Has anyone ever calculated how much oil would be saved nationwide if oil changes went away from 3ooo to 5000?
national savings on 5k vs 3k oil changes
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Originally Posted By: edwardh1
Has anyone ever calculated how much oil would be saved nationwide if oil changes went away from 3ooo to 5000?
I'm sure someone in an economics department somewhere has. But then they went on to discuss how that would negatively impact profits of oil companies, causing a rise in oil and gas prices due to "lost revenue" blah blah blah or some other
type of statements.
Has anyone ever calculated how much oil would be saved nationwide if oil changes went away from 3ooo to 5000?
I'm sure someone in an economics department somewhere has. But then they went on to discuss how that would negatively impact profits of oil companies, causing a rise in oil and gas prices due to "lost revenue" blah blah blah or some other
I've always wondered about the overall carbon throughput.
Overall,How much carbon is from fixing up a 1978 F-150 and driving it 3,000 miles a year.
Compared to the amount of carbon from the manufacture and transport of all the batteries, plastics, engine and electrical components of a new hybrid vehicle?
Sure I burn more gas from the 1978 F-150, but overall, I'm not so sure. Many of the components of a Hybrid are sourced from all over the planet. And the Ni-Cad batteries or Lithium are from mines that completely destroy the surrounding environment.
Just a thought.
Exact numbers are really hard to come by for a bunch of this stuff.
Overall,How much carbon is from fixing up a 1978 F-150 and driving it 3,000 miles a year.
Compared to the amount of carbon from the manufacture and transport of all the batteries, plastics, engine and electrical components of a new hybrid vehicle?
Sure I burn more gas from the 1978 F-150, but overall, I'm not so sure. Many of the components of a Hybrid are sourced from all over the planet. And the Ni-Cad batteries or Lithium are from mines that completely destroy the surrounding environment.
Just a thought.
Exact numbers are really hard to come by for a bunch of this stuff.
I'm going to say about 66.67%
Kuato said:edwardh1 said:I'm sure someone in an economics department somewhere has. But then they went on to discuss how that would negatively impact profits of oil companies, causing a rise in oil and gas prices due to "lost revenue" blah blah blah or some othertype of statements.
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
Originally Posted By: teddyboy
Originally Posted By: Kuato
I'm sure someone in an economics department somewhere has. But then they went on to discuss how that would negatively impact profits of oil companies, causing a rise in oil and gas prices due to "lost revenue" blah blah blah or some other
type of statements.
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
teddyboy thanks for the perspective; I have a friend (PhD Econ) that would say what you said plus what I said and then continue to go in wider and wider circles of discussion until I got him changed to another subject.
Originally Posted By: Kuato
I'm sure someone in an economics department somewhere has. But then they went on to discuss how that would negatively impact profits of oil companies, causing a rise in oil and gas prices due to "lost revenue" blah blah blah or some other
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
teddyboy thanks for the perspective; I have a friend (PhD Econ) that would say what you said plus what I said and then continue to go in wider and wider circles of discussion until I got him changed to another subject.
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Originally Posted By: Rand
what about vehicles that get driven 2000miles or less a year?
Then they don't necessarily change their oil every year.
what about vehicles that get driven 2000miles or less a year?
Then they don't necessarily change their oil every year.
Originally Posted By: teddyboy
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
The theory goes that gas/oil companies NEED large profits, in order to spend on research & development of new tools & technologies that extract petroleum from deeper and deeper into the surface of the earth. Or so the theory goes....
So I'm not so sure if supply/demand is the only factor at play here.
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
The theory goes that gas/oil companies NEED large profits, in order to spend on research & development of new tools & technologies that extract petroleum from deeper and deeper into the surface of the earth. Or so the theory goes....
So I'm not so sure if supply/demand is the only factor at play here.
Originally Posted By: grndslm
Originally Posted By: teddyboy
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
The theory goes that gas/oil companies NEED large profits, in order to spend on research & development of new tools & technologies that extract petroleum from deeper and deeper into the surface of the earth. Or so the theory goes....
So I'm not so sure if supply/demand is the only factor at play here.
While that may play a small factor and almost all of us have dealt with this with the power companies raising rates because newer homes are so much more efficient, we have a choice of oil companies, whereas you are stuck with one power company. Since competition exists it shouldn't allow the prices to adjust upwards simply because they are taking in less money.
Originally Posted By: teddyboy
I am an economist and have never seen an estimate of the savings. However, I can assure you that economists would not predict a rise in the price of oil or gasoline. Going from 3K to 5K oil changes would reduce the demand for oil, which in turn, should reduce the price of crude, refined oil and gasoline. It's pretty elementary supply and demand analysis.
The theory goes that gas/oil companies NEED large profits, in order to spend on research & development of new tools & technologies that extract petroleum from deeper and deeper into the surface of the earth. Or so the theory goes....
So I'm not so sure if supply/demand is the only factor at play here.
While that may play a small factor and almost all of us have dealt with this with the power companies raising rates because newer homes are so much more efficient, we have a choice of oil companies, whereas you are stuck with one power company. Since competition exists it shouldn't allow the prices to adjust upwards simply because they are taking in less money.
Originally Posted By: grndslm
The theory goes that gas/oil companies NEED large profits, in order to spend on research & development of new tools & technologies that extract petroleum from deeper and deeper into the surface of the earth. Or so the theory goes....
So I'm not so sure if supply/demand is the only factor at play here.
The evidence is pretty compelling that when demand declines, prices fall. That certainly was the case during the so called Asian Flu during the 90s and also during the most recent recession. Why do you think gas prices fell to $1.75 per gallon in December 2008? Companies needing a particular profit or whatever is not the basis for violating the laws of supply and demand. The exploration and drilling costs that you cite do factor into the supply curve, but those factors are part of the longer run trend. You need to watch Father Guido Sarducci.
The theory goes that gas/oil companies NEED large profits, in order to spend on research & development of new tools & technologies that extract petroleum from deeper and deeper into the surface of the earth. Or so the theory goes....
So I'm not so sure if supply/demand is the only factor at play here.
The evidence is pretty compelling that when demand declines, prices fall. That certainly was the case during the so called Asian Flu during the 90s and also during the most recent recession. Why do you think gas prices fell to $1.75 per gallon in December 2008? Companies needing a particular profit or whatever is not the basis for violating the laws of supply and demand. The exploration and drilling costs that you cite do factor into the supply curve, but those factors are part of the longer run trend. You need to watch Father Guido Sarducci.
the discussion did widen. like in animal house movie where the trial defense said well if its the fraternity is at fault, isint then the whole fraternity system at fault and also the whole school, then also the whole society etc etc
Originally Posted By: edwardh1
the discussion did widen. like in animal house movie where the trial defense said well if its the fraternity is at fault, isint then the whole fraternity system at fault and also the whole school, then also the whole society etc etc
"You can do what you want to us, but we're not going to sit here and listen to you bad mouth the United States of America." Best scene in a movie of great scenes!
the discussion did widen. like in animal house movie where the trial defense said well if its the fraternity is at fault, isint then the whole fraternity system at fault and also the whole school, then also the whole society etc etc
"You can do what you want to us, but we're not going to sit here and listen to you bad mouth the United States of America." Best scene in a movie of great scenes!
I only know of 1 person who does 3k oil changes. Everyone else that I know does 7-10k, either intentionally or inadvertently.
Originally Posted By: surfstar
I'm going to say about 66.67%
What math is that???
We're not extending from 3K to 9K mi, would more like 40%... Of course make up oil would be a factor, but most engines aren't going to need more than a quart in 5K...
I'm going to say about 66.67%
What math is that???
We're not extending from 3K to 9K mi, would more like 40%... Of course make up oil would be a factor, but most engines aren't going to need more than a quart in 5K...
Originally Posted By: SuperDave456
I've always wondered about the overall carbon throughput.
Overall,How much carbon is from fixing up a 1978 F-150 and driving it 3,000 miles a year.
Compared to the amount of carbon from the manufacture and transport of all the batteries, plastics, engine and electrical components of a new hybrid vehicle?
Sure I burn more gas from the 1978 F-150, but overall, I'm not so sure. Many of the components of a Hybrid are sourced from all over the planet. And the Ni-Cad batteries or Lithium are from mines that completely destroy the surrounding environment.
Just a thought.
Exact numbers are really hard to come by for a bunch of this stuff.
Hot topic in Germany at the moment and I think the hybrids are not going to win the go green game or in economic terms. The initial price is too high, the batteries are too expensive to replace, BUT the big looser is that a high tech turbo diesel can produce nearly as good an mpg as a petrol hybrid and are not much worse than the few diesel hybrids available.
In old car terms, just see if you can find a good diesel Volvo and keep it until the main bearings fail. Safe, cheap and very good mpg figures. Might be good for 500K miles.
I only know one person with a petrol car, no one with a hybrid, but a bunch with older diesels that do mostly 20K km OCI's.
I've always wondered about the overall carbon throughput.
Overall,How much carbon is from fixing up a 1978 F-150 and driving it 3,000 miles a year.
Compared to the amount of carbon from the manufacture and transport of all the batteries, plastics, engine and electrical components of a new hybrid vehicle?
Sure I burn more gas from the 1978 F-150, but overall, I'm not so sure. Many of the components of a Hybrid are sourced from all over the planet. And the Ni-Cad batteries or Lithium are from mines that completely destroy the surrounding environment.
Just a thought.
Exact numbers are really hard to come by for a bunch of this stuff.
Hot topic in Germany at the moment and I think the hybrids are not going to win the go green game or in economic terms. The initial price is too high, the batteries are too expensive to replace, BUT the big looser is that a high tech turbo diesel can produce nearly as good an mpg as a petrol hybrid and are not much worse than the few diesel hybrids available.
In old car terms, just see if you can find a good diesel Volvo and keep it until the main bearings fail. Safe, cheap and very good mpg figures. Might be good for 500K miles.
I only know one person with a petrol car, no one with a hybrid, but a bunch with older diesels that do mostly 20K km OCI's.
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Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: surfstar
I'm going to say about 66.67%
What math is that???
We're not extending from 3K to 9K mi, would more like 40%... Of course make up oil would be a factor, but most engines aren't going to need more than a quart in 5K...
You went the wrong direction with your math. 5k-3k=2k then 2k/3k=66.67% increase.
Originally Posted By: surfstar
I'm going to say about 66.67%
What math is that???
We're not extending from 3K to 9K mi, would more like 40%... Of course make up oil would be a factor, but most engines aren't going to need more than a quart in 5K...
You went the wrong direction with your math. 5k-3k=2k then 2k/3k=66.67% increase.
Originally Posted By: threeputtpar
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: surfstar
I'm going to say about 66.67%
What math is that???
We're not extending from 3K to 9K mi, would more like 40%... Of course make up oil would be a factor, but most engines aren't going to need more than a quart in 5K...
You went the wrong direction with your math. 5k-3k=2k then 2k/3k=66.67% increase.
Or put another way; 5000 is 66.67% more than 3000.
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: surfstar
I'm going to say about 66.67%
What math is that???
We're not extending from 3K to 9K mi, would more like 40%... Of course make up oil would be a factor, but most engines aren't going to need more than a quart in 5K...
You went the wrong direction with your math. 5k-3k=2k then 2k/3k=66.67% increase.
Or put another way; 5000 is 66.67% more than 3000.
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