My Idea to Buy a 2023 Highlander Hybrid Just Met Market Reality

[edyvw]

So several things with Toyota:
1. It seems they are hit hardest with supply chain issues. This year, for example, they made fewer hybrids than last. But, demand is high for them, and generally, dealers mark them up unless there is big local competition. I initially ordered new SIenna, and in Colorado Springs, dealers want $5,000 above MSRP, in Denver, they don't (which is an hour north).
2. HL is small! It was always a small SUV compared to the competition. New Honda Pilot is out, and it might be the biggest SUV in this category. So, I am waiting to see it in person. I am also waiting for the new Grand Highlander to see. According to Toyota, it is a clean sheet design, not just stretched current HL. So, if you have the luxury of waiting as I do, I would do that.
If I do not like both, going VW Atlas.

 

[UG_Passat]

I stopped by a local Toyota Stealer yesterday to actually sit in a Highlander. I am (was) interested in selling off my Santa Fe and Altima and settling for maintaining two rides (‘19 Outback), not three.

At 6’3” headroom is often an issue for me with sunroof equipped cars. Even with the driver’s seat bottomed out.

The HL had acceptable but not great headroom up front.

The downside was sitting in the rear captain chairs. For some reason Toyota lowered the headliner in that area such that there is headroom directly above each rear seat, but it is noticeably lower directly in front of the seats and in between the seats.

If you’re tall, looking forward you end up seeing the lower half of the windshield and the upper one third is all headliner.

Does anyone know if the Platinum trim with the panoramic sunroof has the same “droopy” headliner in the rear seat area? The stealer only had a non-hybrid V6 Limited on the lot though I figured the interior would be the same.

Not that it really matters as this is the current auto dealer extortion racket here in the WKRP area:

STEALERSHIP details:

The Stealer takes whatever comes in from Toyota, though it’s limited.
He automatically charges a non-negotiable $5,000 gouge for all hybrid vehicles regardless if it’s a car or SUV.

To rub salt into the wound, he adds a non-negotiable fee of $1,295 for “paint and upholstery protection!”

And not only is that protection fee on new vehicles, he puts the fee on all used vehicles!!

The salesman said I was the only buyer who had an issue with the additional markup and protection package. He claimed all of his hybrid SUVs and cars are sold before they even arrive on the stealership lot, with everyone paying the current “market pricing.”

And I believe him.

Though as long as there are morons willing to bend over the sales desk to grab a key to a new car, finding a new ride at or below MSRP will be a major challenge.

Platinum rear seat has glass where the plebeian sunroof would slide into, so there is no headbutting of the headliner in the second row. The 2nd row HVAC vents are on the side, like the third row.

 

[UG_Passat]

So several things with Toyota:
1. It seems they are hit hardest with supply chain issues. This year, for example, they made fewer hybrids than last. But, demand is high for them, and generally, dealers mark them up unless there is big local competition. I initially ordered new SIenna, and in Colorado Springs, dealers want $5,000 above MSRP, in Denver, they don't (which is an hour north).
2. HL is small! It was always a small SUV compared to the competition. New Honda Pilot is out, and it might be the biggest SUV in this category. So, I am waiting to see it in person. I am also waiting for the new Grand Highlander to see. According to Toyota, it is a clean sheet design, not just stretched current HL. So, if you have the luxury of waiting as I do, I would do that.
If I do not like both, going VW Atlas.

You should be used to a small SUV compared to the competition... you have a 2011 Tiguan, which is small compared to the competition.

 

[97prizm]

It will be interesting to see if this continues with the large number of automotive repossessions that the market is starting to see.

 

[CKN]

I stopped by a local Toyota Stealer yesterday to actually sit in a Highlander. I am (was) interested in selling off my Santa Fe and Altima and settling for maintaining two rides (‘19 Outback), not three.

At 6’3” headroom is often an issue for me with sunroof equipped cars. Even with the driver’s seat bottomed out.

The HL had acceptable but not great headroom up front.

The downside was sitting in the rear captain chairs. For some reason Toyota lowered the headliner in that area such that there is headroom directly above each rear seat, but it is noticeably lower directly in front of the seats and in between the seats.

If you’re tall, looking forward you end up seeing the lower half of the windshield and the upper one third is all headliner.

Does anyone know if the Platinum trim with the panoramic sunroof has the same “droopy” headliner in the rear seat area? The stealer only had a non-hybrid V6 Limited on the lot though I figured the interior would be the same.

Not that it really matters as this is the current auto dealer extortion racket here in the WKRP area:

STEALERSHIP details:

The Stealer takes whatever comes in from Toyota, though it’s limited.
He automatically charges a non-negotiable $5,000 gouge for all hybrid vehicles regardless if it’s a car or SUV.

To rub salt into the wound, he adds a non-negotiable fee of $1,295 for “paint and upholstery protection!”

And not only is that protection fee on new vehicles, he puts the fee on all used vehicles!!

The salesman said I was the only buyer who had an issue with the additional markup and protection package. He claimed all of his hybrid SUVs and cars are sold before they even arrive on the stealership lot, with everyone paying the current “market pricing.”

And I believe him.

Though as long as there are morons willing to bend over the sales desk to grab a key to a new car, finding a new ride at or below MSRP will be a major challenge.

I will probably be looking at a Hybrid for my wife's next car-and the Highlander will be on the list. However-we probably won't be in the market for another couple of years. I am assuming it's easier to buy a non-hybrid Highlander. Do the math. How many miles on your going to drive and what is the mpg difference and also the price difference on the two vehicles? How long would you have to keep it to recoup the extra cost on the Hybrid? Is it worth paying the higher price on the Hybrid verses just the "gas only" motor?

 

[edyvw]

You should be used to a small SUV compared to the competition... you have a 2011 Tiguan, which is small compared to the competition.

What that has to do with the fact that HL is the smallest SUV in its category?
We use Tiguan around town etc. Not as a family hauler.
But, insecurity....

 

[CKN]

Car sales guys say a lot of things.

See how they feel about it if it's still sitting on the lot on the 31st at midnight....

If you really want the car get on auto trader and start calling people that have one and be willing to jump on a plane flight.

That hasn't worked for the last three years on high demand vehicles......

 

[WylieCoyote]

Problem is, you can threaten to buy out of town, but they don't care. They're having no trouble selling everything that comes into the lot on a truck. It's all sold when it arrives. Same goes for their Korean brethren

I'm hoping someday the tables turn and they're begging for customers and dealing again. Right now, ain't nothing new hitting in my driveway in the foreseeable future.

 

[IndyIan]

Also I guess if you start crunching numbers, $8k in markups nullifies any hybrid fuel economy advantages for quite a few years. I suppose resale of non-hybrid SUV's is probably going to get worse in the future until the vehicle gets really old, then gas might be worth more for reliability/cost of repair?
At least you can run what you've got until prices stabilize.

 

[Vil_Riker]

Problem is, you can threaten to buy out of town, but they don't care. They're having no trouble selling everything that comes into the lot on a truck. It's all sold when it arrives. Same goes for their Korean brethren

I'm hoping someday the tables turn and they're begging for customers and dealing again. Right now, ain't nothing new hitting in my driveway in the foreseeable future.

They will be - No car for you!

 

[edyvw]

Problem is, you can threaten to buy out of town, but they don't care. They're having no trouble selling everything that comes into the lot on a truck. It's all sold when it arrives. Same goes for their Korean brethren

I'm hoping someday the tables turn and they're begging for customers and dealing again. Right now, ain't nothing new hitting in my driveway in the foreseeable future.

That is what is really bonkers. An hour’s from here dealers don’t mark up. Here? $5,000. And apparently people are willing to pay it over driving an hour up north.
Ridiculous.

 

[miden851]

id look for a bare and bones model, and look for it nationwide

not a long ago, our member got a brand new model, the basic one for $42K OTD

she got it from TX though

i'd say she scored the deal!

 

[UG_Passat]

What that has to do with the fact that HL is the smallest SUV in its category?
We use Tiguan around town etc. Not as a family hauler.
But, insecurity....

And so was the Tiguan.

The atlas would be equivalent to maneuvering a Sienna. The Atlas is actually longer than your Sienna, with less space inside.

 

[dkryan]

Platinum rear seat has glass where the plebeian sunroof would slide into, so there is no headbutting of the headliner in the second row. The 2nd row HVAC vents are on the side, like the third row.

Thanks for the reply.

You've seen the Platinum in person or is that from a website photo?

I suspected the funky headliner shape of the non-Platinum models was to allow for storage of the sunroof when open.

And the HVAC vent overhead and in front of each rear passenger seat was double funky.

 

[dkryan]

Thanks for the replies thus far!

I WANT a Highlander Platinum but I certainly don't NEED that ride.

That gives me the ability to be patient and wait for the exterior and interior color and model I want. At MSRP or less.

I'm a little stymied regarding the demand for hybrids. 87 octane gasoline is currently averaging $2.89 in this area, down from $4.79 during the pandemic.

We had a 2005 gas Highlander for fifteen years. The hybrid model back then was noticeably higher. The payback was eight year based on then current gas prices.

However, I'm fairly set on the Highlander as I will be getting rid of the great gas mileage Altima and the utility of the Santa Fe.

The Highlander will give me both without the headache and lack of range of an EV.

Some of you commented on the size of the Highlander but I found the interior room generous. With the driver's seat set for my 6'3" frame, I found the rear seat legroom to be quite good.

We don't have kids so whether the third row is only suitable for an Oompa Loompa is of no consequence to me.

I made a brief visit to CarGurus and Autotrader. Used hybrid Highlanders for 2020-2022 with 30-50k miles are selling for some stupid numbers.

Again, patience young Pad-a-won.
It'll happen when it's supposed to.

Merry Christmas to all of you and your families.

 

[edyvw]

And so was the Tiguan.

The atlas would be equivalent to maneuvering a Sienna. The Atlas is actually longer than your Sienna, with less space inside.

Ok. And, what all that has to have with topic and what I said?
I bet you can vent off somewhere else.

 

[andrew_j]

Don’t believe them. My sister in law picked up a RAV Prime obviously hybrid for MSRP on a call list for a cancel which is common.

 

[edyvw]

Thanks for the replies thus far!

I WANT a Highlander Platinum but I certainly don't NEED that ride.

That gives me the ability to be patient and wait for the exterior and interior color and model I want. At MSRP or less.

I'm a little stymied regarding the demand for hybrids. 87 octane gasoline is currently averaging $2.89 in this area, down from $4.79 during the pandemic.

We had a 2005 gas Highlander for fifteen years. The hybrid model back then was noticeably higher. The payback was eight year based on then current gas prices.

However, I'm fairly set on the Highlander as I will be getting rid of the great gas mileage Altima and the utility of the Santa Fe.

The Highlander will give me both without the headache and lack of range of an EV.

Some of you commented on the size of the Highlander but I found the interior room generous. With the driver's seat set for my 6'3" frame, I found the rear seat legroom to be quite good.

We don't have kids so whether the third row is only suitable for an Oompa Loompa is of no consequence to me.

I made a brief visit to CarGurus and Autotrader. Used hybrid Highlanders for 2020-2022 with 30-50k miles are selling for some stupid numbers.

Again, patience young Pad-a-won.
It'll happen when it's supposed to.

Merry Christmas to all of you and your families.

If you are set, call dealerships in Cleveland or Dayton area. I know out of state sales on new vehicles is stopped by Toyota and Honda. Maybe some dealers don’t charge over MSRP there.

 

[bilibako2]

The Toyota Corolla hybrid LE was 35k out the door and RAV4 LE AWD Hybrid was 45k out the door.Not to buy at these time.Put in an order of Mazda CX-30 sport AWD for 29,200 out the door with 1k down it's been 3 months still waiting,salesman did call a month ago that a higher version one in the dealer if I add 3k more I can have it.Told him I will wait for the original order.The bottom line none of my order is coming I think.

 

[SC Maintenance]

I used to spend some time on the Toyota boards, and some dealers mark up, and some don't. It depends to some degree on the local competition - if there are competing dealers or if all the Toyota dealers are owned by the same idiot, or somewhat on allocation which can vary by region and dealer. If that is the vehicle you want, shop around.

Toyota used to allocate based not only by dealer but sales region. I don't know if they do still but these used to be their regions a decade ago. Try a dealer outside your region - see what you find.

• Boston Office (ME, NH, VT, MA, RI) 508-339-5701
• New York (NY, NJ, CT) 973-575-7600
• Central Atlantic (PA, VA, WV, MD, DE) 410-760-1500
• Southeast Region (NC, SC, AL, GA, FL) 954-429-2000
• Cincinnati Region (MI, OH, KY, TN) 513-745-7500
• Chicago Region (MN, WI, IL, IN) 630-907-0150
• Kansas City Region (ND, SD, NE, KS, IA, M0) 816-891-1000
• Gulf States Region (OK, TX, MS, LA, AR) 713-580-3300
• Portland Region (AK, WA, OR, ID, MT) 503-493-4900
• Denver Region (WY, CO, UT, NM, AZ, NV) 303-799-6776
• San Francisco Region (Northern CA) 925-830-8300
• LA Region (Southern CA) 949-727-2700