Ranking of ATF Fluids?

[melk]

Do you have any idea how long it has been since the fluid was changed?

CRV I took over from my SIL about a year ago. Records show ATF service (I assume a single drain/fill) at 155k or about 10k before I took it over at 165k. Prior to that who knows… OCI was generally around 10k :/

The Sonata was my daughters, bought before I had any idea about the Theta II. I’d have to dig and see if we ever did a carfax on it. In any case both cars are super easy to service so a couple more drains should have them in good order. Sonata has been passed to my son who sort of helps maintain it but doesn’t care that much.

 

[amateurbob]

CRV I took over from my SIL about a year ago. Records show ATF service (I assume a single drain/fill) at 155k or about 10k before I took it over at 165k. Prior to that who knows… OCI was generally around 10k :/

The Sonata was my daughters, bought before I had any idea about the Theta II. I’d have to dig and see if we ever did a carfax on it. In any case both cars are super easy to service so a couple more drains should have them in good order. Sonata has been passed to my son who sort of helps maintain it but doesn’t care that much.

Thanks for the background!

 

[MolaKule]

What's your opinion on adding Lube Gard's Highly Friction Modified ATF Supplement to a compatible viscosity base fluid?

https://lubegard.com/product/highly-friction-modified-atf-hfm-atf-supplement-with-lxe-technology/

I don't advise it because it may change the overall Mu(v) of the fluid

Now anecdotally, it seems the Lubegard RED tends to alleviate some shifting problems due to the cleaning effects of its LXE esters.

In most cases, one should do at least 3 ATF changes to see if new fluid alleviates previous problems before adding any OTC additive.

 

[UGASpike]

one should do at least 3 ATF changes

3 changes with current fill fluid or is this moving to an aftermarket fluid? What method fluid change, Spill/fill or flush?

 

[MolaKule]

3 changes with current fill fluid or is this moving to an aftermarket fluid? What method fluid change, Spill/fill or flush?

I prefer a drain/re-fill and then drive it short distances before the next DF.

I would use current fill fluid before moving to another fluid but the choice is yours.

 

[I<3oil]

I don't advise it because it may change the overall Mu(v) of the fluid

Now anecdotally, it seems the Lubegard RED tends to alleviate some shifting problems due to the cleaning effects of its LXE esters.

In most cases, one should do at least 3 ATF changes to see if new fluid alleviates previous problems before adding any OTC additive.

Anecdotally, on the truck forums, it seems to help with the GM/Ford 10 speeds not grenading themselves. My dad's 2020 F150 is in the shop right now with 60k miles getting a replacement trans. I bought him a bottle of lubegard red so it's ready to go in once he gets the truck back. Been in the shop 3 weeks now.

 

[UGASpike]

Does this red Lubegard increase the viscosity? or just simply introduce esters as MolaKule stated? If its simply just cleaning wouldn't Valvoline Restore and Protect ATF be a big player since it has ULV compatibility?

 

[melk]

Strongly considering Lubegard Red for my Chrysler TE62 which has hard shifting and stumbling on both accel/decel for a long time now. I’m 2 pan drops in so far and will do at least one more before adding the LG.

 

[MolaKule]

Thank you for your response. Does the transmission computer relearn to account for a different viscosity ATF to then control shift, if this is the case then any ATF brand could be used with regard to its different viscosity to the OEM and the main issue would be the additive package.

Adaptive learning attempts to predict how the transmission should shift depending on the driver's power demand, TPS, ATF and coolant temp.

@clinebarger may have additional info on adaptive learning modes.

 

[nascarnation]

Adaptive learning attempts to predict how the transmissionmission should shift depending on the driner's power demand, TPS, ATF and coolant temp.

@clinebarger may have additional info on adaptive learning modes.

The Chrysler A604 (Ultradrive) was the pioneering fully electronic adaptive transmission (initial production 1989) that I'm aware of.
A fellow named Maurice Leising, a legendary powertrain engineer, was deeply involved in the design and his name shows up on a lot of the patents.
It was a very elegant design pretty much used today but with better sensors and actuators and more computer power.

 

[bighead2586]

Strongly considering Lubegard Red for my Chrysler TE62 which has hard shifting and stumbling on both accel/decel for a long time now. I’m 2 pan drops in so far and will do at least one more before adding the LG.

For whatever little it's worth I put Lubegard red in my high mileage 2011 RX 350 recently. This was on my 3rd drain and fill over a 6 month period. Very little change in the 1st two fluid changes but after the third (the one where I also added lubegard) I have noticed improved shifting via my butt dyno. The car shifted ok before the drain/fills but had a slight judder around 30mph that has basically disappeared.

 

[I<3oil]

Does this red Lubegard increase the viscosity? or just simply introduce esters as MolaKule stated? If its simply just cleaning wouldn't Valvoline Restore and Protect ATF be a big player since it has ULV compatibility?

Cleaning and slipperiness

 

[MolaKule]

Does this red Lubegard increase the viscosity? or just simply introduce esters as MolaKule stated? If its simply just cleaning wouldn't Valvoline Restore and Protect ATF be a big player since it has ULV compatibility?

LubeGard Red does not affect the bulk viscosity in the recommended dosage. It mostly introduces the cleaning esters and ups the anti-wear chemistry a smidgeon (a few PPM).

 

[4329]

Thank you all for your responses, as stated in previous posts in relation to reply from all ATF companies and having chosen to use Castrol Transmax, I set down to think about all information I have gathered.

With out detailed and supported evidence rather than opinion regarding how good or bad multi vehicle ATF or OEM ATF is I arrived at the following conclusion.

I purchased my car when new and only do low km in light traffic and no mountain work in temps ranging from -2 centigrade to 38 centigrade. The vehicle does not have issues at this point in time with transmission engagement or shifts.

Clearly the OEM fluid is fit for purpose at the CURRENT KM, so I will do spill and refills using OEM ATF. I deeply resent the rip off cost of OEM ATF but given that the OEM ATF will be replaced at every (80 km) I do not expect any issues caused by the ATF.

Having spoken to two transmission repair companies they use OEM or aftermarket ATF depending on customer requests and will provide the same warranty on their rebuilds, however they recommend multi vehicle ATF after a flush and only if the vehicle has very low mileage and has no existing issues, Thy claim transmissions that have not be serviced that a flush may cause issues. They also said that heat is the main cause of ATF breakdown and frequent changing of ATF and in some cases fitment of a transmission oil cooler will reduce the breakdown of the ATF regardless of what brand ATF is used.

 

[Pablo]

Thank you all for your responses, as stated in previous posts in relation to reply from all ATF companies and having chosen to use Castrol Transmax, I set down to think about all information I have gathered.

With out detailed and supported evidence rather than opinion regarding how good or bad multi vehicle ATF or OEM ATF is I arrived at the following conclusion.

I purchased my car when new and only do low km in light traffic and no mountain work in temps ranging from -2 centigrade to 38 centigrade. The vehicle does not have issues at this point in time with transmission engagement or shifts.

Clearly the OEM fluid is fit for purpose at the CURRENT KM, so I will do spill and refills using OEM ATF. I deeply resent the rip off cost of OEM ATF but given that the OEM ATF will be replaced at every (80 km) I do not expect any issues caused by the ATF.

Having spoken to two transmission repair companies they use OEM or aftermarket ATF depending on customer requests and will provide the same warranty on their rebuilds, however they recommend multi vehicle ATF after a flush and only if the vehicle has very low mileage and has no existing issues, Thy claim transmissions that have not be serviced that a flush may cause issues. They also said that heat is the main cause of ATF breakdown and frequent changing of ATF and in some cases fitment of a transmission oil cooler will reduce the breakdown of the ATF regardless of what brand ATF is used.

The only problem with the above is shops claiming a flush itself done correctly will cause an issue.

Not possible. Think about it. The transmission was near the problem already if fresh clean fluid exposed the problem.

 

[martinq]

Thank you all for your responses, as stated in previous posts in relation to reply from all ATF companies and having chosen to use Castrol Transmax, I set down to think about all information I have gathered.

With out detailed and supported evidence rather than opinion regarding how good or bad multi vehicle ATF or OEM ATF is I arrived at the following conclusion.

I purchased my car when new and only do low km in light traffic and no mountain work in temps ranging from -2 centigrade to 38 centigrade. The vehicle does not have issues at this point in time with transmission engagement or shifts.

Clearly the OEM fluid is fit for purpose at the CURRENT KM, so I will do spill and refills using OEM ATF. I deeply resent the rip off cost of OEM ATF but given that the OEM ATF will be replaced at every (80 km) I do not expect any issues caused by the ATF.

Having spoken to two transmission repair companies they use OEM or aftermarket ATF depending on customer requests and will provide the same warranty on their rebuilds, however they recommend multi vehicle ATF after a flush and only if the vehicle has very low mileage and has no existing issues, Thy claim transmissions that have not be serviced that a flush may cause issues. They also said that heat is the main cause of ATF breakdown and frequent changing of ATF and in some cases fitment of a transmission oil cooler will reduce the breakdown of the ATF regardless of what brand ATF is used.

Have you ever cleaned the magnet(s) in your transmission? Does your transmission have a removable pan? This is much more important than the type of fluid you are using. The magnets will remove magnetic material from the fluid, 24 hours a day, that will easily go through the mechanical filters. Magnets work best when they are clean and won't work at all once they are loaded.

 

[ctechbob]

Anecdotally, on the truck forums, it seems to help with the GM/Ford 10 speeds not grenading themselves. My dad's 2020 F150 is in the shop right now with 60k miles getting a replacement trans. I bought him a bottle of lubegard red so it's ready to go in once he gets the truck back. Been in the shop 3 weeks now.

I don't know if it has spread from there, but way back in 2020 I was the one on the 5th generation Ranger forum that was the first to try and later advocate for the use of Platinum in the 10R80's at the recommended dose.

Whatever it does, it manages to keep the valve bodies free and working properly for longer as opposed to just fluid changes with ULV.

 

[I<3oil]

I don't know if it has spread from there, but way back in 2020 I was the one on the 5th generation Ranger forum that was the first to try and later advocate for the use of Platinum in the 10R80's at the recommended dose.

Whatever it does, it manages to keep the valve bodies free and working properly for longer as opposed to just fluid changes with ULV.

Yep, that’s basically exactly what is posted on forums from other people.

 

[kschachn]

Now I understand the difference between 1.4 cst is little to nothing. Additive package is the only thing that would make sense.

Particularly when you’re going by typical values from a PDS.

 

[4329]

The only problem with the above is shops claiming a flush itself done correctly will cause an issue.

Not possible. Think about it. The transmission was near the problem already if fresh clean fluid exposed the problem.

Not following what you are on about. What is a correct flush, are you saying that a flush on an old or neglected transmission will not cause issues bearing in mind it may cause restrictions in the valve body and may only partly clean a transmission filter.

My transmission does not have any issues so changing the fluid will not expose any issues.