The VG33 ('00 Xterra in my case) is certainly not economical nor powerful but I would never call it crude and noisy.
Possible Sludge
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Originally Posted By: 00Crew
Originally Posted By: Anies
Don't bother with ARX, use MMO if you want to do cleaning. The 3.3L is not a sludger, its just poor maintenance on the previous owners part.
Make sure you change the PCV valve on 3.3L @ 92k its due and its cheap insurance($10 at Nissan). It's super easy to replace, run some MMO in the engine for a full OCI(use 1/2 a quart) w 3 quarts of your preferred oil, run it for 3k miles. Use a decarbonizing agent like Seafoam through the brake booster(do it at night in an empty parking lot). Clean out lots of the gunk, do this towards the end of the OCI.
The Xterra/Nissan 3.3L takes a beating and even with lots of neglect can be cleaned up very quick and easy. Also, do the timing belt now or within the next few thousand miles if you haven't, longest is 105k MAX. In the year I had my 04 Xterra w/ 3.3L VG33E I learned a lot from the guys on ClubXterra and ClubFrontier, and the one important thing was the engines are indestructible.
I like the 3.3s. My dad has an 04 Frontier with th 3.3. and my mom has a 2000 Pathfinder with the 3.3. I will be checking their fill holes also. And as far as the timing belt, I will be doing that soon, wish me luck
I tried to get a good fill hole picture, but the tube is just too long and I can't get a good picture, there will deff be some pictures when the valve covers come off.
I do have a question though, I am running 10w30 now, but I was planning to switch to 5w30, will the 5w30 and MMO be ok, or will that make the oil too thin?
Also, the oil that the PO labeled as out in the truck the last time was 10w40, could this have had anything to do with the sludge? I am thinking he did this to try and stop or slow the oil leak.
Will an oil analysis show any problems from the sludge? I have the B Labs free shipping container I was going to use on my Tundra but never got around to it.
Thanks for all of the replies guys!
The 3.3L is specced 30weight. You can run anything between 0w30 through 10w30(summer). 5w30 is fine for year round use, I've used the 0w30 and 5w30 with no consequence.
A 40weight in the 3.3L will be a dramatic effect in its output, the engine depending on year makes anywhere between 165-180hp(N/A) and 210hp(S/C). The 40weight oil will give you a sluggish response and make the gas mileage worse than it already is for the trucks.
A Georgia spring/summer is a good bet with 10w30, come fall/winter 5w30 is perfect giving you a slight improvement in cold cranking, that's about it.
Another thing with the 3.3L, the fill hole gives you a glimpse of a small area, you can't really discern whats going on in there like other cars. 9 times out of 10 removing the valve covers will show the opposite of what you expect. Most of the rear portions in most tear downs shown regardless of oil type show heavy varnish(dark brown) in the back and moving forward to the engine its a lighter tan and then clean.
Originally Posted By: Anies
Don't bother with ARX, use MMO if you want to do cleaning. The 3.3L is not a sludger, its just poor maintenance on the previous owners part.
Make sure you change the PCV valve on 3.3L @ 92k its due and its cheap insurance($10 at Nissan). It's super easy to replace, run some MMO in the engine for a full OCI(use 1/2 a quart) w 3 quarts of your preferred oil, run it for 3k miles. Use a decarbonizing agent like Seafoam through the brake booster(do it at night in an empty parking lot). Clean out lots of the gunk, do this towards the end of the OCI.
The Xterra/Nissan 3.3L takes a beating and even with lots of neglect can be cleaned up very quick and easy. Also, do the timing belt now or within the next few thousand miles if you haven't, longest is 105k MAX. In the year I had my 04 Xterra w/ 3.3L VG33E I learned a lot from the guys on ClubXterra and ClubFrontier, and the one important thing was the engines are indestructible.
I like the 3.3s. My dad has an 04 Frontier with th 3.3. and my mom has a 2000 Pathfinder with the 3.3. I will be checking their fill holes also. And as far as the timing belt, I will be doing that soon, wish me luck
I tried to get a good fill hole picture, but the tube is just too long and I can't get a good picture, there will deff be some pictures when the valve covers come off.
I do have a question though, I am running 10w30 now, but I was planning to switch to 5w30, will the 5w30 and MMO be ok, or will that make the oil too thin?
Also, the oil that the PO labeled as out in the truck the last time was 10w40, could this have had anything to do with the sludge? I am thinking he did this to try and stop or slow the oil leak.
Will an oil analysis show any problems from the sludge? I have the B Labs free shipping container I was going to use on my Tundra but never got around to it.
Thanks for all of the replies guys!
The 3.3L is specced 30weight. You can run anything between 0w30 through 10w30(summer). 5w30 is fine for year round use, I've used the 0w30 and 5w30 with no consequence.
A 40weight in the 3.3L will be a dramatic effect in its output, the engine depending on year makes anywhere between 165-180hp(N/A) and 210hp(S/C). The 40weight oil will give you a sluggish response and make the gas mileage worse than it already is for the trucks.
A Georgia spring/summer is a good bet with 10w30, come fall/winter 5w30 is perfect giving you a slight improvement in cold cranking, that's about it.
Another thing with the 3.3L, the fill hole gives you a glimpse of a small area, you can't really discern whats going on in there like other cars. 9 times out of 10 removing the valve covers will show the opposite of what you expect. Most of the rear portions in most tear downs shown regardless of oil type show heavy varnish(dark brown) in the back and moving forward to the engine its a lighter tan and then clean.
Originally Posted By: Brons2
Originally Posted By: 00Crew
I like the 3.3s. My dad has an 04 Frontier with th 3.3. and my mom has a 2000 Pathfinder with the 3.3.
I don't. The VG33 is a pig compared to the later VQ motors, it has less power with worse fuel economy, and is crude and noisy. I owned a 98 Pathfinder with the VG33.
It's a pig yes, but the 3.3L is dependable/reliable. The VQ engines are finnicky. Yes they offer more power output and better fuel economy but the Frontier/Xterra wasn't build with that in mind(the 1st gens). The 1st Gens were build for the people who liked to go outdoors and really rough it. Stock the 1st gen Xterra/Frontiers are more capable than the 2nd gen Xterra/Frontiers with the VQ motors.
Totally different suspension, gearing. The rear ends are bullet proof, whereas the 2nd gens they are known to fail if pushed to hard(rock crawling etc). On frame design, the last of the old school truck/suv generation gives it more ability to withstand flex than any IFS/IS equipped vehicle before it gets hosed.
The only things to look out for in the 1st Gen Xterra/Frontiers are the timing belt at 90-100k miles, the steering gear box if you offroad like crazy, centerlink from abusive offroading and removing the rear sway bar as it was known to damage aftermarket shocks.
Speaking of shocks you will want to dump your Nissan OEM shocks. Chances are they are original and are known to be dead at 20k miles(mine were shot at 32k). Invest in a good pair of Bilstein Shocks and remove that rear sway bar. The shocks are cake to install and keep your wheels planted on the ground much better.
Scour the Xterra/Frontier forums for a Steering Stabilizer as well, helps with [censored] road conditions(potholes).
Originally Posted By: 00Crew
I like the 3.3s. My dad has an 04 Frontier with th 3.3. and my mom has a 2000 Pathfinder with the 3.3.
I don't. The VG33 is a pig compared to the later VQ motors, it has less power with worse fuel economy, and is crude and noisy. I owned a 98 Pathfinder with the VG33.
It's a pig yes, but the 3.3L is dependable/reliable. The VQ engines are finnicky. Yes they offer more power output and better fuel economy but the Frontier/Xterra wasn't build with that in mind(the 1st gens). The 1st Gens were build for the people who liked to go outdoors and really rough it. Stock the 1st gen Xterra/Frontiers are more capable than the 2nd gen Xterra/Frontiers with the VQ motors.
Totally different suspension, gearing. The rear ends are bullet proof, whereas the 2nd gens they are known to fail if pushed to hard(rock crawling etc). On frame design, the last of the old school truck/suv generation gives it more ability to withstand flex than any IFS/IS equipped vehicle before it gets hosed.
The only things to look out for in the 1st Gen Xterra/Frontiers are the timing belt at 90-100k miles, the steering gear box if you offroad like crazy, centerlink from abusive offroading and removing the rear sway bar as it was known to damage aftermarket shocks.
Speaking of shocks you will want to dump your Nissan OEM shocks. Chances are they are original and are known to be dead at 20k miles(mine were shot at 32k). Invest in a good pair of Bilstein Shocks and remove that rear sway bar. The shocks are cake to install and keep your wheels planted on the ground much better.
Scour the Xterra/Frontier forums for a Steering Stabilizer as well, helps with [censored] road conditions(potholes).
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Originally Posted By: 00Crew
Well, to be clear, since the 3.3 only holds 3.5 quarts, would it be safer to just run 3/4 quart of MMO instead of a full quart?
Like said above, I will know what I am in for in a few weeks (would do it sooner, but I want to be able to dedicate a whole weekend to do it since the intake plenum has to be removed for the passenger side) when I remove the valve covers.
Hopefully the spot is just below the fill hole, but i doubt it.
Yes - if your sump is only 3.5 quarts, use 24 oz (3/4 quart) of MMO and 2.75 quarts of oil for the cleanup period (2 OCIs).
After cleanup, it will just be easier to use 3 qts oil and 1/2 qt MMO for each subsequent OCI.
This will keep things clean in an engine known for sludging if not properly maintained.
Well, to be clear, since the 3.3 only holds 3.5 quarts, would it be safer to just run 3/4 quart of MMO instead of a full quart?
Like said above, I will know what I am in for in a few weeks (would do it sooner, but I want to be able to dedicate a whole weekend to do it since the intake plenum has to be removed for the passenger side) when I remove the valve covers.
Hopefully the spot is just below the fill hole, but i doubt it.
Yes - if your sump is only 3.5 quarts, use 24 oz (3/4 quart) of MMO and 2.75 quarts of oil for the cleanup period (2 OCIs).
After cleanup, it will just be easier to use 3 qts oil and 1/2 qt MMO for each subsequent OCI.
This will keep things clean in an engine known for sludging if not properly maintained.
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Ok, looked at my dad's 2004 Frontier with the 3.3 with 68,000 miles, and it looks just like mine.
Also looked at my moms 2000 Pathfinder with the 3.3. There are some little differences between this engine and the one in the Frontier. Her fill hole is more toward the middle of the valve cover, and hers looks clean as can be. She has 100,000 miles with CHEAP oil and filters, and sometimes lengthy oil changes.
HMMMM
Also looked at my moms 2000 Pathfinder with the 3.3. There are some little differences between this engine and the one in the Frontier. Her fill hole is more toward the middle of the valve cover, and hers looks clean as can be. She has 100,000 miles with CHEAP oil and filters, and sometimes lengthy oil changes.
HMMMM
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Stick with the PYB and run 1/2 qt MMO for 1000 miles, change oil with 1 full qt of MMO and rest PYB - run normal OCI, repeat.
Some will say to only do this until clean, but I use PYB with a full qt MMO substitution for every OCI and am very pleased. When I started this on my older vehicle (74k miles at the time, 92k now), it took the first 1000 mile run plus the full OCI (5k) to get it clean with maybe a little more cleaning the 2nd full OCI.
Now it just keeps it that way, with some additional EP additives for additional protection (TCP) along the way.
Very poor advice. Thinning lubrication to that level will cause engine wear.
Stick with the PYB and run 1/2 qt MMO for 1000 miles, change oil with 1 full qt of MMO and rest PYB - run normal OCI, repeat.
Some will say to only do this until clean, but I use PYB with a full qt MMO substitution for every OCI and am very pleased. When I started this on my older vehicle (74k miles at the time, 92k now), it took the first 1000 mile run plus the full OCI (5k) to get it clean with maybe a little more cleaning the 2nd full OCI.
Now it just keeps it that way, with some additional EP additives for additional protection (TCP) along the way.
Very poor advice. Thinning lubrication to that level will cause engine wear.
Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Stick with the PYB and run 1/2 qt MMO for 1000 miles, change oil with 1 full qt of MMO and rest PYB - run normal OCI, repeat.
Some will say to only do this until clean, but I use PYB with a full qt MMO substitution for every OCI and am very pleased. When I started this on my older vehicle (74k miles at the time, 92k now), it took the first 1000 mile run plus the full OCI (5k) to get it clean with maybe a little more cleaning the 2nd full OCI.
Now it just keeps it that way, with some additional EP additives for additional protection (TCP) along the way.
Very poor advice. Thinning lubrication to that level will cause engine wear.
Maybe you should look at this UOA and the many on here - MMO will not cause additional wear and in many cases improves wear numbers. Thus why I use a full quart substitution with every OCI.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/rotella-t-synthetic-5w40-5070-mi-2003-deville.129007/
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Stick with the PYB and run 1/2 qt MMO for 1000 miles, change oil with 1 full qt of MMO and rest PYB - run normal OCI, repeat.
Some will say to only do this until clean, but I use PYB with a full qt MMO substitution for every OCI and am very pleased. When I started this on my older vehicle (74k miles at the time, 92k now), it took the first 1000 mile run plus the full OCI (5k) to get it clean with maybe a little more cleaning the 2nd full OCI.
Now it just keeps it that way, with some additional EP additives for additional protection (TCP) along the way.
Very poor advice. Thinning lubrication to that level will cause engine wear.
Maybe you should look at this UOA and the many on here - MMO will not cause additional wear and in many cases improves wear numbers. Thus why I use a full quart substitution with every OCI.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/rotella-t-synthetic-5w40-5070-mi-2003-deville.129007/
Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Stick with the PYB and run 1/2 qt MMO for 1000 miles, change oil with 1 full qt of MMO and rest PYB - run normal OCI, repeat.
Some will say to only do this until clean, but I use PYB with a full qt MMO substitution for every OCI and am very pleased. When I started this on my older vehicle (74k miles at the time, 92k now), it took the first 1000 mile run plus the full OCI (5k) to get it clean with maybe a little more cleaning the 2nd full OCI.
Now it just keeps it that way, with some additional EP additives for additional protection (TCP) along the way.
Very poor advice. Thinning lubrication to that level will cause engine wear.
Also not that I adjusted the recommendation in a later post when I realized it was only a 3.5 qt sump.
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Stick with the PYB and run 1/2 qt MMO for 1000 miles, change oil with 1 full qt of MMO and rest PYB - run normal OCI, repeat.
Some will say to only do this until clean, but I use PYB with a full qt MMO substitution for every OCI and am very pleased. When I started this on my older vehicle (74k miles at the time, 92k now), it took the first 1000 mile run plus the full OCI (5k) to get it clean with maybe a little more cleaning the 2nd full OCI.
Now it just keeps it that way, with some additional EP additives for additional protection (TCP) along the way.
Very poor advice. Thinning lubrication to that level will cause engine wear.
Also not that I adjusted the recommendation in a later post when I realized it was only a 3.5 qt sump.
I wouldnt worry about it too much as long as it runs well. Just do some short OCI's with MMO/Seafoam etc and it should clean it out "good enough".
Ok guys, I hope you are all sitting down.
Below is what I found when changing the valve cover gaskets:
I almost wanted to cry!
Here is after the cleaning:
This is the passenger the side, the driver was just as bad. We cleaner her out as best we could and put her back togethor. Changed the oil and I took her around the block. She ran great, but when pulling back in the driveway the oil light cam on, so I shut her down. Changed the oil again, it was already dark and the filter dirty. Also took a plug out that was below the oil sending unit and pulled out some gunk that made its way down there. All I know to do now is remove the oil pan and clean that up, but mine is sandwhiched in there pretty good, so I don't feel confident in removing it, and shops around here want $200 to take it off and clean the pan and pump intake. Should I go this route or just keep changing the filters every week or so for a while. Poor truck, I just don't know how long she will last, as I don't know how the rest of it looks.
I replaced the PCV Valve, Valve Cover Gaskets, Plenum Gasket, and spark plugs whil in there.
Below is what I found when changing the valve cover gaskets:
I almost wanted to cry!
Here is after the cleaning:
This is the passenger the side, the driver was just as bad. We cleaner her out as best we could and put her back togethor. Changed the oil and I took her around the block. She ran great, but when pulling back in the driveway the oil light cam on, so I shut her down. Changed the oil again, it was already dark and the filter dirty. Also took a plug out that was below the oil sending unit and pulled out some gunk that made its way down there. All I know to do now is remove the oil pan and clean that up, but mine is sandwhiched in there pretty good, so I don't feel confident in removing it, and shops around here want $200 to take it off and clean the pan and pump intake. Should I go this route or just keep changing the filters every week or so for a while. Poor truck, I just don't know how long she will last, as I don't know how the rest of it looks.
I replaced the PCV Valve, Valve Cover Gaskets, Plenum Gasket, and spark plugs whil in there.
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I`d be curious to know what kind`ve oil was used.
Me too, or lack of. I haven't had the truck but 3 months or so. The PCV valve didn't look too bad, it wasn't completely stuck, but the vents in the top of the valve cover are a different story, you couldn't even see them. I forgot to take a before and after of those!
I will NEVER buy a used car without checking the filler hole again, never thought about it until I bought this one and joined this site.
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I bet your truck will be fine. I`ve known several people who`ve owned those,never took care of them,pounded on them,and they just keep on running forever.
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Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I bet your truck will be fine. I`ve known several people who`ve owned those,never took care of them,pounded on them,and they just keep on running forever.
Thats it though, if I would have left it alone, it would probably run forever, but now that I messed with it, she will probably go downhill fast.
I am just not sure that all loose crud in the pan will actually make it to the filter
I bet your truck will be fine. I`ve known several people who`ve owned those,never took care of them,pounded on them,and they just keep on running forever.
Thats it though, if I would have left it alone, it would probably run forever, but now that I messed with it, she will probably go downhill fast.
I am just not sure that all loose crud in the pan will actually make it to the filter
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I`d just do short oci`s with a good dino (Pennzoil yb or Valvoline yb) and it should be fine.
A friend bought a Ford that had oil abuse and ruined the engine in 50 miles after he bought it, as it was sludged like yours. After the pan was pulled there was an inch of sludge that blocked the oil pump pick up.
My advise is to have the pan removed before driving it any more.
My advise is to have the pan removed before driving it any more.
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Originally Posted By: tig1
A friend bought a Ford that had oil abuse and ruined the engine in 50 miles after he bought it, as it was sludged like yours. After the pan was pulled there was an inch of sludge that blocked the oil pump pick up.
My advise is to have the pan removed before driving it any more.
^^Good call!
A friend bought a Ford that had oil abuse and ruined the engine in 50 miles after he bought it, as it was sludged like yours. After the pan was pulled there was an inch of sludge that blocked the oil pump pick up.
My advise is to have the pan removed before driving it any more.
^^Good call!
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