Non Auto-Rx flushes/Flushes scare me

SirEager · Jun 13, 2006

So, I'm not a fan of flushes. I still think using HDEO, is a slower better option. Many of you are fans of Auto-RX and talk like it the only option.

So I have a 96 legacy with the 2.2 EJ22E motor with 188k. Now I got this car used but don't know its history, all I know is looks in better shape then most of the Sub 60k cars I test drove.

Now I did have a bad experice with a random flush in a 5hp briggsandstratton. I flushed the motor, changed the oil, and the motor did not want to start. Also I see posts that flushes are a bad idea the, lose junk can clog oil pathways.

Now I do know my options for a 0w30 or thinner CI-4/SL oils are quite few not since I do not live Canada. So might ready too open my eyes to flushes and other ways to keep the guts clean. What about gunk's or Amsoils flushes? Are there any other ways to clean the motor with out flushes? If your going to recomend AutoRX you better support yourself, as it 10x the price of of Amsoil and Gunk, and it sound like you guys like it a little to much.

Auto-Union · Jun 13, 2006

In extreme cases, I use some Kero. I don't think a normal High Mileage engines needs that though. ARX, some High Mileage oil is enough....a lil varnish won't hurt anything. Likely your engine is clean from the long hwy trips it took to aquire those miles.

mjpolge · Jun 13, 2006

How about a little Marvel Mystery oil? A 12 oz. bottle of the stuff should be pretty mild.

Frank · Jun 13, 2006

Auto-Rx is not similar to any product you mentioned either in chemistry-or guarantee of customers satisfaction. Especially knowing it works safely.

Rick20 · Jun 13, 2006

Even with a seemingly clean motor, ring packs can get carboned up and rings are free to function. An arx cleaning at any stage is good way to be sure your ring / wall interaction is as good as it can be. This would be true for conventional and synthetic users.

Regarding the Briggs 5 HP, I think that has only a splash type oiling system. Perhaps your motor was relying on contaminants for ring sealing. The quick flush only removed the surface, did not free up the rings. Low compression--- no start.

unDummy · Jun 14, 2006

If it runs good with 188k miles, why bother flushing it?

For that engine, I'd use the cheapest oil/filter required and change every 3k/3mo. Also, check & clean crankcase ventilation.

If you want the 'clean engine' feeling without expense, at your next several oil changes, substitute a pint of oil with Marvel Mystery oil, Rislone, or CD2 detergent.

If you want to do a
I don't know how you killed your briggsnstratton, but I doubt that it was from the flush if it was done correctly.

SirEager · Jun 14, 2006

Rick20: I do recall hearing some metal one metal from the first few pulls of the Briggs.

I don't see how "dirty ring packs" come into play. I get I still get EPA rated MPG with nearly 190K and ten years on the road. I just want to take some help cleaning the sluge out of oil pan.

I still distrust flushes and nearly all oil additives (foamy oil is bad).

Trueth be told I just rather use a thin HDEO 0w30 CI4/SL oil. But by not living in Canada we in the states have few thin HDEO options.

I'm only trying to open my eyes to flushes, as my HDEO options are limited.

For those of you that like Auto-RX, you just repeat talking points, that much blind faith in any product is bad. No one can explain why it worth $20 or why it is better.

There are other products that flush to like GUNK, Amsoil, and others. Why are these products no good? I don't know. That why I'm asking.

Beond HDEO and flushes what are my other options?

Thanks

Pablo · Jun 14, 2006

I and many folks have used Amsoil flush many times with no harm. Follow the instructions - don't DRIVE the car with flush, drain for a really long time and follow with a short OCI and you simply won't harm the engine.

OTOH Amsoil flush is exactly that. A flush. It will help flush out and drain nasty old oil. Will it intimately clean every oiled surface, every nook and cranny to shiny newness? No.

Zesty · Jun 14, 2006

I haven't used Auto-RX, or any other sort of engine oil flush. But it does make sense to me, why you would want a gentler cleansing action, as opposed to a more aggresive one. Especially on an engine with really high miles.

The way I understand it(and I'm sure someone will correct me), is autorx is not solvent-based, like many/most other flushes out there. That allows it to slowly and gently clean the engine's internals, without breaking loose big chunks or damaging your seals.

Basically, with a high-mileage engine, you run a risk with the quick, solvent-bsed flushes. Everything may turn out fine, but the danger is there. The product is cheaper because the ingredients are cheaper and more harsh.

With Auto-RX you really aren't running nearky as much of a risk, because the cleaning action is slow process. No risk of large chunks of debris coming lose and gentle on seals.

Basically I don't know which cleans better because I haven't used either, but it seems that if nothing else the Auto-RX is the safest bet.

Winston · Jun 14, 2006

This ARX bashing gets old.

quote:

So that being said, can anyone provide pictures of clean and dirty rings packs? Or if you have really good MPG (way above normal), no oil constumption how does the "ring packs dirty" play into this role?

quote:

For those of you that like Auto-RX, you just repeat talking points, that much blind faith in any product is bad. No one can explain why it worth $20 or why it is better.

Dirty rings can affect compression and oil comsumption

Have you read the patent for ARX? The cleaning abilities of the oil was verified, by tearing down dirty engines. Reassembling them. Running ARX cleaning cycles, then tear downs to confirm that the parts were cleaned. Do you have any "proof" like that from those other cheap products?

Terry Dyson was involved in the testing of ARX and has stated repeatedly that he have verified that ARX cleans rings. That info is based on testing that he verified.

Go to the ARX web site and look at the testimonials. There are repeated examples where people took compression readings before and after using ARX. The compression gains were substantial. The only way to explain the increase in compression is that the ring areas were cleaned which allowed them to function better.

Thus, my belief in the product is not based on blind faith.

I have looked and I have never seen any proof, or even any evidence that any of those other products work at all.

As far as HDEO oil as a cleaner. The most experienced people on this board have stated repeatedly that HDEO does not perform any cleaning function.

Hope that helps.

michaelc80 · Jun 14, 2006

SirEager,
I was in exactly the same boat you were a couple years ago. I had no desire to use a flush or additive of any sort.

However, I inherited an 87 Nissan Sentra that ran poorly. I was ready to part it out when I decided to try AutoRX. After all, I was planning to scrap it right? What would it hurt?

After running the recommended course of AutoRX through it it was an entirely different car. I now have used AutoRX in...7 or 8 different vehicles including a couple tractors. All with excellent results.

I have 2 Proof of Value stories at the AutoRX website. POV42 and POV52

If these two stories don't give you an idea of what AutoRX is capable of then nothing will.

IslaVistaMan · Jun 14, 2006

SirEager, for further testimony to how safe ARX is, I've used it on several motorcycles with wet clutches, and currently run maintenance doses in them as well.

Older bike clutch material is typically a type of pressed cork that is vulnerable to solvent cleaners, which is why I used ARX.

The clutches in both my bikes feel better than new. Disengagement is clean, and re-engagement is smoother than ever.

Although I've never abused a bike clutch with a friction-modified "auto" oil, my firm belief is that ARX would at least partially recondition a clutch so exposed.

The stuff works, and I'll keep using it.

mburnickas · Jun 14, 2006

winston- I am not bashing AutoRX or anything.

What gets old (and still amazes me to no end) is that anyone can say everyone has dirty rings packs and dirty engines. As a member here (forget who) stated you could drive off the lot with a new car and most here will say you should run AutoRX.

All I am saying is that most users always state we all have dirty rings blah blah ..But what most fail to do is provide the data that they indead have dirty rings pack. I would verify I need anything before I add anything.

I am using Lc20 to see what happens. I am going to try Autorx just to see. All these "calls" are based on my oil tests, MPG, oil used in intervals
(none); not saying "just add it".

Does AutoRX clean ring packs, I am sure it does and does very well. But again what most/many fail to prove is that the ring packs are even dirty to begin with.

mburnickas · Jun 14, 2006

So many times on this forum (more then I can count) the dreaded "ring packs dirty" deal pops up.

So that being said, can anyone provide pictures of clean and dirty rings packs? Or if you have really good MPG (way above normal), no oil constumption how does the "ring packs dirty" play into this role?

Strjock81 · Jun 14, 2006

Like you, just the thought of doing a non-Auto RX flush makes me *** in my pants a little.

SirEager · Jun 14, 2006

Winston,

If you supported your points your agument would better.

When invoking the Auto-Rx patent offer a link like http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-...LL&s1=6544349.PN.&OS=PN/6544349&RS=PN/6544349

The Uspto.gov is a great source.

You also invoked the name of Tary Dyson, he is extreemly well respected, but you got to provide a link for a quote, or your just trowing names. Tarry has over 3K posts that alot even for search tools.

As for sepetical peaple like me, companey websites are extreamly bisesed sources. Personal accounts much more valid, like michaelc80 ones.

JohnBrowning · Jun 15, 2006

A HDEO WILL NOT CLEAN A DIRTY ENGINE!!!!! Not yelling so much as speaking loudly. This is almost as bad as someone thinking that ATF will clean their engine crankcase up!

Auto-RX is safe and effective and is not like a solvent type flush.

Lube COntrol is also safe and effective but is not remotely like AUto-Rx.

All of your other flush's like Gunk 5 Minute,Golden Eagle Engine FLush, Amsoil Engine Flush, B-12 Chemtool, kerosine,diesel etc... are all solvents or a combination of solvents. If used properly a flush is a rather safe procedure in 98% of engines. The problem comes in when someone has a sludged up engine that needs to be manualy cleaned or if they over use flush's.

ffxfina3 · Jun 15, 2006

quote:

Originally posted by SirEager:

You also invoked the name of Tary Dyson, he is extreemly well respected, but you got to provide a link for a quote, or your just trowing names. Tarry has over 3K posts that alot even for search tools.

The search engine here is actually pretty good. You can search all the posts for comments on auto-rx, and limit those results to those made by a specific user. Here is some praise of ARX from Terry -- just two weeks ago:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004813#000019

SirEager · Jun 22, 2006

Ok, you win. I just ordered 3 treatments auto-rx.

I'm only going run it once a year in the late spring. Auto-rx does work better in warm temps, plus I only need full synict for the cold weather.

Data in the Auto-Rx Patent did most of the selling. Still I dont like poring anything in my motor without a PDS. someone stated this stuff has a cSt of 7.1 at 100C. Other then that and the info in the Patent, I have no idea how it would change how my oil behaves.

Non Auto-Rx flushes/Flushes scare me

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