Piston Soak with an Industrial Degreaser?

Astro14

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Fair enough. That’s some serious oil consumption. Worth the risk in trying to correct it.

My old 4 Runner used oil, leaked a bit, burned a bit, starting at around 150,000 miles. Got up to 1 quart every 1,500 miles. I made sure the PCV system was decent and just kept topping it off, reckoning, in that case, that the fix was a whole lot more money/effort than I wanted to out into it. Power was good (for that engine, it was a 150HP 3.0 V-6, known in the Toyota works as the “3 point slow”), it ran smoothly, it had good compression.

I left it alone. And it made it to 300,000 miles, with about the same leak/burn rate.
 

Vladiator

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Personally I’d bite the bullet for commercial products from Mopar or GM …
(their own techs report good results) …
There are also some guys who have done this with small amounts of concentrated Techron …
Don’t see how oil based products would be quite as effective with CBU …
Any idea if the recent GM formula is as good as the old one? the one that used to come in a 2-stroke style measuring bottle? Some say it's not as good. Will look deeper into Mopar stuff.
 
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Your engine is on its last legs of you're burning a quart every 500 miles. I can't see a downside to your plan. How much worse can it get. Best you can hope for is one more year out of the engine before Mr Junkyard comes with the tow truck a check for $350. Report back your results. How did it get this bad?
 
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Burning that much oil you have multiple problems. Yeah the soak might get the rings clean but what about the valve seals? The rear main seal? The valve cover gasket? PCV? Newsflash they al all seeping oil and all contributing to ypur extreme consumption. I would run 40% of your crankcase with BG44k and other 60% oil. Run at idle for 15 min. Fully warmed up but just idle.
 
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girlfriends bought new 2.5L non turbo 13 malibu was 'using' over a qt on a thou by 65 thou!!! DUMPED it for a great preowned 8 thou Kia Optima in 19 that uses NO oil, a better car OVERALL!!!
 

MolaKule

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Marvel Mystery Oil will go in, but as more of a "finishing touch". The plan is to let something more aggressive break up the carbon first.
I would not use anything that some yardtree mechanic has proposed.

If you think you have carbonized (and or stuck) piston rings that are contributing to oil consumption, and feel you must do a so-called 'piston soak,' I would use either LCD's LC20, or Rislone "Maximum Performance Engine Treatment conditioner and cleaner," or a combination of the two.

Remove plugs and apply about 4 ounces of the cleaner to each cylinder. Let stand overnight. Then take a ratchet wrench and rotate the crankshaft. Repeat crankshaft rotation until the cleaner has migrated past the rings. On an inline vertical engine, this is a simple procedure. On a six cylinder or V8 engine, you may have to rotate the crankshaft so the piston is low enough such that the cleaner does not spill out of the cylinder, and that it completely covers the piston crown.

Also realize oil consumption may be caused by badly worn valve stem seals as well, and a piston soak will not help oil consumption if your rings are badly worn.
 
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Vladiator

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Have you removed the valve cover to see how the engine was maintained?
Yes. Didn't look terrible, no sludge anywhere, just basic average varnish.

Your engine is on its last legs of you're burning a quart every 500 miles. I can't see a downside to your plan. How much worse can it get. Best you can hope for is one more year out of the engine before Mr Junkyard comes with the tow truck a check for $350. Report back your results. How did it get this bad?
Possibly. I got the car at 201K miles, unknown service history before that.
Burning that much oil you have multiple problems. Yeah the soak might get the rings clean but what about the valve seals? The rear main seal? The valve cover gasket? PCV? Newsflash they al all seeping oil and all contributing to ypur extreme consumption. I would run 40% of your crankcase with BG44k and other 60% oil. Run at idle for 15 min. Fully warmed up but just idle.
I was under the impression that BG MOA & BG EPR are for the crankcase, and BG 44k is for the fuel system. RMS doesn't seem to be leaking, oil pan gasket is seeping some. Valve cover gasket replaced at 216k when I did valve lash adjustment.
 

Vladiator

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UPDATE #1: The deed is done.
Didn't stick to my original plan due to unforeseen circumstances (not vehicle related). Ended up doing the following:
- Got pistons lined up mid-stroke and filled each cylinder with a full shot-glass of Berryman B-12.
- In 4 hours removed whatever fluid was left in cylinders. Refilled with a shot-glass of 50/50 mix of B12 and MMO.
- In 5 hours removed all fluid and changed oil, used STP 15w40. (NC climate allows.)
- Started engine. Lots of smoke. Took it for a drive and created mile long blue clouds for about 5 miles of driving. Then the smoke cleared and has not returned yet.

Initial observations: - Engine runs fine, maybe a hair smoother, but could be placebo. Engine used to blow smoke clouds above 5k rpm, and now I take it to redline and see no clouds behind me. No power gains. Only been a few days, so don't know if there will be any MPG gains, probably not. With my driving style I consistently get 275(+-5) miles before fuel light comes on, so if that somehow changes for better - great! Will keep an eye on the oil level to see if oil consumption has decreased. Once I get some measurable results from that - I'll replace the oil pan gasket and see how big of an effect that had on the oil loss.
 
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JRed

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UPDATE #1: The deed is done.
Didn't stick to my original plan due to unforeseen circumstances (not vehicle related). Ended up doing the following:
- Got pistons lined up mid-stroke and filled each cylinder with a full shot-glass of Berryman B-12.
- In 4 hours removed whatever fluid was left in cylinders. Refilled with a shot-glass of 50/50 mix of B12 and MMO.
- In 5 hours removed all fluid and changed oil, used STP 15w40. (NC climate allows.)
- Started engine. Lots of smoke. Took it for a drive and created mile long blue clouds for about 5 miles of driving. Then the smoke cleared and has not returned yet.

Initial observations: - Engine runs fine, maybe a hair smoother, but could be placebo. Engine used to blow smoke clouds above 5k rpm, and now I take it to redline and see no clouds behind me. No power gains. Only been a few days, so don't know if there will be any MPG gains, probably not. With my driving style I consistently get 275(+-5) miles before fuel light comes on, so if that somehow changes for better - great! Will keep an eye on the oil level to see if oil consumption has decreased. Once I get some measurable results from that - I'll replace the oil pan gasket and see how big of an effect that had on the oil loss.
So when I did my piston soak on my Prius that ended up solving my oil burning (from 1qt/1000 miles to now burning less than 1/4qt per oil change) I filled the cylinders with Berryman's B12 all the way to the spark plug threads, threaded spark plugs in finger tight, and turned the engine by the crank bolt gently to help "force" the Berryman's past the compression rings. When I did this I could clearly hear the Berryman's running into the oil sump. Did this until I went through an entire can of Berryman's, then refilled the cylinders to the spark plug threads again and put spark plugs in loosely and left it overnight. Repeated the process the next day. Blew the cylinders out, put a little ATF down each, blew that out.

Car has been free of oil burning for about ~10k miles now.
 
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I have tried a bunch of solvents as experiments to removed coked on carbon.. chem dip is the only one that really did much..

if you have ever had your hands pure black from grease and diesel oil and godknows what.. you can use all the fancy stuff you want to get your hands clean... baby oil melts it all like butter... i havent tried a soak in baby oil but it does wonders for the hands.

Someone needs to pull 8 nasty pistons from a junkyard motor and do a soak on youtube of different stuff.. i wish i had time.
 

Vladiator

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I have tried a bunch of solvents as experiments to removed coked on carbon.. chem dip is the only one that really did much..

if you have ever had your hands pure black from grease and diesel oil and godknows what.. you can use all the fancy stuff you want to get your hands clean... baby oil melts it all like butter... i havent tried a soak in baby oil but it does wonders for the hands.

Someone needs to pull 8 nasty pistons from a junkyard motor and do a soak on youtube of different stuff.. i wish i had time.
First time I ever heard of that, sounds fun. Reminds me of that YouTube video where the kids ran Baby oil as engine oil for 180+ miles in a Toyota.

So when I did my piston soak on my Prius that ended up solving my oil burning (from 1qt/1000 miles to now burning less than 1/4qt per oil change) I filled the cylinders with Berryman's B12 all the way to the spark plug threads, threaded spark plugs in finger tight, and turned the engine by the crank bolt gently to help "force" the Berryman's past the compression rings. When I did this I could clearly hear the Berryman's running into the oil sump. Did this until I went through an entire can of Berryman's, then refilled the cylinders to the spark plug threads again and put spark plugs in loosely and left it overnight. Repeated the process the next day. Blew the cylinders out, put a little ATF down each, blew that out.

Car has been free of oil burning for about ~10k miles now.
I just let it sit. Seemed to work. It's been 3 weeks and 1000+ miles since the soak, and oil level only dropped by .25qt at most, but I blame that oil loss on the oil pan gasket. That gasket will get replaced once I receive the new oil pan and exhaust gaskets in the mail, as exhaust has to be removed in order to remove the oil pan. As far as improvements I mentioned earlier - the car still does not smoke, all the way to redline. That alone is a huge improvement, as before the soak people literally backed off for a mile when I floored it, due to blue smoke clouds. Not anymore though. But while oil burning has decreased, the amount of tailgaters has increased... And I can't scare them off with blue clouds anymore.
Back to B12. If oil burning returns - I will try your method. I'll also give it a shot in my brother's IS300, as that 2JZ-GE seems to start burning a bit of oil now at 220k+ miles.
 

Vladiator

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UPDATE #2. While the piston soak provided great immediate results - those results didn't last long. Sad to report that over the last 3 tanks of gas I had to add a quart of oil on each fill up. But thankfully the smoke clouds did not return. Yet... So back to square one.
Not giving up yet though! Trying to decide between a couple methods, feel free to chime in.
Method 1: Buy the super agressive BMW fuel injector cleaner (the old GM/AC Delco stuff, but under BMW name these days) and use that for the piston soak.
Method 2: Buy 5-10 cans of Berryman B12, or the big can of ChemDip, and use that for piston soak over a few days.
Method 3: Your ideas on other piston soak products?

P.S. @JRed How is the Prius doing so far?
 
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