Odyssey calls for 5w20 uhno

[Bror Jace]

I’m somewhere in the middle in this argument. If the manual calls for 5W20, then that’s probably what the owner should use … especially if the vehicle is going to see typical service. Such is the case here. Now, I was not originally a fan of 5W20 oils … and I still think they are more for fuel economy than anything else, but I have to admit, like Patman, I’ve seen some pretty respectable used oil test numbers on this site. Try doing a search in the Used Oil Analysis Reports section for: “5W20”

Also, many of us know that a lot of 5W30 oils shear down to a 5W20 in as little as a 1,000 miles. Some blenders may actually add shear-unstable VII to their formula So, those people who think they are using a 5W30 are actually running around with a 5W20 in their sumps.

Want to avoid these unstable, fake-weight oils? Then scour the analysis section of this site for tests on your favorite brand(s) and see how they fared for 3,000 miles, 4,000 miles, 5,000 miles and more!

Having said all that, owner’s manuals are dumbed down to a ridiculous degree these days and if semi-intelligent beings question their recommendations, it’s the FAULT OF THE AUTO MANUFACTURERS BECAUSE THEY TREAT US (their customers) LIKE BLITHERING IDIOTS!

So, if your grandparents want to use a 5W30 oil and buy it by the case for both vehicles, that should be fine. But, using a 5W20 oil is not exactly the end of the world. Just keep the oil & filter change interval modest (no more than 4,000 miles) and they’ll be fine.

They should probably be more concerned with the practice of buying whatever’s on sale at any given time. I am not one who recommends frequent mixing of brands and if you are always buying the brand that’s on sale, that’s essentially what you’ll end up doing. Changing brands every 6-8 months won’t destroy the motor prematurely, but could easily cause sludging over the long term and as the years add up, this may cause some problems.

I they want to be “thrifty” I suggest they pick a brand (sticking with dino, I’d pick Chevron or Pennzoil) and then scour the discounters looking for who has the best price in town on that brand. Both can be found economically and I don’t see a reason to switch brands to save $0.96 on a case of oil.

-- Bror Jace

 

[mkosem]

heh, that said, perhaps I'll order them some redline 5w40 and be done with it. The camry is a 93, I need to check the manual on that I'm positive 5/10w30 are definitely in there.

btw, the camry's a 4-cyl. but my stepmom's sienna has that POS DOHC V6 of which you speak.

--Matt

 

[pedaltothemetal]

I'm educated in weights now after reading here. All you have to know is the first number is the cold weight. The second number is the hot weight when heated up by the engine. 0W will have all your cold start bases covered no matter where you live...Nome Alaska, or Phoenix Arizona. The hot weight should be within your max climate zone.

 

[2533a]

quote:

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Originally posted by mkosem:


btw, the camry's a 4-cyl. but my stepmom's sienna has that POS DOHC V6 of which you speak.

--Matt

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Always good to hear from somebody with a POSitive opinion about Toyota's 1MZ-FE V6. The one in my 1999 Camry is a POS too: Powerful Outstanding Smooth.

No sludge in mine. And that it has no piston slap designed in is a true mark of excellence in my opinion. Sure it shreds oil, but maintain it well and it will not sludge. Downside: the Eaton M-62 on mine is a bit noisy at idle, but it positively wails above 5,000 RPM.

 

[mkosem]

supercharger eh?

We've not had a problem with it at all, Mobil 1 since day one. But I've read some of the horror stories from that engine. It runs great and has good power. I have nothing personal against it; It's just one of those ticking timebomb things.

--Matt

 

[joee12]

quote:

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Originally posted by Patman:
If one were to do oil analysis on 5w20, and see that in their engine the wear numbers are good, then it's safe to say that their engine isn't going to self destruct sooner than it should.

Like I said, I used to be very skeptical about 5w20, however if I owned a car that called for it, I'd use it and see how the analysis results turned out, then run a comparison test with 5w30 to see which results were better.

---

I agree with you on this one Patman. My sister just hit 3000 miles on her 2003 Civic EX, and I will be changing the oil out tomorrow. I just bought 4 quarts of Honda 5W20 and a Honda OEM(Filtech) oil filter. I will run an analysis at every change and post results. I wounder if I should run an analysis on the factory break in oil, I have one kit left from Terry???????

 

[2533a]

quote:

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Originally posted by mkosem:
supercharger eh?

We've not had a problem with it at all, Mobil 1 since day one. But I've read some of the horror stories from that engine. It runs great and has good power. I have nothing personal against it; It's just one of those ticking timebomb things.

--Matt

---

Yes a supercharger. Due to the additional stress, I should in theory find any weak points, other than shredding the oil, of this engine sooner rather than later. Ticking time bomb? I don't know as I haven't heard of any really high miles put on any of these engines yet. The 1MZ-FE will bite you if you aren't careful about regular oil changes though (and the 7500 mile recommendation should be changed as far as I'm concerned). Now I have heard of some incredible miles with no engine problems put on the 3S-FE 4-cylinder like the one in my 1991 Camry. Mine is just a baby with only 194,000 miles and no engine related problems ever.

 

[Jay]

When Mscales posted his used-oil analysis report it should have ended all speculation that 5w-20 oils can't do the job. Instead, it was mostly overlooked. Here it is again:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000202

Here's a guy with a Ford F-250SD 6.8L V-10 that tows a 4,000lb camper through the mountains of Colorado. The report stands out because the engine was young and probably still breaking-in, yet the wear numbers were exceptionally low.

 

[Dr. T]

See this is a quandry...but, a few things can be surmised:

1. The 5-20 is a U.S. creation since the same car in other markets recommends 5-30, 5-40 or 10-30.

2. In this vehicle, even the 10-30 is acceptable down to -20C (-4F).

3. Both the 5-40 and 10-30 go to 40C+. Not sure why both are shown to continue to above 40C.

So, I would probably lean towards a 5-40 or 10-40 if temps are not below -20C rather than the "it's-good-enough-because-the-cars-are-on-lease-and-should-only-last-for-the-duration-of-the-warranty-period-anyways-and-consumers-should-have-to-buy-the-new-models-we-have-on-the- lot-after-the-engine-wears-0-20-grade"

 

[joee12]

quote:

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Originally posted by Jay:
When Mscales posted his used-oil analysis report it should have ended all speculation that 5w-20 oils can't do the job. Instead, it was mostly overlooked. Here it is again:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000202

Here's a guy with a Ford F-250SD 6.8L V-10 that tows a 4,000lb camper through the mountains of Colorado. The report stands out because the engine was young and probably still breaking-in, yet the wear numbers were exceptionally low.

---

Jay, I hate to play devil's advocate here

, but you made the following statement in this post:

-Mike had asked,"TBN came back at 7. Anybody know what it starts out with?"

-and you responded,"It starts out as 7.5 so the oil is holding up remarkably well."

I think that we all need to keep in mind that engines are all different. 5W20 in a 1.6L Honda is not going to see half of the stress as a 6.8L V10 that tows a 4000 pound trailer through a mountain. -Joe

 

[satterfi]

quote:

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Originally posted by joee12:


5W20 in a 1.6L Honda is not going to see half of the stress as a 6.8L V10 that tows a 4000 pound trailer through a mountain. -Joe

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What's the logic behind that statement? lb/L ratio or something else?

 

[joee12]

quote:

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Originally posted by satterfi:

quote:

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Originally posted by joee12:


5W20 in a 1.6L Honda is not going to see half of the stress as a 6.8L V10 that tows a 4000 pound trailer through a mountain. -Joe

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What's the logic behind that statement? lb/L ratio or something else?

---

Satterfi, I was thinking pounds per liter when I made that statement, but now that you mentioned it, I guess that pounds per liter does not apply in my example. Here's why:
An F250(4x2 regular cab with automatic transmission) with a V10 weighs 5700 pounds. Add a 4000 pound trailer, you get 9700 pounds. 9700/6.8 = 1426 pounds per liter. A Honda Civic(sedan with automatic transmission)weighs 2600 pounds. 2600/1.6 = 1625 pounds per liter. With that said satterfi, I still feel that different engines treat oil differently. -Joe

 

[satterfi]

quote:

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Originally posted by joee12:


snip

I still feel that different engines treat oil differently. -Joe

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I agree. I guess it's a case by case situation. A little 1000cc sport bike may or may not be harder on oil than a V10 turbo Viper. Only used oil analysis will tell.

 

[mkosem]

my grandpa usually swears by havoline. it's always in sale and I havn't really heard anything bad about it.

--Matt

 

[MavRick]

If the oil analysis results were identical between a quality 5w30 and 5w20 I would still use the 5w30. Why? Because of the added protection. What happens if the engine get's a bit hotter than normal like when you travel from Flagstaff, AZ to Phoenix and you go from 70 degree weather into 115 degree temperatures (I've done this)? Or when you travel through death valley climbing those hills in 120 degree temps (I've done this and burned up a catalytic converter)? Which oil would you prefer? I'm not even sure I like 5w30 in that case, but it has to be better than 5w20 IMHO. Also as the oil begins to break down through the 5000 mile drain interval, you have less margin for error.

Now the new 5w20 formulations are synthetic blends (at least Motorcraft) and so they might be better formulated than a cheap 5w30. Since I plan on using good quality synthetic or blends in my vehicles I will have more confidence when I encounter the "extremes" of driving.

Oh, and if they want the same oil for both the Camry and the Honda, then 5w30 would be the way to go because the Camry DOHC V6's chew up oil.

 

[Toy4x4]

What is the oil that is recommended for the Camry? This should be considered, too, right?
If the Camry calls for a 5/10w30, seems like a 5w30 would be best for both cars.

 

[dagmando]

quote:

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Originally posted by mkosem:
Obviously, 5w20 oils are garbage for engine protection.
--Matt

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That is pretty strong to say considering Honda make the most reliable cars out there. If it was "garbage" they would not recommend it. Although partially for CAFE, their engine run very efficient and probably do not need a heavier oil. Heavier is not better, sorry. If the tolerances do not call for it, then why use it? Every engine is differnet, that is why a 456hp Porshe 911 GT2 uses Mobil 1 5w30 and recommends its' continues use. Would you go against Porsche and say "no way, I'm going to a 15w-50 with that car, 5w30 is garabage"? then why question Honda. Remember, take all the "experts" here with a grain of salt.
Also, where in the world do people have the info or credentials to say "yes use a 5w30, it's better" for the Honda. People read too much internet info and suddenly become experts. I guess I should have skipped my Engineering degree and just surf the internet for four years.. hmmmmm

[ December 20, 2002, 12:25 PM: Message edited by: dagmando ]

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by dagmando:

quote:

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Originally posted by mkosem:
Obviously, 5w20 oils are garbage for engine protection.
--Matt

---

That is pretty strong to say considering Honda make the most reliable cars out there. If it was "garbage" they would not recommend it. Although partially for CAFE, their engine run very efficient and probably do not need a heavier oil. Heavier is not better, sorry. If the tolerances do not call for it, then why use it? Every engine is differnet, that is why a 500hp Porshe 911 GTS uses Mobil 1 5w30 and recommends its' continues use. Would you go against Porsche and say "no way, I'm going to a 15w-50 with that car, 5w30 is garabage"? then why question Honda. Remember, take all the "experts" here with a grain of salt.
Also, where in the world do people have the info or credentials to say "yes use a 5w30, it's better" for the Honda. People read too much internet info and suddenly become experts. I guess I should have skipped my Engineering degree and just surf the internet for four years.. hmmmmm

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All Porsche 911s (including the fire-breathing GT2) come factory filled with Mobil 1 0w40, not 5w30. That being the case, I seriously doubt the full race GTS version would use 5w30.

 

[satterfi]

Giles

Good point. But after looking at the Japanese manual OneQuartLow posted

I wouldn't bother with 10w30. I'd just use the 10w40 stuff I put in cars and motorcycles.

mkosem

Any good grandson would buy their grandparents a few case of syn oil for Christmas every year.

 

[mkosem]

nope, not leased. that van needs to last like the nissan quest it replaced. The 93 camry has about 210k miles on her, not any big problems with that car at all. The toyota seems to be a very good car. We'll see how the honda holds up over time.

--Matt