Oil is Oil

  • Thread starter Thread starter Al
  • Start date Start date
oil pan 4 said:
According to LSjr you can't even get a group 1 oil any more, it sounds like he tried to get group 1 base oils and can't, just no one makes them anymore. Which I didn't know and a big part of why "oil is oil" and why "you can't buy a bad oil anymore".
What they call "conventional oil" is at least now all hydro cracked so all those aromatic hydrocarbons that contained a sulfur, phosphorus, nitrogen or oxygen atom and would thermally breakdown, cause, varnish, sludge, rust are virtually all eliminated now.
Click to expand...
You can still get some solvent refined bases, and of course you can still easily get Group II.

These guys appear to sell Group I:
Base Oils Group I worldwide: Paraffinic base oils — DYM Resources
 
Al said:
Can anyone here definitively state that one oil underperforms and one outperforms. Ater 23 years of reading BITOG I have yet to answer this question..
Click to expand...
I think if you're doing 5,000 mile or less OCI, all group III full synthetic oils will have engines with identical outcomes.
If you're doing extended oil changes (like 15,000+ miles), then the Group V Ester based synthetics will outperform.
 
Bill7 said:
I think if you're doing 5,000 mile or less OCI, all group III full synthetic oils will have engines with identical outcomes.
If you're doing extended oil changes (like 15,000+ miles), then the Group V Ester based synthetics will outperform.
Click to expand...
I don't see anywhere near identical outcomes with a host of brands. It's easy for me to find the brands that increase engine loudness and/or a premature worn-out oil look inside my oil pan bucket and/or a paper towel test & drip test of the dipstick oil. When these things occur at 3k of an OCI, that never has me reaching to purchase that particular product again.

Plus, some meet specs and some go beyond in Analysis tests we read here..... that's if you trust the source of the information. VOA / UOAs has to be repetitive and somewhat universally the same, for me to conclude a pattern with product value. It's just folder information for me.... nothing more.

Will I purchase Quaker State Euro 40s / Amsoil Euro 0w or Supertech default Syn again? No way Jose. Hyunkia products make great oil testers. But I will again purchase Quaker State 20k, Supertech 20k and Amsoil S.S. in the future.
 
Last edited:
Hello all, I am new to understanding different oils, and not too knowledgeable of the different base oils and additive packs that are out there. My question here is:
How can I tell if a off-the-shelf synthetic oil is group 3 or Esther based synthetic.
Thank you.
 
mikeduf said:
Hello all, I am new to understanding different oils, and not too knowledgeable of the different base oils and additive packs that are out there. My question here is:
How can I tell if a off-the-shelf synthetic oil is group 3 or Esther based synthetic.
Thank you.
Click to expand...
Ester (not Esther) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ester

Easy answer = none, better answer don't worry about it. At all.

Longer answer is some will say look at the MSDS. I can conclude these are very and purposely misleading if trying to reverse engineer an oil formulation. And again even if there was an easy way to determine base oils used, why???
 
I read on a previous post that if someone had the choice between going with a group 3 or Esther based they would use the Esther based oil. So I was wondering if that is something that the consumer can easily identify at the local store. Sorry I use voice recognition so names come out how they come out.

I know I am over analyzing this, but I would like to put the best oil in my new RAV4 4-cylinder
 
mikeduf said:
I read on a previous post that if someone had the choice between going with a group 3 or Esther based they would use the Esther based oil. So I was wondering if that is something that the consumer can easily identify at the local store. Sorry I use voice recognition so names come out how they come out.

I know I am over analyzing this, but I would like to put the best oil in my new RAV4 4-cylinder
Click to expand...
New? Best oil? There really is no best oil. Change at recommended intervals using any of the Group III oils and engine cleanliness will not be any different. Wear will not be measurable. Paying more than $10/qt for an oil that contains ester in appreciable quantity simply is not worth it for a new car not extending the OCI.

I can say that older Group I/II oils will not be as clean, I think we have established that, and that true synthetic oils will last longer in your engine and keep the engine cleaner than extending a Group II oil.
 
mikeduf said:
Hello all, I am new to understanding different oils, and not too knowledgeable of the different base oils and additive packs that are out there. My question here is:
How can I tell if a off-the-shelf synthetic oil is group 3 or Esther based synthetic.
Thank you.
Click to expand...
You pop the hood and this 'ol gal is staring back at you:
1723212774023.webp

Bud, you've got Esther.
 
TiGeo said:
Ice luge time to settle this.
Click to expand...
Hippy. At least let it be rubber band guns at 4 paces.

Just to make it interesting - no eye protection.

And on topic - depends on how you apply it.

0-5k intervals - oil is oil - and there's a metric boatload of cars running today at many many dozens of tens of thousands of miles on the odometer to prove it. The one caveat to all of my reasoning is how you drive it. Drive it like you stole it every time you get in it, better use something a little better than Slippytec.
5-7-8k, generally speaking ^ - but what you put it in and how you drive it (that caveat again) really has a lot more of an effect than brand
10k intervals - generally speaking ^ - and the cars on the road today also prove that.
10k+ - I'm gonna use somadat hi-test oil, because in this application, oil is NOT oil.

I generally do say that for the most part, oil is oil - but I readily admit that hi-test oils are superior for hard use or long applications.

Does anyone need HPL in a Corolla when they change it 3 times a year and only put 15k per year on it? Nah. House brands/bulk are going to be just as good. Does anyone need to run AMSOIL in their F150 if they tow their 4500lb boat or trailer 6-8 times a year and change it every 7-8k - again I would say nah. But I would step it up to a name brand. That's my OWN personal opinion. And going up a grade - I'd run house brand in that application without a bit of concern. I'm one of those people who have put a really insane amount of miles on a number of vehicles and have yet to blow but one motor. And I seriously doubt that was oil related. Broke a crank in an Escort. Escort had a lot of miles on it, I bought it with a couple hundred k off of Craigslist and it was ragged all the way out, but I got about 3 years out of it my own self before she said "I quit" - dug into it just a tad and while it did have a nice brown coat of varnish, it wasn't all gummed up like the pic Cuje posted earlier.

And a gun is a gun when you pop a whitetail at 75 feet - whether is a Norinco 7.62x39 or a Pope blessed custom 300 WinMag that the descendant of the guy who forged Excalibur built with his own machine tools (or even a Sears and Roebuck single shot .22lr - which will get the job done). A gun is not a gun when you enjoy punching holes very closely together in a bit of paper or off of a bit of steel at 250 yards. Or whatever 250 yds is in satanic metric system measurements. Passion for a fine tool doesn't make it a better tool for the job it's doing at the moment. I get it though - I won't eat commercially ground beef. I grind my own out of steaks and roasts. But billions of people make perfectly serviceable and edible hamburgers and meatloafs and chili out of store grind every day - just not me. To me, it's crude, disgusting, and tastes like crap. But that's a PERSONAL preference.
 
Oh man! I'm not sure if it has any Ester in it! But it has this stuff called Septec Guard!!
I mean just reading the short description of this makes me want to buy it it covers all the bases. But I'm not sure what septic guard is?
 
wpod said:
Thay are pretty much all the same at any given price point the question is will we notice the difference and the truth is unless there is a design or quality problem most engines outlast the vehicle if cared for. [Sticking with the major quality bottlers]
Click to expand...
But then there are cars, trucks and ect. that are thrashed on the track or or turbo/street, then something different could possibly come into play. Then "oil is oil" is less of a sweeping generality when Grandpa or "soft foot" is not driving the vehicle.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

C
Break in Oil
Replies
3
Views
555
chefwong
Klutch9
  • Locked
What’s going on with Quaker State Ultimate Protection?
2 3 4
Replies
62
Views
4K
kschachn
Al
How much better are engine oils that far exceed API ratings?
2 3
Replies
52
Views
4K
Revving2Redline
wwillson
  • Locked
Pennzoil - Low-speed pre-ignition (LSPI) Q&A
Replies
14
Views
1K
wwillson
wwillson
  • Locked
Pennzoil - Key Features and Benefits of ILSAC GF-7 Q&A
Replies
6
Views
1K
wwillson
Back
Top Bottom