Pay Cutts

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Originally Posted By: oilyriser
If everyone cuts their pay equally, won't we end up in exactly the same situation we started in?


Not when retail prices keep going up!
 
I know all too well about those darn pay cuts! I went to work two Fridays ago, and everything was fine, then out of the blue "Oh by the way, you're being terminated, have a nice day...." These cuts suck, and trying to file for Unemployment is like pulling teeth....
 
Originally Posted By: oilyriser
If everyone cuts their pay equally, won't we end up in exactly the same situation we started in?


Which would you prefer:

Choice 1: Sorry, we've let you go. Have a nice day.
Choice 2: Work for a small amount less (the same percentage as your boss and the other leadership above you) and have a job to keep paying your bills and not draw unemployment.

I don't subscribe to the politics of class envy. There will always be someone making more than you, and in most cases (though not all), there is a reason for it, like it or not.

I'm not jealous of those who make more than me at my employer. They all have responsibilities bigger than mine, making their compensation generally fair. Most importantly, they aren't asking me something that they haven't already done themselves. Some might argue they should do more, I don't see it that way.
 
if you are making less, they you are spending less correct?

I think this makes sense no? You aren't going to spend MORE when you have LESS coming in. That would be financial suicide usually.

So why is it so wrong for the company to do that? In my opinion, thats GOOD business practice. Without it, you end up like GM.

Paying people more money to put lug nuts on a car or any other position that requires no education, anybody can do it and whos value to the company stays the same year after year, than you would pay a teacher or a paramedic is a major problem.

Paying people who have left the company, laid off but still drawing 90% of thier salary so they can bring them back when they need to is downright stupid.

Paying peoples health insurance for 40 years after they have LONG stopped being a productive member of the company is flat out incredibly DUMB.

This is a BUSINESS. Did none of you study this in college? Did none of you get the talk I got when I was young about getting a job/career in a field that people will always need? Did none of you save for a rainy day?

How about GM.. The unions are STILL fighting them. lmao.. they will all lose thier jobs anyway so keep fighting for the benefits that your irresponsible company can never and will never be able to pay you for.

Toyota made the same mistake the American car companies did... Instead of making cars and trucks based on actual demand, they made them to keep the workers working. Instead of slowing down production, to keep the prices higher and the rebates and cash back allowances to a minimum and resale higher thus driving sales higher, they thought the best way to make money was to maximize the amount they could make within a certain time frame ( because otherwise the factory wasn't being efficient.)

One bump in the road and you are stuck in a bad spot. You have no reserve. I am shocked that GM and Chrysler have no reserve, no plan B.

Screw the unions. Get rid of them. There is NO right to work in this world. Get that stupid thought out of your mind. The sooner you all get off your soapbox of whine and cheese, the sooner you can look for a job. No one ever said life came with guarantees.

Just like GM, if you aren't marketing something that people need and want, then you go out of business.

Heres a good hint as to what to look for when trying to figure out what you should pick for a job...

Go for a job that depends on the stupidity and frailty of the human race. There will never be a shortage of that.
 
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Quote:
We were told that they are beholdent to the shareholders and we are a for profit company.


Yep, any company would not hesitate to wipe their butt with thier hard working loyal employees just to keep the shareholders happy. Sad but very true.
frown.gif
When you slash your payroll, you can 'artifically' increase your profits.


+ 1,000,000,000,,00,000,0,0,0,,00,

sounds like my employer
 
Originally Posted By: peterdaniel
Screw the unions. Get rid of them. There is NO right to work in this world. Get that stupid thought out of your mind. The sooner you all get off your soapbox of whine and cheese, the sooner you can look for a job. No one ever said life came with guarantees.


You have to think about where unions come from before you say screw them and abolish them.

5 year olds losing limbs in cotton gins, black lung and asbestosis are the reasons that unions came into being in the first place...

If employers historically had been fair and reasonable, then unions would never have made their first tentative steps.

Yep, in some cases and industries the unions have gone too far (or WAY too far)...but invariably, for concessions to have been given, implies that there's another party allowing those concessions, who perceives that he is getting the best deal that he can..or he's incompetent and shouldn't be entering into negotiations in the first instance.
 
shannow, I'm not a union man, but i feel their check-and-balance function is good. I don't even think my profession has a union.
 
I've been in and out of unions as and when I think management are taking too many liberties.

Dropped out for a while last year when the Union went against my wishes when it came to selling power generation.
 
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: oilyriser
Labour laws make it impossible to cut pay, so they have to fire you.





Another division of my company avoided layoffs by asking people to work reduced hours, which is in essence a cut in pay. Also, some of the people at my former company who didn't get let go, are now on a 4 day work week at reduced pay. So there must be ways around that law.

At the end of the day though, it's probably better they let me go, as I did get 6 months salary as a severance, and if I find a job quickly then all that extra money can go into paying down my debt load. And in the long run I might end up getting a higher paying job too. So I'm keeping a positive attitude here. I just finished reading the book "Who Moved My Cheese?" and am now very anxious to go out there and find my own New Cheese!
happy2.gif



Very sorry to hear about that. But consider yourself lucky you don't live in a right-to-work state such as mine. You can be fired at any time for any reason and unemployment pay is voluntary on the part of employers. How many companies are going to pay you to stay home after they fired you? Here? Very, very few.

My uncle just got let go from the phone company after putting in 32 years. No retirement, no severance, no unemployment, just "Sorry we can't use you anymore, but we'll give you a good reference!" Thank you, North Carolina, for giving us such wonderful employers. Your laws and agencies ensure us that you have our best intere$t$ in mind.
 
Wages have been stagnant for years, even when times were good. Taking a pay cut these days is a real kick in the a** because if you haven't been getting a 5% pay raise per year for the last 10 years, you're actually taking a pay cut because of inflation.

Luckily I'm young and still have a long time to work, I would hate to be a few years from retirement at this point. 401k is a joke, it only works when times are good. When things take a downturn, you lose your shirt. It would be nice if people could get an interest rate from a savings account that wasn't a slap in the face (like the current 1-2%).

Amazing that banks are still going under left and right, considering they've been lending out money (credit cards and loans) starting at 7 points and up, but only paying 1-2 points on savings and checking accounts for years and years now.
 
Originally Posted By: crinkles
living off the land is looking better by the day

Yep, you can't get fired, you determine your hours, and your compensation is directly proportionate to your work!

I don't know why job sharing isn't more popular? My wife works 3 out of every 4 years, at 3/4 of her salary per year. She is a teacher so its easy for the school board to accomodate this, plus it usually gives a new teacher a foot in the door with a year experience.
I guess we could afford newer cars, etc, if she didn't take the year off but having the time off is more valuable to her as our hobbies are cheap but time intensive.
Ian
 
Originally Posted By: Patman
The company that I worked for said in January that all was well and gave everyone a 2% raise. Then last week out of the blue they said that profits were down (but still there were profits!) and they had to cut 10% of their employees (including me) across North America. It just makes me angry that in such tough economic times, so many companies are making the situation worse by getting rid of people just so that they can make more profits. If a company is facing bankruptcy and needs to cut employees that is one thing, but to cut employees just to make more profits, that's pure greed. They should've just asked people if they would've rather taken a pay cut.


I'm truly sorry for your situation. I was laid off after 911 so I know the feeling. Current job is OK for now but who knows in a few months...
My Father has been moved to 4 days a few weeks ago.

Still, how many here are cutting back what they spend on? Less going out, less driving, less purchases, forgoing trips...etc. By the logic above, anyone that has is in it for greed and themselves only. After all, all that money you are not spending is not supporting someone else's job.

Companies are cutting back for the same reason most of the rest of are...uncertain times ahead.
 
Originally Posted By: Tempest


Still, how many here are cutting back what they spend on?


Even before I got laid off, I was cutting back quite a bit on expenses (for instance, I have already planned on cutting back or eliminating any future UOAs for a while, after I use my last kit in the spring) Now that I am laid off, and need to stretch my severance package money as long as possible, I'm cutting spending even more, to the bare essentials. Things such as changing my internet connection to a slower speed to save $20 a month, and we definitely won't be going out for any dinners, except for our anniversary in March, but I'm using Air Miles to get coupons that will pay for that. I went out today and sold some old DVDs in order to make some extra cash too. I've also stopped going to the detail shop every Saturday morning for my $15 car wash (although to be honest, I won't need that now that the cold weather will be gone soon and I can begin washing my car in the driveway again soon) I have even considered asking my friend that owns the detail shop if he needs some help washing cars so I could make a little bit of extra cash.

I just wish I had cut back on my spending many years ago. If I was better with my money when I was in my 20s and early 30s, I could've had my house paid off by now. I am still confident that I'll have my house paid off in 14 years, so I'll be 53 years old by then. And if the economy hits another speed bump after that time and I end up losing my job again, maybe at that point in time I could afford to retire if I get a good severance package then.

Now you might say that is greed if some of us have cut back on our spending, since we're now not supporting others, but I disagree. In this economy it's simply all about survival! It is a tricky catch 22 situation though, people right now are not spending because they have lost their job or are saving in case they lose their job. But by doing this, that causes companies to make less money so they end up having to get rid of more employees. I can't even begin to understand how the economy is supposed to recover quickly when this is happening. But I do know that when things get better and people start getting good jobs and big raises, they are going to want new cars and bigger houses.
 
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