Nearly 50% of men who have never flown or landed an airplane think they could safely land a passenger airplane

Here is a video of someone trying to do this. He didnt make it when flying manually but did when landed with autopilot. Even with autopilot he needed alot of assistance. I do think when your life is on the line some people who think they can handle pressure probably cant.


So, a guy with some pilot training tries it, with a pilot who can see what he’s doing coaching him in real time.

Not a realistic scenario - the coach is a trained pilot, has far more SA than an ATC controller who has only the radio, and this guy has some training.
 
Aaaaactually… you’re kinda off there. I review surveys at work all the time. And we typically toss out the glowing five stars - you’re perfect - and the one star - you’re the worst. Then we focus on the middle because that is where you’re going to get actual usable feedback. Because people are too emotional and cannot accurately tact how they feel versus what the reality of the situation is. Say-Do correspondence in the average person is horrible to say the least. People do not have to know and understand the operational contingencies controlling their behavior for those contingencies to still work. I could get into other things as well on the topic but it is irrelevant.

Also, I did not act as though my opinion was factual, so I don’t see where the Dunning- Kruger effect comes into play. It is my opinion and I was making jokes about myself while giving it. Clearly, I don’t take my self too seriously on the topic. [insert Poe’s law]

Moreover despite what pretentious people and academics [insert PWMDMD] think us regular uneducated bumpkins are allowed to actually have opinions on things. And not just blindly walk around completely oblivious to the world around them while appealing to a greater authority for how we should think. For instance, I’ve never made a car, but I can say a car design sucks if want without running anything by a designer first. Never been a chef but I can say a meal sucks if I want without discussing it with a classically chef beforehand.

I’m sorry if this is related to your profession, which is why my comments struck a nerve. But don’t blame me because you picked a pseudoscience to focus your studies on :)
Where did I ever comment on education level or academics? Freudian slip?

FWIW…I have don’t study surveys for a living but have taken enough peripheral course work in it to know what and how it operates.
 
I have close to 1.6K hours in mostly Piper singles with some other fun stuff (T6, Aeronca Champ, Ercoupe...), a bit of bizjet jump seat time as well as some unofficial right seat time.

As a favor, I was offered a sim ride with a check pilot by one of the major airlines, a 737. I was pondering a career change, but that is another story.

Even with an experienced co pilot and a fair amount of individual prep, my first landing would have been scrape marks probably leading to a fireball...on the runway centerline at least, I was able to do that. Technically, it was my second touchdown as the first was the tremendous bounce that led to the end.

For me it wasn't the complexity, it was the sight picture, speed and timing, and I did get better.

I wouldn't put the chances at 0% as I suppose it could be done given the perfect alignment of variables and luck, but I wouldn't put it above 1% or so...
 
Aaaaactually… you’re kinda off there. I review surveys at work all the time. And we typically toss out the glowing five stars - you’re perfect - and the one star - you’re the worst. Then we focus on the middle because that is where you’re going to get actual usable feedback. Because people are too emotional and cannot accurately tact how they feel versus what the reality of the situation is. Say-Do correspondence in the average person is horrible to say the least. People do not have to know and understand the operational contingencies controlling their behavior for those contingencies to still work. I could get into other things as well on the topic but it is irrelevant.

Also, I did not act as though my opinion was factual, so I don’t see where the Dunning- Kruger effect comes into play. It is my opinion and I was making jokes about myself while giving it. Clearly, I don’t take my self too seriously on the topic. [insert Poe’s law]

Moreover despite what pretentious people and academics [insert PWMDMD] think us regular uneducated bumpkins are allowed to actually have opinions on things. And not just blindly walk around completely oblivious to the world around them while appealing to a greater authority for how we should think. For instance, I’ve never made a car, but I can say a car design sucks if want without running anything by a designer first. Never been a chef but I can say a meal sucks if I want without discussing it with a classically chef beforehand.

I’m sorry if this is related to your profession, which is why my comments struck a nerve. But don’t blame me because you picked a pseudoscience to focus your studies on :)
Also, “First I don't trust survey data because I don’t take surveys.”, but you use those “worthless” surveys at work? Lastly, your chef comment - no it’s like you saying all chefs suck. Yes, some surveys are worthless but not all. I’m objecting to you categorically dismissing all of them. Each one needs to be evaluated based on its merits.

Sounds rewarding…
 
I find this to be stunning that anyone who has never flown or landed an airplane, thinks they have ANY chance of landing a passenger airplane. The chance is 0%, nobody from the survey group could possibly do it, ever, but 50% of the men think they can.... Just wow.

How can this possibly be?

Guys also think they could be competitive at indy or daytona.

Not a chance.

I couldn't do it.

I had a gliders license at 14
I have over 2K right/back seat hours in 172, 210, Mooney, 421, lanceair 4, bonanza, Astar B2, and a P51D trainer.
I have 10 backseat hours in a l39 albatross trainer. (guy that owned this plane was basically a criminal)
I have approx 30 minutes in the backseat of trainer versions of mig25 & mig 29 from a "Mig Vacation" I took in 89.
 
Last edited:
Only 50%? I would've thought it was higher. :LOL:

I've never flown a plane by myself, only with an instructor, so I won't pretend I know how to land anything. If I'm honest the plane would probably go into the ground quicker with me behind the controls.

With that said, it does seem like there are some threads started where their only intent is to spark arguments, not necessarily constructive discussion.
 
Yep. Got to spend some time in Montreal doing the acceptance work. Great company. Great city.

CAE was our best source of engineers.

First and second wife are French Canadian women from Montreal - they got me.
 
Last edited:
Forget the scenario of an ATC talking someone down . They aren't Pilots . My late father in law was a Tower Chief and had ZERO experience flying any type of aircraft .
 
In 1998, we bought two new 747-400 simulators. Because we bought two at the same time, we got a deal on them.

It was only $50 million for the pair.

Which doesn’t include things like the 4’ (yes, foot) thick concrete pad, 440v power, and building to house it.

The building in which they were installed could fit 10 full motion simulators. It cost $75 million.
I do remember the building our simulators were in, they were as impressive as the sims themselves. The structure, the security, how clean they kept it, how strict they were about who could and couldnt not be in there, etc.

If people not in the field had any idea about how much money is spent keeping pilots trained and proficient, how much engines cost, the cost of even the most basic of repairs on the airframes, the amount of engineering, the MONEY.... they'd barf. That $250 flight from Cincinnati to Vegas is a bargain. Honestly I dont know how airlines make a profit and I've been in this business for 20 years. I flew back from Santiago to Atlanta a few years ago on a nearly empty 767-3, probably 50 of us on that plane on a nine hour flight. I drank enough in free wine that Delta's stock probably fell from that alone.
 
Also, “First I don't trust survey data because I don’t take surveys.”, but you use those “worthless” surveys at work? Lastly, your chef comment - no it’s like you saying all chefs suck. Yes, some surveys are worthless but not all. I’m objecting to you categorically dismissing all of them. Each one needs to be evaluated based on its merits.

Sounds rewarding…
Well, I didn’t say I enjoy it. I have a great job but that is one of those ancillary things I have to contend with whether I like it or not.

We are talking about people thinking they can land a plane with zero training I wouldn’t called is categorically a worthwhile survey. It is a fun topic to discuss though. This is not like a double blind study taking data to figuring out of the medicine has side effects and can be released to the market.
 
I find this to be stunning that anyone who has never flown or landed an airplane, thinks they have ANY chance of landing a passenger airplane. The chance is 0%, nobody from the survey group could possibly do it, ever, but 50% of the men think they can.... Just wow.

How can this possibly be?
No, it’s true.

Read how the male flight attendant ( but he had some flight training experience ) was able to land a B737.

 
Life is not a movie. I spent half of my career procuring flight simulators for the Navy/Marine Corps and "flew" EA-6B simulators. With an instructor, I only crashed half the time. That's not real life though, when the screen goes red with cracked windshield, they hit reset and you're still alive ;).
My former work partner, a retired MC Colonel, has over 10k hours. The planes I know he flew were A-6s, EA-6Bs, C-2, C-12 and carrier landed the first two. He wanted to fly cargo for a major carrier. Even he, after hours of studying the manuals, had difficulty landing the sim for whatever 7XX airplane he was getting sim time in. If he had to practice that much (and he landed damaged A-6s, one with a big hole in the wing and one without it's left tail surface) what chance do us inexperienced, untrained amateurs have?
But daydreams are fun.
 
Last edited:
No, it’s true.

Read how the male flight attendant ( but he had some flight training experience ) was able to land a B737.

For those who didn't bother to read the article, or know about this flight, let me summarize -

Both pilots were incapacitated.

The flight attendant, who had flight training, tried to fly the airplane.

All 121 people on board were killed when the Boeing 737-300 slammed into a hillside.
 
Can I land it? Yes. Why? Because between the two choices of stay in my seat and have a zero in a million chance of surviving when it ultimately crashes or attempt to land it and have a one in a million chance of surviving I'm going with the one in a million. Probably many of those who said yes made the same choice/decision in answering. And what was the Leonardo movie doing multiple major jobs like this very thing? Based on a true story. So one in a million it is.
 
I'm done with this thread and I refuse to tolerate two staff members speaking to me with that tone.

I've had enough arguments with *****ead pilots who think their jobs are the hardest in the world. Since I can't put either of you on ignore or put a stop to the notifications - leave me out of it moving forward.
I hear what you are saying.

It's NOT the hardest job in the world ( but landing at night on a carrier would be IMHO ) but, like other complex jobs, it is if no experience.

There are lots of other complex jobs that are just as hard and that I could never do without training.

I would want to try landing a fighter on a carrier, at night, with no moon, if the guy up front passed out.

I couldn't do it.

Please do not feel pilots are talking down to you, at least me.
 
Last edited:
Can I land it? Yes. Why? Because between the two choices of stay in my seat and have a zero in a million chance of surviving when it ultimately crashes or attempt to land it and have a one in a million chance of surviving I'm going with the one in a million. Probably many of those who said yes made the same choice/decision in answering. And what was the Leonardo movie doing multiple major jobs like this very thing? Based on a true story. So one in a million it is.
That's not a yes, that's a one in a million chance, which isn't really a chance.

dumb-and-dumber-jimcarrey.gif
 
Back
Top