Quaker State Euro 5W-40 not GTL(?)

[jeremy94]

Shell’s MSDS site isn’t very clear. It often lists two or more SDS’s for the same variety of oil. Quaker State Euro 5W-40 is no exception. There’s two SDS’s, one which shows GTL and one that shows regular group iii. I can’t figure out how to determine which one is correct. Or maybe they use both blends randomly. Anyway, wanted to put that out here to see if anyone has any insight/answers.

I am NOT bashing QS Euro, I think it is an excellent oil and would recommend (and use in my own cars) regardless if it’s GTL or not.

GTL SDS
Group iii SDS

Disclaimers,
- MSDS is not a recipe
- Final oil blend including additives is what really matters
- These are US sheets, things might be different in other regions

 

[Sandstorm]

This has been discussed in depth in the past. @kschachn has made many posts about this subject. Check the archives

 

[edhackett]

Shell’s MSDS site isn’t very clear. It often lists two or more SDS’s for the same variety of oil. Quaker State Euro 5W-40 is no exception. There’s two SDS’s, one which shows GTL and one that shows regular group iii. I can’t figure out how to determine which one is correct. Or maybe they use both blends randomly. Anyway, wanted to put that out here to see if anyone has any insight/answers.

I am NOT bashing QS Euro, I think it is an excellent oil and would recommend (and use in my own cars) regardless if it’s GTL or not.

GTL SDS
Group iii SDS

Disclaimers,
- MSDS is not a recipe
- Final oil blend including additives is what really matters
- These are US sheets, things might be different in other regions

The "GTL" SDS is the most current with a 5/13/24 revision date.

The "Group iii" SDS has a revision date of 10/28/21. How did you conclude that it shows regular group III? The SDS states: Interchangeable low viscosity base oil (<20,5 cSt @40°C)* with no CAS# assigned.

* contains one or more of the following CAS-numbers: 64742-53-6, 64742-54-7, 64742-55-8, 64742-56-9, 64742-65-0, 68037-01-4, 72623-86-0, 72623-87-1, 8042-47-5, 848301-69-9(GTL), 68649-12-7, 151006-60-9, 163149-28-8, 64741-88-4.

There is nothing in the earlier SDS that precludes the use of 100% GTL base oil. MSDS is not a recipe.

Ed

 

[Method]

This has been discussed in depth in the past. @kschachn has made many posts about this subject. Check the archives

What's the quick and dirty of that? QS isn't GTL?

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Shell’s MSDS site isn’t very clear. It often lists two or more SDS’s for the same variety of oil. Quaker State Euro 5W-40 is no exception. There’s two SDS’s, one which shows GTL and one that shows regular group iii. I can’t figure out how to determine which one is correct. Or maybe they use both blends randomly. Anyway, wanted to put that out here to see if anyone has any insight/answers.

I am NOT bashing QS Euro, I think it is an excellent oil and would recommend (and use in my own cars) regardless if it’s GTL or not.

GTL SDS
Group iii SDS

Disclaimers,
- MSDS is not a recipe
- Final oil blend including additives is what really matters
- These are US sheets, things might be different in other regions

Per Shell it is NOT gtl but gr3.

 

[jeremy94]

The "GTL" SDS is the most current with a 5/13/24 revision date.

The "Group iii" SDS has a revision date of 10/28/21. How did you conclude that it shows regular group III? The SDS states: Interchangeable low viscosity base oil (<20,5 cSt @40°C)* with no CAS# assigned.

* contains one or more of the following CAS-numbers: 64742-53-6, 64742-54-7, 64742-55-8, 64742-56-9, 64742-65-0, 68037-01-4, 72623-86-0, 72623-87-1, 8042-47-5, 848301-69-9(GTL), 68649-12-7, 151006-60-9, 163149-28-8, 64741-88-4.

There is nothing in the earlier SDS that precludes the use of 100% GTL base oil. MSDS is not a recipe.

Ed

Thanks for your insights. I assumed it was group iii because of where it says “oil mist, mineral.” It also says “Distillates (petroleum), solvent-dewaxed heavy paraffinic” under “Pennsylvania right to know.”

Good information on the CAS numbers, I was not familiar with those.

 

[jeremy94]

Per Shell it is NOT gtl but gr3

Do you have a source for this?

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Do you have a source for this?

Shell. This what they told me.

 

[chris719]

If anyone really cares that much if their base oil is GTL or not they can just buy PP Euro for a couple bucks more.

 

[edhackett]

Thanks for your insights. I assumed it was group iii because of where it says “oil mist, mineral.” It also says “Distillates (petroleum), solvent-dewaxed heavy paraffinic” under “Pennsylvania right to know.”

The heath hazards, exposure limits, and treatment are the same for any hydrocarbon oil. There's no need to differentiate group numbers. When looking up emergency information in an emergency, simpler is better. "Mineral oil" will give you all you need to know.

Ed

 

[chris719]

The heath hazards, exposure limits, and treatment are the same for any hydrocarbon oil. There's no need to differentiate group numbers. When looking up emergency information in an emergency, simpler is better. "Mineral oil" will give you all you need to know.

Ed

Someone drinks motor oil, goes to the hospital, doctor is relieved because the base stock was POE and PAO .

 

[kschachn]

Per Shell it is NOT gtl but gr3.

GTL is a hydrocracked Group III base stock. Base stock groups I, II and III are not based on production method (in fact that’s precluded) but by performance.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

GTL is a hydrocracked Group III base stock. Base stock groups I, II and III are not based on production method (in fact that’s precluded) but by performance.

Many within the industry suggest GTL should be classified as GR3+ due to its high VI. No a big deal either way.

 

[kschachn]

Many within the industry suggest GTL should be classified as GR3+ due to its high VI. No a big deal either way.

Yes for marketing purposes.

 

[Snagglefoot]

GTL is a hydrocracked Group III base stock. Base stock groups I, II and III are not based on production method (in fact that’s precluded) but by performance.

Maybe some clarification? Group III base stock can come from synthetic base stocks, but not necessarily GTL. GTL originates from natural gas to make Group III base stock. Is this not correct?

 

[kschachn]

Maybe some clarification? Group III base stock can come from synthetic base stocks, but not necessarily GTL. GTL originates from natural gas to make Group III base stock. Is this not correct?

View attachment 238551

I’m not sure what you’re asking? If you look at API Annex E which defines the Group designations that gives the criteria for each of them. What’s written above is correct as far as it goes but there are other Group III base stocks that have high VI and the other desirable benefits as GTL derived stock. It just may be easier to get there and require less intensive hydrocracking. But in the end it’s the material properties that matter not the method of synthesis.

No doubt it is a good material. I was just responding to the statement “Per Shell it is NOT gtl but gr3” which isn’t factual as written.

 

[Snagglefoot]

I’m not sure what you’re asking? If you look at API Annex E which defines the Group designations that gives the criteria for each of them. What’s written above is correct as far as it goes but there are other Group III base stocks that have high VI and the other desirable benefits as GTL derived stock. It just may be easier to get there and require less intensive hydrocracking. But in the end it’s the material properties that matter not the method of synthesis.

No doubt it is a good material. I was just responding to the statement “Per Shell it is NOT gtl but gr3” which isn’t factual as written.

Just semantics. “ GTL is a hydro cracked group III base stock that is derived from natural gas”.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Yes for marketing purposes.

I guess.
Infineum and Lubrizol make the distinction in their materials.

GTL is definitely in the middle of Gr3/4. Both use a gas to create the final product. Natgas (GTL) or ethylene gas derived from Natgas (PAO) but they use different processes.

GTL in some grades is a direct substitute for PAO due to having similar performance characteristics.

 

[kschachn]

GTL is definitely in the middle of Gr3/4. Both use a gas to create the final product. Natgas (GTL) or ethylene gas derived from Natgas (PAO) but they use different processes.

Not really. The definition of Group IV is entirely dependent on chemical makeup. Not so with Groups I, II and III. Group IV interchange only requires similar material properties as the PAO being replaced. There is no base requirement other than composition.

Being synthesized from a gas is not required anywhere.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Not really. The definition of Group IV is entirely dependent on chemical makeup. Not so with Groups I, II and III. Group IV interchange only requires similar material properties as the PAO being replaced. There is no base requirement other than composition.

Being synthesized from a gas is not required anywhere.

Sure but from a performance perspective GTL has more in common with PAO than Gr3 made from crude oil.