new car - what oil to put in?

[kiko]

Hello to all, I have a 2004 Toyota Sienna and I am approaching 500 miles already. We're taking a trip in a few weeks and I would like to change the oil and filter prior to our trip to eliminate any debris left over from the manufacturing process. I'd like to start using Mobil 1 5w30 oil. Before joining this group I just thought Mobil 1 was a good enough oil. I now see that there are far better synthetic products out there. What other synthetic oil would you recomment? Normally I would use a Fram oil filter but seeing as how there are mixed reviews about filters, I'd like to poll the group on what filter they recommend. Also, is Toyota factory oil any good? Thanks for your input.

 

[Dominic]

I would drain and replace that factory oil with anything else on the shelf. The factory oil that I found in both my previous 99 Tacoma V6 and 02 Camry 4cyl was as thick was water (absolutely terrible feeling, not slick or anything, I have no clue what it is!!) The Mobil 1 isn't a terrible choice but I had a quieter engine running the Synpower 5W-30 in my Camry than the M1. I'm sure you can go with anything you like though and be okay.

 

[J]

Hi, Mobil 1 5w-30 is excellent, but Mobil 1 10W-30 will serve your needs better. Try Purolator PureOne filter instead of Fram. Toyota uses dino oil, and I believe Sienna has the infamous sludge generating V6. So, quality synthetic such as Mobil 1 is a must for you if you plan to keep the Sienna for a long time. Jae

 

[kiko]

Hi Jae, Thanks for replying. I'm a newbie at this so please bear with me. What do you mean by dino oil? Also, won't 10w30 be too heavy for the new engine? I am hoping that Toyota has fixed the sludge problem they are having with their older model Siennas. I was reluctant at first to get a Sienna but I said what the hey. As long as I document each and every oil change and have the vehicle serviced by a Toyota dealer then that's enough documentation. Lastly, should I go with another synthetic like the Amsoil which requires longer drain times, can I just remove and replace the oil filter without draining the pan. Sorry for these dumb questions. I'm not too mechanically inclined but I can do my own oil changes. Never had to do one thing without the other though (change filter only).

 

[Employee#08]

kiko, welcome to the board. Great van you have there. Who knows if the new 3.3L V-6 is a sludge monster. I believe you are the first on this board to have the new 2004 Sienna. If possible, do an UOA(used oil analysis) on this engine to see the trends. Do search this wonderful board for extensive information on lubricants. You have to change the oil and oil filter if you want to do a proper change. Changing out the oil filter is usually done on extended drains. This is a common practice for many users of long drains. Enjoy this board and be ready to sit for hours reading.

 

[Ray H]

quote:

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Originally posted by kiko: Hi Jae, Thanks for replying. I'm a newbie at this so please bear with me. What do you mean by dino oil? Also, won't 10w30 be too heavy for the new engine? I am hoping that Toyota has fixed the sludge problem they are having with their older model Siennas. I was reluctant at first to get a Sienna but I said what the hey. As long as I document each and every oil change and have the vehicle serviced by a Toyota dealer then that's enough documentation. Lastly, should I go with another synthetic like the Amsoil which requires longer drain times, can I just remove and replace the oil filter without draining the pan. Sorry for these dumb questions. I'm not too mechanically inclined but I can do my own oil changes. Never had to do one thing without the other though (change filter only).

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Your questions aren't dumb. "Dino" oil = dinosaur juice, AKA "conventional" petroleum derived oil vs. polymerized synthetics. Check your owner's manual. If it lists 10W-30 as a safe alternate weight, then, it's okay to use it if it meets the expected ambient temperature range. An old rule of thumb is to use the heaviest weight range that meets the anticipated temperature range. The greater the spread in weight range (i.e. 5W-30) requires a greater amount of viscosity index improver chemical additive. Hot operation tends to shear that chemical back faster. Better to have a fallback weight of 10 instead of 5 (not that it would shear all the way back to the base stock weight, of course). This applies to dino oils more than synthetics, though. Synthetic base stocks have an inherent robust viscosity index and don't require as much additional chemistry in their additive package to maintain grade. Some require none. The oil filters are mounted higher than the oil level in the sump, so you can safely remove and replace the filter without losing your fill. (You will lose a limited amount of oil from the filter as you loosen it, so put a drain pan under the filter before you start.) [ April 25, 2003, 02:02 PM: Message edited by: Ray H ]

 

[7TFord]

"Dino" meaning petroleum based oil or non-synthetic which is what most engines are to be run in on. It is a matter of opinion as to what point a new motor should be switched to a synthetic oil but it won't hurt anything if you do this oil change with a petroleum oil and switch to the synthetic product later. Take your pick as to what oil you want to use...there are many. Mobil 1 is fine and is what I used in my V6 Tacoma until I opted for a switch to their Delvac 1 5/40 just to try it. You'll have to do some research and decide which one you want to use. There are as many opinions on that as there are oils. Your manual should indicate what weight of oil to use but a 10/30 as suggested would be a better all around choice if you have no colder winter temps where you live. I don't know about the Toyota factory petroleum oil but I heard that their synthetic offering is a Mobil 1 equivalent. I would use a Toyota oil filter before a Fram but personally use Bosch standard filters on my truck. You can extend your drain intervals with most synthetics and a filter change without draining the oil can be done. I don't prescribe to this personally as my yearly miles driven affords me an oil and filter change at approx 8-10K km intervals twice yearly which is well within the abiltiy of the Delvac 1 product.

 

[csandste]

The previous gen Sienna was the most sludge prone of all Toyotas, probably because the engine gets less cooling than an automobile. If you look back through Edmunds posts you'll find quite a bit about this problem: http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/[email protected]@.eea225d/0 If I had this engine I'd buy nothing but synthetic (I normally use dino) and get the oil changed every four or five K miles. In the Edmunds forum there's an interesting series of posts from an owner who used an extended Amsoil service schedule and then complained loudly (for many months) when no one fixed his "gelled" engine. I haven't even seen the 04's in person yet, so cannot comment on whether this sludge problem has been rectified with the redesign. [ April 25, 2003, 02:14 PM: Message edited by: csandste ]

 

[davefr]

I disagree with your premise that there are "far" better synthetics than Mobil 1. If you read the posts and UOA's you'll find that Mobil 1 is an excellent product and very close to best of class in a lot of areas. Redline might be just a tad better but certainly not "far" better. Once you factor in cost and availability it's a "no brainer". You are correct that Fram filters are total garbage. Use Wix, Purolator Pure One, or OEM. If you want a "boutique" filter use Mobil 1 or K&N.

quote:

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Originally posted by kiko: Hello to all, I have a 2004 Toyota Sienna and I am approaching 500 miles already. We're taking a trip in a few weeks and I would like to change the oil and filter prior to our trip to eliminate any debris left over from the manufacturing process. I'd like to start using Mobil 1 5w30 oil. Before joining this group I just thought Mobil 1 was a good enough oil. I now see that there are far better synthetic products out there. What other synthetic oil would you recomment? Normally I would use a Fram oil filter but seeing as how there are mixed reviews about filters, I'd like to poll the group on what filter they recommend. Also, is Toyota factory oil any good? Thanks for your input.

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[thrace]

It might be better to find the cheapest toyota dealer oil change and do it there so there is proof of oil changes in case sludge occurs. Some dealers will not count an non dealer oil change as an oil change and refuse to do sludge repairs. A true synthetic should resist sludge better than dino. No one knows whether the sludge problem is truly solved. The warranty in any new car would be void if oil drain intervals are extended beyond what the owners or service manual says, even with synthetic oil. Good luck. The Sienna looks like a fine vehicle.

 

[unDummy]

I say go for the synthetic(brand is your choice). Heavier vehicles stress the engine more causing issues. Glad that Toyota is slowly phasing in the 3.3L to replace the 3.0L in their vehicles. Save your receipts and write the mileage on the back of them if you do the labor yourself. You won't have any issues with the dealer or warranty now that Toyota was spanked by a class action. For oil filter, use any name brand. I won't say which is good or bad, but I truly believe that noone needs a highend filter(especially after seeing the oil pressure drop in the filters forum). Read your owners manual(not oil bottle)concerning the maintenance interval and oil weights. You can't go wrong with 3-5k changes while under warranty.

 

[kiko]

Thanks for all your responses. I will change the oil at 500 miles to eliminate the debris and then do the regular changes at the dealer since my wife has opted to purchase 3 year's worth of oil changes (without my knowledge). This way, there will really be some form of documentation since only the dealer will do the oil change on the vehicle.

 

[williar]

No problem having the dealer do the oil changes - the Toyota filters are good, I understand. However I would take to them my fully-synthetic oil of choice, in the factory-recommended viscosity, after the rig has about 5000 miles on it, if your change intervals are longer than 5000 miles. For shorter change intervals, dino oil is OK.

 

[mikemc]

Kiko, since you have already paid for 3 years of oil changes use them. As long as they are using a quality oil that meets API SL and GF-3 specs, let them use that, it's fine. Enjoy your new vehicle.