm 100% positive that they did not remove your hoses and blow air and water through everything to clean out the junk. They hooked the machine up to your where your Radiator cap goes and vacuumed out the old and shot in the new.
You did not get an actual flush. They call it a flush but it just an exchange. I'm 100% positive that they did not remove your hoses and blow air and water through everything to clean out the junk. They hooked the machine up to your where your Radiator cap goes and vacuumed out the old and shot in the new.
Thanks for the responses from everyone. I have been spending a lot of time(prob too much) on here lately trying to learn as much as I can.
I asked them before they started the "Flush" if they do a flush or just a drain and fill and he told me it was a flush. It only took about 15 minutes so my thinking is they only do a drain and fill. When it was done I asked the guy what type of antifreeze did they use and he said Prestone. But when I checked the invoice I was charged for "Proline".
If I get a MSDS for the Proline will it tell me if it is a dexcool clone?
And, if this antifreeze is indeed incompatible with the Pathfinder, how urgent is it to replace it? Should I do it immediately or can it wait until I can have a true "Flush" completed?
I asked them before they started the "Flush" if they do a flush or just a drain and fill and he told me it was a flush. It only took about 15 minutes so my thinking is they only do a drain and fill. When it was done I asked the guy what type of antifreeze did they use and he said Prestone. But when I checked the invoice I was charged for "Proline".
If I get a MSDS for the Proline will it tell me if it is a dexcool clone?
And, if this antifreeze is indeed incompatible with the Pathfinder, how urgent is it to replace it? Should I do it immediately or can it wait until I can have a true "Flush" completed?
Originally Posted By: ryan604
If I get a MSDS for the Proline will it tell me if it is a dexcool clone?
And, if this antifreeze is indeed incompatible with the Pathfinder, how urgent is it to replace it? Should I do it immediately or can it wait until I can have a true "Flush" completed?
The MSDS will very quickly tell you PART of the story. If it says "2-EHA" or "2-Ethylhexanoate" on the MSDS, then it is at least a partial 'DexClone' because its using the same organic acid- and the one that has been implicated in damaging some gasket materials that aren't compatible. But it may have also contained silicates or phosphates, which DexCool does not.
You'll get varying stories about the 'urgency,' and I really don't know what to tell you. It all depends on the exact gasket materials used in the engine. Even GM blew that one and used DexCool in a generation of V8 and V6 engines that had lower intake manifold gaskets that would fail, with DexCool as a likely contributing factor. On the other hand, I'll bet dollars to donuts that if I were brave, I could go out and fill my 1966 440 V8 with DexCool and not have an issue, because it doesn't HAVE intake gaskets exposed to coolant at all, and head gaskets are not as likely to be affected (by the way- I won't do it, the 440's are happy with G-05). What I'm saying is that it all depends on the specific cooling system, and its hard to really KNOW if there's a potential problem or not.
Personally, as cheap and easy as a coolant flush is to do in the driveway, I'd swap it out some saturday morning and know that I'm golden.
OK, I went and looked at Pep Boys coolant selections. They seem to have eliminated the old "Proline" conventional for an all-makes/models tpe, and then they have "Proline Orange" which is a true DexCool. So I'm betting you did get a DexClone- an equivalent of Prestone all makes/ all models, a DexCool base with modified additives that don't really match any one manufacturer's specs exactly. I'd get it out if it were me.
If I get a MSDS for the Proline will it tell me if it is a dexcool clone?
And, if this antifreeze is indeed incompatible with the Pathfinder, how urgent is it to replace it? Should I do it immediately or can it wait until I can have a true "Flush" completed?
The MSDS will very quickly tell you PART of the story. If it says "2-EHA" or "2-Ethylhexanoate" on the MSDS, then it is at least a partial 'DexClone' because its using the same organic acid- and the one that has been implicated in damaging some gasket materials that aren't compatible. But it may have also contained silicates or phosphates, which DexCool does not.
You'll get varying stories about the 'urgency,' and I really don't know what to tell you. It all depends on the exact gasket materials used in the engine. Even GM blew that one and used DexCool in a generation of V8 and V6 engines that had lower intake manifold gaskets that would fail, with DexCool as a likely contributing factor. On the other hand, I'll bet dollars to donuts that if I were brave, I could go out and fill my 1966 440 V8 with DexCool and not have an issue, because it doesn't HAVE intake gaskets exposed to coolant at all, and head gaskets are not as likely to be affected (by the way- I won't do it, the 440's are happy with G-05). What I'm saying is that it all depends on the specific cooling system, and its hard to really KNOW if there's a potential problem or not.
Personally, as cheap and easy as a coolant flush is to do in the driveway, I'd swap it out some saturday morning and know that I'm golden.
OK, I went and looked at Pep Boys coolant selections. They seem to have eliminated the old "Proline" conventional for an all-makes/models tpe, and then they have "Proline Orange" which is a true DexCool. So I'm betting you did get a DexClone- an equivalent of Prestone all makes/ all models, a DexCool base with modified additives that don't really match any one manufacturer's specs exactly. I'd get it out if it were me.
[/quote] OK, I went and looked at Pep Boys coolant selections. They seem to have eliminated the old "Proline" conventional for an all-makes/models tpe, and then they have "Proline Orange" which is a true DexCool. So I'm betting you did get a DexClone- an equivalent of Prestone all makes/ all models, a DexCool base with modified additives that don't really match any one manufacturer's specs exactly. I'd get it out if it were me. [/quote]
Thanks, I really appreciate your help. I think I will look at the manual to see what Nissan recommended and do the refill myself this weekend.
Do you think I should do a flush or just empty and refill?
Thanks, I really appreciate your help. I think I will look at the manual to see what Nissan recommended and do the refill myself this weekend.
Do you think I should do a flush or just empty and refill?
A radiator drain and fill should be fine, I think. The block drain plugs are nigh impossible to access.
Get a gallon of Nissan green undiluted from a dealer and a few gallons of distilled water. Premix the coolant and a gallon of the distilled water. Open the air relief valve (center rear of engine, covered by a black rubber plug held in with a spring clamp) and radiator cap, and set the heater knob to max temp, then open the drain plug. Let it drain completely, run a gallon of distilled water through the radiator, then close the drain plug and start filling the coolant slowly. Let it sit for a few minutes once full, then top off if required. Close the air relief valve then monitor coolant level in the reservoir daily, topping off as required.
Get a gallon of Nissan green undiluted from a dealer and a few gallons of distilled water. Premix the coolant and a gallon of the distilled water. Open the air relief valve (center rear of engine, covered by a black rubber plug held in with a spring clamp) and radiator cap, and set the heater knob to max temp, then open the drain plug. Let it drain completely, run a gallon of distilled water through the radiator, then close the drain plug and start filling the coolant slowly. Let it sit for a few minutes once full, then top off if required. Close the air relief valve then monitor coolant level in the reservoir daily, topping off as required.
Originally Posted By: ryan604
[/quote] OK, I went and looked at Pep Boys coolant selections. They seem to have eliminated the old "Proline" conventional for an all-makes/models tpe, and then they have "Proline Orange" which is a true DexCool. So I'm betting you did get a DexClone- an equivalent of Prestone all makes/ all models, a DexCool base with modified additives that don't really match any one manufacturer's specs exactly. I'd get it out if it were me.
Thanks, I really appreciate your help. I think I will look at the manual to see what Nissan recommended and do the refill myself this weekend.
Do you think I should do a flush or just empty and refill?
[/quote]
I like pulling the block drain plugs and flushing the snot out of the system with a garden hose, then with distilled water... you'd be surprised at the casting debris that sits in the bottom of the water jackets of a brand-new engine.
BUT: if your block drain plugs are hard to get at, or there's ANY risk of breaking one off, then don't try to pull them. Just flush with a few gallons of distilled water (fill system with disttilled, fire it up for a few minutes until the T-stat starts top ope to circulate, then drain again). Then re-fill with coolant. I'd guesstimate maybe a half gallon of water will be left in the block and heater core, so put in 1/2 gallon of pure coolant, and the rest 50/50 mix. That should get you close to 50/50 overall, and do a pretty good job of getting most of the questionable coolant out of there.
[/quote] OK, I went and looked at Pep Boys coolant selections. They seem to have eliminated the old "Proline" conventional for an all-makes/models tpe, and then they have "Proline Orange" which is a true DexCool. So I'm betting you did get a DexClone- an equivalent of Prestone all makes/ all models, a DexCool base with modified additives that don't really match any one manufacturer's specs exactly. I'd get it out if it were me.
Thanks, I really appreciate your help. I think I will look at the manual to see what Nissan recommended and do the refill myself this weekend.
Do you think I should do a flush or just empty and refill?
[/quote]
I like pulling the block drain plugs and flushing the snot out of the system with a garden hose, then with distilled water... you'd be surprised at the casting debris that sits in the bottom of the water jackets of a brand-new engine.
BUT: if your block drain plugs are hard to get at, or there's ANY risk of breaking one off, then don't try to pull them. Just flush with a few gallons of distilled water (fill system with disttilled, fire it up for a few minutes until the T-stat starts top ope to circulate, then drain again). Then re-fill with coolant. I'd guesstimate maybe a half gallon of water will be left in the block and heater core, so put in 1/2 gallon of pure coolant, and the rest 50/50 mix. That should get you close to 50/50 overall, and do a pretty good job of getting most of the questionable coolant out of there.
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