Quality Control - Domestic vs Japan

[buster]

The 4Runner, Land Cruiser and Lexus models are made in two Japanese plants known for their high quality.

https://www.motor1.com/news/799581/toyota-nissan-us-import-models-poor-quality/

"The notice on the Murano states (translated) that "this vehicle is manufactured to specifications intended for overseas markets and differs in quality standards applied to vehicles destined for the Japanese domestic market."

Toyota has a similar warning on the Tundra and Highlander, stating that the paint finishes are "designed for overseas markets" and that customers may notice thin paint, color variations, polishing marks, and dents.

 

[JohnnyJohnson]

Because American QC for the most part is bottom line driven.

 

[KGMtech]

I think the OEM's are using a convenient excuse to assign blame, as required, for a political requirement to source product from other areas.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I had to give a New Japanese subaru impreza back last year due to a few issue, the killer being a moderate drivetrain vibration that the service dept couldnt fix - but I only gave them one chance. Surprising since this unit had the optional 16"cast aluminum wheel package not steelies and it usually a wheel/tire problem. It was shod with cheap Firestones. Adding to the displeasure, something was not quite right with the CVT programming also the steering was too imprecise.

Conversely my Wife's past two Japanese Crosstreks were problem free minus a RF CV joint at 61K. S.o.A thankfully absorbed 1/2 the cost after a call to a Customer advocate.

With the earlier Indiana built Impreza's you had to drive 3 or 4 to find a good one. I know I tried. Stopped at three - I bet the fourth would have been a charm - but we ran out of MT base model inventory on the dealer lot to choose from

 

[buster]

I think it's also their culture. They train their techs to learn to feel the panel gaps. More pride.

 

[97prizm]

The 4Runner, Land Cruiser and Lexus models are made in two Japanese plants known for their high quality.

https://www.motor1.com/news/799581/toyota-nissan-us-import-models-poor-quality/

"The notice on the Murano states (translated) that "this vehicle is manufactured to specifications intended for overseas markets and differs in quality standards applied to vehicles destined for the Japanese domestic market."

Toyota has a similar warning on the Tundra and Highlander, stating that the paint finishes are "designed for overseas markets" and that customers may notice thin paint, color variations, polishing marks, and dents.

View attachment 344553

This rubs me the wrong way. Boy Toyota has taken a step backwards. When I sold cars at a Lexus dealership back in 2016 we had the occasional customer that had to have a Japanese manufacturered RX350. I put two identical RX350s side by side, one made in Ontario one in Japan. The paint, fit and finish, etc were identical. Toyota even uses the same manufacturing equipment in both locations as to not have and differences. Have directors and management become this bad?

 

[buster]

This rubs me the wrong way. Boy Toyota has taken a step backwards. When I sold cars at a Lexus dealership back in 2016 we had the occasional customer that had to have a Japanese manufacturered RX350. I put two identical RX350s side by side, one made in Ontario one in Japan. The paint, fit and finish, etc were identical. Toyota even uses the same manufacturing equipment in both locations as to not have and differences. Have directors and management become this bad?

I really don't know honestly. We've always heard about this but I've never seen data on it. However, that Japanese Toyota guy David said the two plants in Japan do in fact have the highest quality of any plants in the world.

 

[MountainManDan]

We've Gone through 2 American Made Refrigerators with Worst Design Faults & Issues to Point of Loosing
$285 Bucks worth of Food .. from one that Died while away for 7 days with ice maker turned off ..

P Poor Insulation to P Poor Ice Makers & Parts -1 Unit Ice Maker in Back Wall Sweated so Much entire Back Refrigerator Rusted Out
4 Yrs Old - Built like Crap ..

I Guess We had spent $2K instead of $1700 - might have gotten Better Unit = Maybe this was 2016 so On 3rd Refrigerator since 2022
Broke Out Cash $3K for Much Better Bosch .. Prior to all this Non-sense Unit Last 20yrs - We Left with Sold Home ..
During those 20yrs we just didn't realized how Bad Quality had gotten ..

Because American QC for the most part is bottom line driven.

I think the OEM's are using a convenient excuse to assign blame, as required, for a political requirement to source product from other areas.

Yes They are Today - Bottom Computer Line $ to Penny On Bottom_Line . & Poor Trained Inspectors .

Mostly ~ Plus many Manufactures Stream-Lining Inspection with ISO 9000, 10,000 , 14000
They all Through Math & machines are so Good Owners & Manufactures could just Lay Off 100's of Good Inspectors
Using Statistical Prediction & Math

( W R O N G )

 

[97prizm]

Well my parents Kentucky made whirlpool lasted 30 years. Then they moved to Mexico and I heard India for manufacturing. They reopened a factory in Ohio from what I've read.

 

[IndyIan]

The 4Runner, Land Cruiser and Lexus models are made in two Japanese plants known for their high quality.

https://www.motor1.com/news/799581/toyota-nissan-us-import-models-poor-quality/

"The notice on the Murano states (translated) that "this vehicle is manufactured to specifications intended for overseas markets and differs in quality standards applied to vehicles destined for the Japanese domestic market."

Toyota has a similar warning on the Tundra and Highlander, stating that the paint finishes are "designed for overseas markets" and that customers may notice thin paint, color variations, polishing marks, and dents.

View attachment 344553

I think in general, the US and Canada market will accept lower quality, in exchange for bigger or flashier, or the perception of luxury...

There are quite a few cars down graded or specifically built for this market, that manufactures won't sell Japan or Europe.

 

[MountainManDan]

Yes Agree , but Forums have gotten Smarter & Collective of We the People starting to Catch on to all Bull ..

There are at Least 2 Class Action Suites - I Know Of . .

Several Times Over Year - some Direct Questions come out of No where from Folks that only been on few Forums for 1 week
Those Mostly New Lawyers Looking for Info on Cases or Their Paralegals searching - now - may find what They need with AI . .

Looking at Ford , GM , Chevy , Volvo , Audi , VW - all - Had Very Troubled Times - some of Which brought on Much Higher Cost
Cut Backs Hurt in many Area's . .

Then Manufacturing - just thought We Dump ~ Inspectors & Inspection sections & let Rejects Fall where they may - If Our Tails get in
Binder We'll Just have do ~ Recall & Blame it on Vendor ~

 

[MountainManDan]

SOME TIMES it's Inside Damages being Done by Corp's to Allow them get Leg Up or More Market Share & gain Control over Market..

I really don't know honestly. We've always heard about this but I've never seen data on it. However, that Japanese Toyota guy David said the two plants in Japan do in fact have the highest quality of any plants in the world.

I don't see How Ford & GM had so many Issues with 10 speed Transmission after 2 yrs of developed & Testing ..
then Have Big Recalls where Vehicles traveling 60-80 Mph down Highway just Locking Up ..

Meanwhile Honda come out with 10X in Accord & Mini Van is also Rated for 3000 Towing or more ..
1000 in Accord & Acura - do to less Rear Weight & Frame , but Mostly Brakes . . only had 1% If that ..
Those were all replaced - Built New Plant in GA .. ( Not a Fan ) CVT Transmissions ..

A Few Makers are having Losses Center Stacks - Communications - & - Engines from Too Much Heat
Cats are Bolted Directly to Back End of Turbo's - then - Drop Out in 90 Degree Turns for Exhaust Runs ..

Even Designed & Optioned for Special Spark Plugs - which due to heat had 2 yrs Failed Blown Ground Straps & Cracked
Insulators - Piece through % of Motors .. ( Much of this Made Public Weary of Buying New )

In some Small sectors - seeing come back with Items Built to Last 75 yrs

Electrical Vehicles have 340-455 Less Machined Items made on Lathes & Mills & Plastic Injection Molds
Some Parts very Expensive & Manufacturing Intense - costing way More .. Yet Electrical Vehicles Cost $$$$ More . .

Only Few Models Bring Leading Cutting Edge Design

 

[Pablo]

Repost

Post in thread 'Toyota And Nissan Warn Japanese Buyers Their US-Built Cars May Have Panel Gaps'

Friday at 7:59 PM

Sad

It’s typical Japanese racism

The world ignores it frankly

• Pablo

• 
• 
• 

 

[BHopkins]

This rubs me the wrong way. Boy Toyota has taken a step backwards. When I sold cars at a Lexus dealership back in 2016 we had the occasional customer that had to have a Japanese manufacturered RX350. I put two identical RX350s side by side, one made in Ontario one in Japan. The paint, fit and finish, etc were identical. Toyota even uses the same manufacturing equipment in both locations as to not have and differences. Have directors and management become this bad?

Agreed, 100%. Totally rubs me the wrong way. Having worked for an automotive supplier that adopted the Toyota Production System (TPS), and along with it TQMS (Toyota Quality Management System) back in 1995, and even made significant improvements to it over the years. Toyota is very proud of TPS and TQMS. They are absolutely over the top about it being implemented, strictly adhered to, in all their plants worldwide.

Toyota is huge on using a discipline where lessons learned at one facility are shared and implemented between all facilities. They are insistent that all plants measure up to the same quality expectations, regardless if the facility is in Japan or Mexico or the USA.

So to hear claims that they are admitting to a double standard just blows my mind. This isn't the Toyota that I was familiar with before I retired.

I don't see How Ford & GM had so many Issues with 10 speed Transmission after 2 yrs of developed & Testing ..
then Have Big Recalls where Vehicles traveling 60-80 Mph down Highway just Locking Up ..

Meanwhile Honda come out with 10X in Accord & Mini Van is also Rated for 3000 Towing or more ..
1000 in Accord & Acura - do to less Rear Weight & Frame , but Mostly Brakes . . only had 1% If that ..
Those were all replaced - Built New Plant in GA .. ( Not a Fan ) CVT Transmissions ..

Few Makers are having Losses Center Stacks - Communications - & - Engines from Too Much Heat
Cats are Bolted Directly to Back End of Turbo's - then - Drop Out in 90 Degree Turns for Exhaust Runs ..

Even Designed & Optioned for Special Spark Plugs - which due to heat had 2 yrs Failed Blown Ground Straps & Cracked
Insulators - Piece through % of Motors .. ( Much of this Made Public Weary of Buying New )

Perhaps you have a short memory, or rather never knew about the transmission and torque converter issues that plagued the Honda Odyssey for several years. The automotive news was full of articles sharing customer horror stories, reporting that Honda did not take care of many customers, leaving them with repair bills in the thousands of dollars.

Then the 9 speed transmission issues ended up resulting in a class action lawsuit against Honda.

Yes, GM and Ford has had their issues. But Honda is very far from a perfect record for transmissions.

 

[Hall]

They reopened a factory in Ohio from what I've read.

If you're referring to washer/dryers, the plant in NW Ohio is just an assembly plant, i.e. lots of sheet metal screws and screw guns.

 

[97prizm]

If you're referring to washer/dryers, the plant in NW Ohio is just an assembly plant, i.e. lots of sheet metal screws and screw guns.

About a year ago GE moved two home appliance lines out of China back to Louisville KY adding 800 jobs.

 

[JeffKeryk]

I think it's also their culture. They train their techs to learn to feel the panel gaps. More pride.

The pride in whatever the Japanese do was one of the standouts from our recent trip to Tokya and Kyoto. Discipline.

 

[UncleDave]

The pride in whatever the Japanese do was one of the standouts from our recent trip to Tokya and Kyoto. Discipline.

service type jobs, retail, food, transportation, clerks, interactions are totally different.

They want to be there doing what they are doing, and they want you to enjoy whatever it is they are doing for you.

People in the service business here often feel trapped in low wage and their attitudes and feeling are noticeable.
They dont like their jobs, and dont want to be doing what they are doing and you can feel it.

 

[97prizm]

The pride in whatever the Japanese do was one of the standouts from our recent trip to Tokya and Kyoto. Discipline.

It's a cultural thing. Most Americans wouldn't tolerate Japanese management or work culture. It has its tradeoffs. One youtuber who is American moved to Japan to teach. She found higher pay and better overall schedule. She gave the first company two weeks notice. They told her she dishonored and shamed the company and its employees.

 

[97prizm]

service type jobs, retail, food, transportation, clerks, interactions are totally different.

They want to be there doing what they are doing, and they want you to enjoy whatever it is they are doing for you.

People in the service business here often feel trapped in low wage and their attitudes and feeling are noticeable.
They dont like their jobs, and dont want to be doing what they are doing and you can feel it.

Yeah, I'm looking to run as fast as I can from hospital security. Inept management and favoritism (I think there's age discrimination as well). When half of the ED nurses have left the writing is on the wall.