Pit bulls and a kitty

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: Shannow

But when human actions have caused something to become dangerous, like these (and the type of dogs that they are peers with), the packs of wild dogs roaming close to towns in Oz, 14lb feral cats, it's not punishing the animal, it's purely a matter of hygene...they must be gotten rid of.



If you're talking about a specific animal (or pack of feral animals), then sure--if it exhibits unsound and dangerous temperament then it needs to be euthanized. That has nothing to do with the characteristics of a breed of dog, or at least dogs we're talking about here. Humans have not caused a specific breed of dog to be dangerous (except for the Fila, which IS dangerous around strangers), and claiming so is generally done out of ignorance. The Bloodhound's genetics didn't change when it went from "crazed killer" to tracking dog; same with the Newfie, Doberman or any other dog which previously held the position of "society's killer dog".

 

[blacklamb]

Originally Posted By: yonyon
If you think that's bad, try using a little apple scented car wax and parking near a horse.


That made me laugh as I'm sure its true.

Anyways I hate pits just as much as any other "hater" on here but I got my hate towards them from the owners. When I lived in the south I would walk my German Shepherds and I would have people ask to fight my dogs vs theirs and go figure it was always a pit on some retarded size chain I’m talking like anchor chain for a aircraft carrier, I know it’s not the dogs fault but it still bugged enough for me to start to hate them. The next step for me hating them was watching the news, I really wish there was a better way to put it but some folks had a pit and people even said it was the sweetest dog and all that good stuff and one day out of the blue it killed the dog’s owners two year old. There always seemed to be some story of a pit attack on the T.V.. The next step was when I would go to work it seemed everyone had a pit and they would talk about how great it is and how it could kill my dog if it needed to and all that and how they are the greatest dog in the world, it’s funny how I would always find something to prove them wrong. Last thing is I just plain don’t like how they look. NOW on to the positive.

Now that I’m back in the N.W. is what I consider “normal” people a few people I know have pits, one of them is named sweet pea, I must say I don’t think this dog could harm a bunny it is very well mannered and very sweet. My neighbors also have a pit while I don’t like this one as much it as it always “attacks” my fence to try to get to my dogs I know it’s just protecting its yard. I have seen this dog while it’s been on walks and once again it is a very nice and as much as I hate to say it better behaved than my two turds. I see this pit always playing with my neighbor’s 9 week old wiener dog puppy and it takes the abuse from the little feller all day.

I will say I’ve been attacked my more small dogs and cats then ANY big dog. The only “large breed” to attack me was a Golden Retriever when I was 8 and riding my bike and it chased me down for no reason and bit me, I still remember to this day the car ride to show my parents the dog that bit me and made them promise nothing bad would happen to the dog. It turned out that its brother, sister, lover or however you want to put it died a day or two prior. Now as for small dogs, my god those little turds get my ankles all the time, they have made me bleed more times than I can count. My Ex’s chiwawa would bit me all the time, now the funny thing was I could hold its head like a ball until it calmed down but it would just start right back up again, that little S.O.B. god I hated that dog. I can say the same for cats, what the heck is wrong with cats you can be petting them one min the next min they bite you, claw you and bolt once again little turds come back and finish the job! I hate cats.

So with all that being said do I hate Pits yes, do I think they should be outlawed, at times yes but in reality no. ANY dog can attack at anytime and kill if they want to. Pits have gotten a bad rap from all the “gangsters” out there for sure and have I hopped on that bandwagon saying pits are killers as much as I hate to admit it I sure have.

I’m trying to change my view towards Pits, but its hard for me to when people are always trying to compare them to my dogs and tell me that their Pit is this and that. The only thing I tell them is if you Pit is so much better than my dog why doesn’t the police, military, the blind, search and rescue, and many other agencies use it instead of a German Shepherd, I still have yet to get an answer.

Oh god I rambeled!

 

[blacklamb]

After reading more on this thread:
Back on to little dogs:
So most towns or counties have leash laws (at least I think so) I’ve noticed also a lot of small dog owners who fail to follow this law and get [censored] and or try to sue when their dog goes up to a large bread on a leash and gets attacked and hurt or killed. I’ve also observed that on my street that my neighbors like to let their small breeds roam free and poop on my yard (granted I’ve let my dogs seek revenge for me buhahaha) , yes I know my yard looks like [censored] but I don’t need any more help with it. Anyways it bugs me so much when I try to walk my dogs and I have to try to fend off 5 or 6 small dogs roaming free, I’m about to let my 100lb male GSD have at them but I know he would be put down, poor guy had already had a rough life (he’s a rescue). So small dog owners please keep your dogs in your yard and on a leash.

 

[blacklamb]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
When Your pit-bull might be the friendliest, most placid animal when you are around, but when you aren't you have an obligation not to have any other member of the public exposed to ANY risk from the animal.


I dont have a Pit, but when Im not around my dogs are either A: in my house free roaming or B: in my fenced yard. I expect my dogs to keep my home free of intruders and as of now they have done well. You can say hold the owner to a higher standard but if someone is trying to steal from me or my neighbors the dogs are getting released, done it once already to some guy in my neighbors back yard at 2am and yes it was blatent that he was trying to break in, I got a big thank you from them.

 

[Shannow]

I'd assume that your fenced yard, while being made capable of keeping your dogs secured, is also capable of keeping a curious toddler from up the road from getting in...IMO, you are doing OK at that point, pit bull or not.

Cops advised my neighbour that throwing his dog over the fence when vandals were at it was legit, and I tend to agree.

Neighbours some years ago had a mastiff rescue dog, who was utterly a gorgeous animal...was missing his canine teeth, which didn't make much sense as to why it was ALL of them.

He used to live on their unfenced front porch, which none of us considered a biggie, we'd get home from work, and he's cross the road to greet us, tail wagging etc...again, no biggie.

One afternoon, I heard him going beserk, and it was at a school kid, on my side of the street, scared witless, and holding a stick up in defence...dog was about to go him, when I took the stick.

Nasty situation, ex fighting dog, canines removed to make him a better breeder, and a kid who didn't know any better, scared of the beast crossing the road at him.

The latter situation should never have been allowed to happen, regardless of the deadbeats who created the animal.

 

[Shannow]

, and having grown up as a small child, with greyhounds, which I have always found to be super friendly, playful, but must always be muzzled, contained in 10' fenced areas, and never allowed off leash in public (by law, for at least 40 years that I can remember)...I think that docking tails (and to a lesser extent cropping ears) should be banned.

At least one or two aspects of canine behaviour can be taught to even the youngest kids, which is how a dog's holding itself, and what it likely means in the relationship...A dog missing a tail, and kid's (well not many people) can pick how the animal is thinking when they encounter each other.

 

[Shannow]

This is going to draw heat, but people who choose breeds tend to be trying to mirror their ego in the breed that they choose...

People who choose mixed hybrids do so as well...

And people who choose Bitzas similarly.

There would not be too many dog owners on this board who could honestly say that they didn't look for certain aspects when "choosing" their animal.

Yeah, neither of these are dogs...nor was roy's tiger.

 

[demarpaint]

It's the way the dog is trained, and not so much the breed. My brother has a Pit bull and she's the nicest most gentle dog I've seen in a long time. Their looks can be a bit intimidating, but if trained correctly they can make good pets. Me I'd rather have a Lab.

 

[CourierDriver]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
It's the way the dog is trained, and not so much the breed. My brother has a Pit bull and she's the nicest most gentle dog I've seen in a long time. Their looks can be a bit intimidating, but if trained correctly they can make good pets. Me I'd rather have a Lab.


+1 on the Lab and one more for a Golden, best loving dogs in the world.......................

 

[bigmike]

Originally Posted By: blacklamb
Originally Posted By: yonyon
If you think that's bad, try using a little apple scented car wax and parking near a horse.



Now that I’m back in the N.W. is what I consider “normal” people....

Oh god I rambeled!


Yes, you did ramble. What kind of nonsense is this? Are you saying that people outside the Northwest are not normal?

 

[bigmike]

Originally Posted By: blacklamb
Originally Posted By: Shannow
When Your pit-bull might be the friendliest, most placid animal when you are around, but when you aren't you have an obligation not to have any other member of the public exposed to ANY risk from the animal.


I dont have a Pit, but when Im not around my dogs are either A: in my house free roaming or B: in my fenced yard. I expect my dogs to keep my home free of intruders and as of now they have done well. You can say hold the owner to a higher standard but if someone is trying to steal from me or my neighbors the dogs are getting released, done it once already to some guy in my neighbors back yard at 2am and yes it was blatent that he was trying to break in, I got a big thank you from them.


If someone is stealing from you, then you are (by default) already at a higher standard.

 

[kb01]

I wish the pit bull owners in my neighborhood were as responsible as the ones in this thread.

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
This is going to draw heat, but people who choose breeds tend to be trying to mirror their ego in the breed that they choose...

People who choose mixed hybrids do so as well...

And people who choose Bitzas similarly.

There would not be too many dog owners on this board who could honestly say that they didn't look for certain aspects when "choosing" their animal.



Thing is, I really don't think most really understand the aspects of the breed. Keep in mind that at the turn of the prior century this was the most common family dog in the US--and for good reason. I'll tell you why I ended up with one: I wanted a medium-sized dog with a short coat that was reliable around humans, particularly strangers (since I live in the city), that would be active enough to go on a 14 mile mountain bike ride but not pester me all the time--and one that didn't bark much.

What I didn't want was a dog who thought it was his job to guard me and my stuff. Every other dog I've owned had the innate drive to do that, and honestly I just wanted an easier dog. After researching it do death, I ended up with an American Pit Bull Terrier. It is funny the stigma which the dog has, particularly over the internet. I'm out with my dog quite a bit, and in 7 years I can think of maybe 2 or 3 instances where people had a negative reaction of some sort just by looking at him. Many don't even know what he is, since most think "pit bull" means some giant, blockheaded dog that is probably more bulldog. This is unlike my past (or currect) Ridgeback, where people are usually a little wary just because of the dog's size.

So for me, I certainly looked for certain aspects of the breed, but they're the traits of the breed that actually exist, not the ones that some folks mistakenly believe to be inherent to the breed. I would hope that anyone getting a dog would research the breed thoroughly before getting one. Those that don't end up dumping the dog at the shelter a few months later! I'd love to have a Beagle, but with neighbors a few feet away I realize that would be a poor choice...

 

[kb01]

Originally Posted By: JOD
It is funny the stigma which the dog has, particularly over the internet.


You mentioned previously that you lived in a city. If your neighborhood is anything like mine, are you at all surprised that this stigma exists?

 

[PandaBear]

Sure, it is not the dogs fault as it is breed to do what it does, but you can never trust all owners do the right thing with these powerful breed.

We've seen local news frequently (once every several years) about pitbull attacking their owner / owner's wife, or a dog walker not able to hold the dog when it suddenly attack and killed a neighbor.

IMO these breed should be licensed and regulated. I'm not saying all of them should be put to sleep to prevent future attack, but if anyone see them on the street not leashed and have the jaw covered / tied the owners should be arrested.

 

[antiqueshell]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
It's the way the dog is trained, and not so much the breed. My brother has a Pit bull and she's the nicest most gentle dog I've seen in a long time.


Doesn't matter, it is the genetics of the breed.

I get pretty tired of hearing what you posted above, because in the end Pit Bulls are
"hard wired" to attack.

 

[mechtech2]

Modern pit bulls are different than the 'Spanky and Our Gang' Spot pit bulls.
They have been over bred and are not benign.

If we can recognize that different breeds are naturally biased, like shepherding, running, or retrieving, why not also recognize the inherent dangers of certain modern breeds?

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I get pretty tired of hearing what you posted above, because in the end Pit Bulls are
"hard wired" to attack.


Repeating something 17 times doesn't make it any more true. Pit Bulls are not "hard wired to attack". They have a strong prey drive. So do a log of other dogs. To the contrary, they've been bred originally (and still) to be handled by humans under pretty much the worst of conditions (bull baiting or dog fighting)--which is why they're so reliable around humans. Prey drive has no relation to human aggression.

This is as ridiculous as the bit about Dobermans becoming crazed because their brains would outgrow their skulls...

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Modern pit bulls are different than the 'Spanky and Our Gang' Spot pit bulls.
They have been over bred and are not benign.


In terms of genetics, they really aren't that different. Sure, some have been bred for a certain look. But the "Our Gang" dogs are the direct decedents of dogs bred for bull baiting (hence the name).

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
If we can recognize that different breeds are naturally biased, like shepherding, running, or retrieving, why not also recognize the inherent dangers of certain modern breeds?


Sure we should. Every breed has its own set of challenges. The main challenge with a pit bull is managing it around other dogs. If you aren't prepared to manage this, you shouldn't own one. But this has nothing to do with aggression towards humans. It's not "inherently dangerous" to humans. The consistent comments that they're "hardwired to attack" or "have special jaws that bite harder" simply aren't based in reality. Of course, as they get repeated constantly I understand how people end up believing them.

 

[CourierDriver]

http://www.godvine.com/Dying-Dog-Gives-Up-On-Life-But-Just-Watch-What-Happens-Next-1875.html yep, this is a pit bull, I would have fed him too even if I am a birddog person.